Communism : Practical. Rational. Inevitable.

[Easo]

Listen, OP.
The answer is NO. I am from Latvia. Let me tell you once more - NO.

[Linkedblade]

I have some questions:

1) What protects people from being victims of crime or exploitation? Who settles disputes?
2) In order to achieve communism, you have to eliminate the bourgeoisie. How do you expect to innovate if the academic class is eliminated?
3) Once the bourgeoisie is eliminated what happens to their wealth and power?
4) If the proletariat eliminates the bourgeoisie, they then become the bourgeoisie. Wouldn't this situation devolve into a form of anarchy or military control?
5) What happens in a communist society if someone begins to hoard resources? Protects them with force?

That's all I've got for now.

Still waiting

[Daelak]

Still waiting

1. A court system administered by an artificial super intelligent system with the IQ of 10,000+.
2. There will be no 'class' of people, just homo sapiens and a global ASI system that will persist.
3. There will be no value to material wealth or power, scarcity would be eliminated and seal actualization of all human beings becomes possible.
4. There will be no 'class' of people, just homo sapiens and a global ASI system that will persist.
5. There would be no hoarding of resources when all resources are available to all humans without restriction.

[Linkedblade]

1. A court system administered by an artificial super intelligent system with the IQ of 10,000+.
2. There will be no 'class' of people, just homo sapiens and a global ASI system that will persist.
3. There will be no value to material wealth or power, scarcity would be eliminated and seal actualization of all human beings becomes possible.
4. There will be no 'class' of people, just homo sapiens and a global ASI system that will persist.
5. There would be no hoarding of resources when all resources are available to all humans without restriction.

So, there is a government or governing body. Contradiction.

[Theodarzna]

1. A court system administered by an artificial super intelligent system with the IQ of 10,000+.
2. There will be no 'class' of people, just homo sapiens and a global ASI system that will persist.
3. There will be no value to material wealth or power, scarcity would be eliminated and seal actualization of all human beings becomes possible.
4. There will be no 'class' of people, just homo sapiens and a global ASI system that will persist.
5. There would be no hoarding of resources when all resources are available to all humans without restriction.

So your hoping to build a God that will give you everything you desire?

[Daelak]

So, there is a government or governing body. Contradiction.

No, just a ASI system maintaining global resources and technological advancement.

- - - Updated - - -

So your hoping to build a God that will give you everything you desire?

It's not hope, it's an inevitability of the quadrillion of data points ingested via machine learning to create ASI. People 59 years ago said the same when machines learned how to play checkers and tic tac toe.

[Vash The Stampede]

The problem is that communism is something that we Americans kinda invented. And that definition is extremely broad. From what I gather, communism is a system where the government owns everything. The government controls everything from jobs to social order. If you can vote, you're voting for one person. But very rarely can any modern country today fit that definition 100%. China is said to be communist but shows signs of capitalism. Cuba is suppose to be communist by has a lot of socialism.

It's communist when the government controls everything, including the political system. It's socialist when the workers control the businesses, but isn't involved in a countries political system. Capitalism is where individuals can own a business but is also not involved in the political system. When capitalism gets involved in the political system like how Verizon is trying to remove net neutrality through Ajit Pai then it's crony capitalism.

[Xarkan]

Not in this combination of colours and star next to it. My othalan rune does not appear on a shield like SS divisions used to wear. It appears next to burzum logo which is a music project. As far as I know Varg Vikernes can be accused of many things but not really covering hitler and national socialism ideology, even if you say Varg and Burzum is racist that still does not equal nazism.

Apparantly it did

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odal_(rune) (go to modern use)

Edit: This is not to say people using runes are fascists, nazists, or even viking wannabes

[Celista]

Someone made this thread to trigger Supertony, didn't they.

[Nadiru]

No, just a ASI system maintaining global resources and technological advancement.

So, a government. Maybe a fully automated luxury gay space communism government, but a government nonetheless.

[Linkedblade]

The problem is that communism is something that we Americans kinda invented. And that definition is extremely broad. From what I gather, communism is a system where the government owns everything. The government controls everything from jobs to social order. If you can vote, you're voting for one person. But very rarely can any modern country today fit that definition 100%. China is said to be communist but shows signs of capitalism. Cuba is suppose to be communist by has a lot of socialism.

It's communist when the government controls everything, including the political system. It's socialist when the workers control the businesses, but isn't involved in a countries political system. Capitalism is where individuals can own a business but is also not involved in the political system. When capitalism gets involved in the political system like how Verizon is trying to remove net neutrality through Ajit Pai then it's crony capitalism.

Theres no such as government in communism. Each member of commune/community has equal stake and ownership of all resources. So, it's pretty much anarchy under guise of a utopia. In communism there is no judiciary, no executive, no legislature. The issue is with any resource, which are finite/scarce, if demand far surpasses supply then there will be disorder. And there is nothing to protect the community. As with any anarchy it quickly falls back to another form of governance, whether it is a democracy, republic, oligarchy, or monarchy.

If a country has a government and they say they are communist then they are surely socialist.

[Zelk]

And Mao wasn't a communist.

China was communist like North Korea is a democratic republic. Think on that.

Mao was a very good communist actually, wrote some fantastic material

[Ermelloth]

Pure form of Communism is a nonsense; it goes against the very nature of human being. Watch the youngest of children play; often you can observe how 2-3-year-olds try to keep their siblings away from toys in a sandbox or grab the best toy around, saying "it's mine!". Humans are possessive by nature, and there is nothing that can change that.

[Xarkan]

Pure form of Communism is a nonsense; it goes against the very nature of human being. Watch the youngest of children play; often you can observe how 2-3-year-olds try to keep their siblings away from toys in a sandbox or grab the best toy around, saying "it's mine!". Humans are possessive by nature, and there is nothing that can change that.

I am not sure saying that society should be based on the nature of 2-3 year olds would end well either...

[Zython]

Nobody should be required to sign a union contract if they don't want to. Requiring it is where you get government involved. You have it backwards.

So wait, you say that workers should negotiate their wages, but want the government to stop them from collectivizing in such a way that they're actually able to do so? Either you're arguing in bad faith, or you REALLY haven't thought this through.

If every company is doing this, that means it is what the consumers want. Otherwise, they would not buy those products, and the companies would change. If you don't like it, start your own company, and operate more honestly.

I'd explain this you very slowly, but I think asking you to google "net neutrality" would be faster.

Refusing to pay for something for you is not harm. It's simply choosing to not help. If I knock on your car window, and ask for money, are you harming me if you refuse to do it?

I don't see the connection between that and artificially inflating the value of life-saving drugs that are dirt cheap to produce.

- - - Updated - - -

Pure form of Communism is a nonsense; it goes against the very nature of human being. Watch the youngest of children play; often you can observe how 2-3-year-olds try to keep their siblings away from toys in a sandbox or grab the best toy around, saying "it's mine!". Humans are possessive by nature, and there is nothing that can change that.

Funny. When I brought up the altruistic nature of infants, I got called an idiot...

- - - Updated - - -

I'm going to try asking another question. Let's assume that communism is unworkable. What DO we replace neoliberalism with?

[Xarkan]

I'm going to try asking another question. Let's assume that communism is unworkable. What DO we replace neoliberalism with?

Socialism obviously

[Machismo]

So wait, you say that workers should negotiate their wages, but want the government to stop them from collectivizing in such a way that they're actually able to do so? Either you're arguing in bad faith, or you REALLY haven't thought this through.



I'd explain this you very slowly, but I think asking you to google "net neutrality" would be faster.



I don't see the connection between that and artificially inflating the value of life-saving drugs that are dirt cheap to produce.

- - - Updated - - -



Funny. When I brought up the altruistic nature of infants, I got called an idiot...

- - - Updated - - -

I'm going to try asking another question. Let's assume that communism is unworkable. What DO we replace neoliberalism with?

People can collectively bargain without government interference. I've thought it through plenty. Where have I ever said I want the government to stop them from unionizing?

Like I have been saying, companies are doing what the consumers will allow them to get away with. As for the net neutrality thing, tat is a mixed bag, since taxpayers have largely funded infrastructure of the internet providers. I would have never given them a penny. That's corporatism, plain and simple... and it's something I strongly oppose.

The solution to rug pricing is also simple, get rid of the corporatism involved. You cannot have corporatism without government assistance. I'm not the one who wants government involved, you are. Corporatism is the example where government involvement doesn't go your way. By wanting government involvement, corporatism in some aspects will be inevitable, which means you should expect it by your own actions.

[Daelak]

So, a government. Maybe a fully automated luxury gay space communism government, but a government nonetheless.

Is this a South park reference?

[Linkedblade]

I'm going to try asking another question. Let's assume that communism is unworkable. What DO we replace neoliberalism with?

I think most countries are on the right track. The US is a good example. It needs some refining, but a federal republic is probably the best.

[Taso]

So wait, you say that workers should negotiate their wages, but want the government to stop them from collectivizing in such a way that they're actually able to do so? Either you're arguing in bad faith, or you REALLY haven't thought this through.



I'd explain this you very slowly, but I think asking you to google "net neutrality" would be faster.



I don't see the connection between that and artificially inflating the value of life-saving drugs that are dirt cheap to produce.

- - - Updated - - -



Funny. When I brought up the altruistic nature of infants, I got called an idiot...

- - - Updated - - -

I'm going to try asking another question. Let's assume that communism is unworkable. What DO we replace neoliberalism with?

Well neo liberalism is a attempt to revive classical liberalism with a more capitalistic outlook. Since classical liberalism got muddled with protectionism of mercantilism. By neo liberalism using the government to force open the free market in order to expand free trade.
We could go with German ordo liberalism.
We could always use Georgism/geo libertarianism where Land not cultivated gets taxed. Everything else like payroll gets eliminated.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geolibertarianism
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgism
Another is syndicalism or mutualism instead of communism.