Remember when Genn Greymane didn't watch the Horde cinematic for the Broken Shore?

[Makorus]

People taking the Prologue of the novel to heart have to consider that it's the prologue.

There's a reason they released it publically, and honestly, I think they intended it to be a bit misleading.

I say the novel prologue is a big ruse, and while we know it is Sylvanas burning Teldrassil with Sargeras' sword thanks to the leaker, I doubt she did it for an "evil" reason.

[mysticx]

Ya sure, but there is absolutely no good reason he's dragging everyone else into his vendetta with him. It's hilarious watching people try to justify it tho.

I didn’t mention him dragging everybody else into it (Although all those others have some part in it too, Genn isn’t “high king”, Anduin sent a known loose cannon like Genn on that Stormheim mission for instance), just that Genn personally holding a grudge against Sylvanas isn’t such an overreaction as some people paint it to be.

[Shakou]

People taking the Prologue of the novel to heart have to consider that it's the prologue.

There's a reason they released it publically, and honestly, I think they intended it to be a bit misleading.

I say the novel prologue is a big ruse, and while we know it is Sylvanas burning Teldrassil with Sargeras' sword thanks to the leaker, I doubt she did it for an "evil" reason.

And then we have people like this guy, who doesn't even realize that the "leaker" (warneverchanges) never said this happens. He himself was speculating.

No offense really but y'all crop up in every thread in here and spread flat out baseless speculation as if it were a fact. And it needs to stop.

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I didn’t mention him dragging everybody else into it (Although all those others have some part in it too, Genn isn’t “high king”, Anduin sent a known loose cannon like Genn on that Stormheim mission for instance), just that Genn personally holding a grudge against Sylvanas isn’t such an overreaction as some people paint it to be.

Fair enough, but the whole reason it was brought up here just to be clear is precisely because his lust for vengeance apparently leads to full out war.

[cuafpr]

I've seen both and the horde ran without providing flanking cover for the alliance to retreat as well. They basically abandoned their allies and said oh well we are trouble lets run away. Not even signal saying we have to retreat, just poof.

[De Lupe]

Saying she murdered his son is a bit... eh...

She tried to kill him and he jumped in front of her arrow. Can't really say she murdered him.

She took his king.
She took his kingdom.
She took his son.

Genn has every right in the world to want the Banshee dead and to seize any opportunity he can to put her head on a pike.

- Horde player.

[Shakou]

She took his king.
She took his kingdom.
She took his son.

Genn has every right in the world to want the Banshee dead and to seize any opportunity he can to put her head on a pike.

- Horde player.

Bro it's got nothing to do with what faction you are on, to say this is a reason for Genn to spark a war just because of his lust for vengeance is totally insane.

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I've seen both and the horde ran without providing flanking cover for the alliance to retreat as well. They basically abandoned their allies and said oh well we are trouble lets run away. Not even signal saying we have to retreat, just poof.

This is not true.

The Horde sounded horns signaling their retreat and they didn't provide flanking cover because they were flanked.

Plus the Rogue Campaign goes even further into it and explains that the whole attack on Broken Shore was based on bad Alliance Intel anyways. Like the Legion could have came in at any moment and just killed everyone but then we wouldn't have the dramatic effect of watching Tirion burn to death and so on.

[De Lupe]

Bro it's got nothing to do with what faction you are on, to say this is reason for Genn to spark a war just because of his lust for vengeance is totally insane.

Never said it was a good reason. Just a valid one.

His love turned to grief and his grief became blind rage. It will only ever be sated by Sylv's death...or his. (Personally, I'd rather keep Genn...but I don't see Blizzard dropping Sylv any time soon.)

[valky94]

In the Broken Shores scenario, after Fordring's "death", Alliance and Hord take separated paths, and Sylvanas says to Varian that she will secure the sky for him and push the demons back.
In the cinematic, just before she sounds retreat, Varian says that Sylvanas will clear the sky from the fel bats, I guess in order to allow Meccatorque to use the Flying Ship.
When Sylvanas calls for retreat, he looks deceived, but right after that, he sees that Demons invaded the peak.
He understood then called the Alliance retreat.

Then Varian knew that Sylvanas didn't have the choice and his first thought (betrayal) heavily enforced by Genn (by the way) wasted time to make a safe retreat.

If Alliance was a little bit more confident towards the Hord, Varian's death would not happened.

just waiting for genn's story to be finaly over, cant stand him, since cata

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Never said it was a good reason. Just a valid one.

His love turned to grief and his grief became blind rage. It will only ever be sated by Sylv's death...or his. (Personally, I'd rather keep Genn...but I don't see Blizzard dropping Sylv any time soon.)

even if he kills sylv, hell still be empty inside, and probably commit suicide or get corrputed by OG's or whatever blizz decides, just like sylv did when arthas got finally killed, cuz thats what revenge and vengecy does to one

[De Lupe]

even if he kills sylv, hell still be empty inside, and probably commit suicide or get corrputed by OG's or whatever blizz decides, just like sylv did when arthas got finally killed, cuz thats what revenge and vengecy does to one

I like Genn. Seeing him in so much pain physically hurts me. I just hope the poor old wolf gets some kind of peace. Right now, he's the underdog (pun not intended) and I would actually love to see him kill Sylv...but maybe die in the process. So he dies happy. Even if Sylv comes back afterwards, let the poor puppy have one pure, blissful moment before he dies! T_T

[sam86]

The paragraphs right before the Sylvanas part also allude to Azerite being found by goblins, which we also know is a major reason this war will exist. The readers are also not the only ones that know she wanted to attack the Alliance first - in the preview she's speaking to Nathanos about this to prepare the troops.

Here is the problem, when exactly prior to that paragraph that came out of blizz ass to try to explain BFA did Sylvanas show any interest in assaulting an alliance nation ? Gilneas? Forsaken quests in Hillsbrad Foothills show clear hatred to them for locking the gates and leave them to the cruel fate of scourge, while not flat out stated it is hinted that Gilneas attack is revenge on Gilneas 'help' to Lordearon (not to mention, the tiny 'point' that Gilneas wasn't even alliance at that time), retaking Lordearon lands ? it might surprise u but Lordearon citizens still see themselves as Lordearon citizens, yeah alliance don't see undead deserve the chance to exist in first place but Forsaken still see themselves as Lordearon citizens, even still honoring king Teneras II
So while i'm not denying that blizz is showing that Sylvanas wants Stormwind, can u show me a single hint that sylvanas wanted to conquer an alliance city prior to that paragraph ? That reminds me with how blizz decided to make Garrosh I R EVIL in MoP out of their asses because 'half of team didn't know what happened in Cataclysm' (Alex Afrasibi own words when he tried to explain why Garrosh changed so much from Cata honorable leader to a guy who enslave babies)?
So u talking like that Sylvanas was always warmonger leader, while - specially in legion - forsaken didn't want any aggression on alliance, they were purely self defending (and to be fair, neither alliance shown that, only worgens were hostile, both night elves and draenei shown to be on very good terms with horde)
If u want to blame anyone, blame our beloved blizz who decided to ping pong the story as it fits the gameplay, not what should be the other way around, we did let them get away with the fuck they did to Garrosh or Archimonde or entire AU crap concept (also not really, with WoD 'sales' were abysmal), but don't act like Sylvanas was always set on conquering Stormwind, because she was not
And who knows, maybe they decide to change the next book story, it isn't canon yet, they can change it, they did that to Med'an story in a typical FUCK U lore way where they say he is 'canon' but literally everything else - like u know, his own mother ? - don't recognize his existence

the entire concept of BFA is on very thin layer of ice, at least in MoP we had 2 exps prior that alliance and horde were very hostile, in cata we were just 1 hair away from flat out open war, in Legion we became best friends in level that wasn't seen even in vanilla wow where we themed up against AQ, then next exp full out war even worse than MoP? fuck this, i have big hope that the book 'fix' as much as possible, but it will have to do amazing work to make it 'ok' that we reach that boiling level after best friends expansion

[Shakou]

Never said it was a good reason. Just a valid one.

No it is not valid. Him seeking vengeance is fine as far as the story goes that's something to start with. But him starting a war over it and most of you being totally unware of it and just being rah rah rah Sylvannas bad Genn good. Lol No. Totally not okay. You can see the many loud mouths on these boards that don't even comprehend that any war right now is all about his lust for vengeance and that's it, led on by the halfwits that don't comprehend basic shit like the fact that this makes him just as bad as people imagine Sylvannas to be.

It does not matter whether you agree or not, the whole thing is completely retarded.

And like look no offense but I'd say you're delusional if you think this is what Blizzard actually intends and that they are in any way going to ever give Greymane that vengeance. It will never happen.

[Deleted]

2 years (or so) later and we still have people arguing about this...

It's not like we didn't have 11 years of conflict we could continue our war over.

[GennGreymane]

Death should be permanent. No more valk 1 up shrooms!

[Shakou]

2 years (or so) later and we still have people arguing about this...

It's not like we didn't have 11 years of conflict we could continue our war over.

I mean ya, there are totally much more firm foundations that this story could be based on.

HOWEVER, I do think that Blizzard intends to point out how flimsy the excuse for war is in this case before expansions end. I think that actually is the point.

[deviantcultist]

Even if the Broken Shore situation is a misunderstanding, Greymane was still a victim to Sylvanas due to what she did in Gilneas. In other words, even if the burning of the tree is a misunderstanding, the Horde still owes a lot to begin with.

[THEORACLE64]

Unless you are one of the few that never played Horde side, literally the whole reason for Horde/Ally conflict in Legion was based on a misunderstanding, yet it's one of the main reasons cited at Blizzcon for why there is conflict between the factions in BFA.

I would say the odds of Teldrassil burning being any different are slim to none at all.

But let's not let that stop people from taking unconfirmed rumors and baseless speculation as gospel.

Oh, this troll again.

The Horde burn Teldrassil first, and taking Lorderon back was a direct relational to that - we still don’t know the how’s and why’s Teldrassil was burned.

What happened at the Broken Shore is just fuel to the fire for the Alliance, mostly Genn.

End of thread, don’t feed the troll.

[cparle87]

Unless you are one of the few that never played Horde side, literally the whole reason for Horde/Ally conflict in Legion was based on a misunderstanding, yet it's one of the main reasons cited at Blizzcon for why there is conflict between the factions in BFA.

I would say the odds of Teldrassil burning being any different are slim to none at all.

But let's not let that stop people from taking unconfirmed rumors and baseless speculation as gospel.

That's how Garrosh basically happened too. Prior to Wrathgate the factions were getting along the best they ever were, there was a lot of trade between the orcs/trolls and night elves, particularly the former buying food from the latter. After Wrathgate the elves cut off that trade. After Wrath Garrosh comes to Orgrimmar the first time in his short story, sees food shortages, drought, and shortages of other necessities that the orcs now have very little ways to get more of. And eventually comes to the extreme ideology of taking whatever his people need. It's even in the intro when you make a new orc.

[Pendraeg]

Velen - a 100 000 yo priest who lost his people, lost his son, lost his home and struggles to get his revenge against those who betrayed him.
Trall - a young orc slave who ended up building a New Horde and representing Earthern Ring.
Saurfang - not really well deveoped except for losing his son during ICC events.
Vol'Jin - is vastly underveloped. Has so much potential. Still helped in recreating the Horde, lead the rebellion against Garrosh'es tyranny.
Boy King - has much potential. Lost his father at young age. Burden of being a King of Alliance. Needs to sort out what is right and what is wrong for himself. Right after he becomes a King, we get another faction war. And we know he has plot armor till he is like 70 yo badass leader of the fight against the Void. So he has much room for development.

I so want to see boy king go from Priest to Paladin. He's 80% there in the BfA cinematic. Maybe take a pilgrimage to Uther's tomb, who sends him to Andorhal after they crush the Forsaken in Lorderon to meet with the ghost of Gavinrad and pick up his Libram of Compassion (fits Anduin's personality).

[cparle87]

Even if the Broken Shore situation is a misunderstanding, Greymane was still a victim to Sylvanas due to what she did in Gilneas. In other words, even if the burning of the tree is a misunderstanding, the Horde still owes a lot to begin with.

Garrosh ordered the Forsaken to invade Gilneas while Sylvanas was trying to commit suicide. She comes back the eve before their invasion and has 2 choices. Ignore the situation and let Garrosh use her people as cannon fodder for his troops; or take over command of the invasion and ensure her people's lives aren't thrown away. Liam Greymane took an arrow for his father, that's very noble. Genn using it to justify his constant attacks on the Forsaken, less so.

[Pendraeg]

Even if the Broken Shore situation is a misunderstanding, Greymane was still a victim to Sylvanas due to what she did in Gilneas. In other words, even if the burning of the tree is a misunderstanding, the Horde still owes a lot to begin with.

Okay, let's be honest: the Horde is Germany post WWI. They were essentially f*cked after their last war with the Alliance, and they need resources, so their way to get those resources is a war of aggression.