Upcoming Class Changes, December 27 Hotfixes

[Phantomebb]

Ret damage might be too low? MIGHT!?! Really Bliz? really?

I am pretty sure them mean after the changes on thier internal beta. I am hoping that the talent ends up being 20% proc rate and the new mastery is like +2% so it ends up being around 35+% is you stack it. If they don't then blizzard is just stupid.

[WaitingforSWTOR]

What burns me from inside is: didnt they had enough data from the betatesters to balance things from the beggining? MONTHS OF BETA SPENT FOR NOTHING??

[Deleted]

I simply hope they fix retribution threat. Doing avarage dps but our threat is as if we were nuclear powerstations.

[Skippert]

I simply hope they fix retribution threat. Doing avarage dps but our threat is as if we were nuclear powerstations.

Ha so it's not just me. I also had that problem. The first 20seconds or so in some bossfights, I go over the tank's threat, while we have a well geared tank that knows his rotation/priorities.

[Dragoncircle]

nice changes but I'm still missing one very important thing on the hunter side which blizzard knows about,
and that's regarding the hunter pets which are getting misstargets now and then, also they are getting stuck in arenas pretty much.

I just hope they change it in a near future so we can use our pets properly without the pet messing with us.
It's gone 6 years and they still haven't changed that, so I hope they surely do that soon

[Vardjavi]

Ok seriously, removing drain mana, seriously? the reason I go affil for PVP is to controll people especially healers and you NEED to drain mana to stand a chance, without that all I have are dots that every healer can dispel and a fear they can also dispel, what's the point in affil then? if you remove drain mana you NEED to remove mana burn it's equally fucked up.

Drain mana is important not only to drain mana but it also scares a healer away, now they are just going to stand there dispelling everything I do then what? what a bullshit change.

^^ This. Ofc you protect your dots with UA, but affliction warlocks don't need to get their toolbox contain even fewer abilities. They've allready taken away the Felpuppy selfdispel and given it to the imp, so allready you can't get your healer out of sheep...

[Deleted]

Finally some nerfs to SV huntards...

can you tell me where did u see that ? Only thing i saw was the buffing part

[Vardjavi]

Awesome, why dont u make poly cast time 2.5 secs, remove cone of cold talant, remove deep freeze and elemental nova....

- yes please

But seriously, I see warriors admiting that their stun is OP these days, I'd say affliction warlocks are in a nice position with the large health pools, but mages... I rarely or never see a mage agreeing to the fact that you bring the biggest amount af control-abillities into PVP...

[Rifee]

Mage DPS being too low? and survival hunters being too powerful? this must be a joke

Generally when people say "dps" they are refering to PvE. Currently, survival hunters are raping dps meters in every type of fight in PvE, and mages are falling behind mostly due to their class working around rng talents and being very crit dependant.

[Neurus]

- yes please

But seriously, I see warriors admiting that their stun is OP these days, I'd say affliction warlocks are in a nice position with the large health pools, but mages... I rarely or never see a mage agreeing to the fact that you bring the biggest amount af control-abillities into PVP...

I agree with that, Mages do have a lot of control, but these days, where every healer can dispel magic, sheep being very easy to break with a lot of AoE “unintended” damage, and most classes having either a couple of ways to interrupt you or close the gap, Frost Mages have a hard time surviving any tunneled vision class (warrior/ferals/even rogues).

This is not about 1v1 (Where a decent mage can probably annoy a rogue -and maybe a bad warrior). 1v1 is not important, even 2v2 is less, but still shows that if a warrior/healer wants to kill a mage, now he has the tools (stuns) to do it.

In the course of the first 20-25 seconds (to say a number) a mage can try to stop an attacker (warrior, DK, rogue, Feral for example) by using (in no particular order) :

Frost Nova,Pet Nova, Blink, Cone Of Cold (4sec frozen targets if talented), One Free frost nova from the Ice Armor breaking (they are hitting him anyway), The new AoE (RoF), ultimately IceBlock and Mirror Image.

The problem with that in practice is that a competent dispeller will negate 5 of those (the Frost stuff including RoF, all negated by a single Freedom from a Paladin). Mirror images are raped by AoE (Bladestorm for example). Ferals are very hard if not impossible to properly root with Nova for more than 1 GCD. Warriors being dispelled are unstoppable (ask a shadow priest, LOL). Rogues? They need a dispeller (mutt especially) but they do so much dmg these days that unless your partner is really damaging “their” healer, a rogue will rape you.

Now you could argue that a good mage won’t be “caught” in the trap and will be able to sheep the dispeller or silence him, and that he/she will have one or more partners putting enough pressure somewhere else (or peeling), but in practice balance doesn’t always come from “the perfect scenario” the perceived balance the game has, must come from things people do, not spreadsheets only.

I believe good mages are OK, normal and bad ones will have more trouble because they will not know how/when to use their CDs properly to counteract for other players’ actions.

I’ve been doing some 2v2 Mage/Feral and some teams are easy to beat, but as resilience goes up and rating grows, it’s harder to land a kill, *even* with a couple of sheeps, counterspell, Deep Freeze and clones.

Mana pools that are supposed to go down faster (and they do) don’t go down fast enough, and there isn’t more “I global you” thing going on. So I believe that double-dps teams are going to be less frequent than ever, as only extremely experienced and geared people will be able to handle that. Think that as gear increases, so does damage *and* mana/healing pools.

The hotfixes changes seen so far, all point to a balance in that, less “control”, shorter CC durations and more *controlled* pew pew.

[Argroth]

Still not sure how they are getting the "Survival hunters are too powerful" crap from, it must be a case of the few representing the many. Last I few patches I saw all focused on making Explosive shot and black arrow as shitty as possible.

[SneakySneaky]

•We think Arms and Fury warriors are getting too much damage out of Heroic Strike. We want it to be clear that it’s a rage dump and not make it the hardest hitting ability

So if HS is suppose to be an agro dump what is Inner Rage for again? I have yet to have a chance to use it fearing I will become rage starved : /

---------- Post added 2010-12-29 at 11:47 PM ----------

- yes please

But seriously, I see warriors admiting that their stun is OP these days, I'd say affliction warlocks are in a nice position with the large health pools, but mages... I rarely or never see a mage agreeing to the fact that you bring the biggest amount af control-abillities into PVP...

Pfft you have a pet that has every warrior ability almost and your still complaining? They cant give you an " I win" button sry. You might have to L2pvp sucka

[Anuta]

Halfus has one small AE section, which isn't even guaranteed to be there each week :P Most of the fight is on single target, so the DPS will be higher in the long run for Unholy.

Magmaw is an obvious choice to look at to make a case for Frost AE dmg as a counterpoint, but there's an asterisks in that Unholy can't really get in to spread diseases as easily as Frost can with HB. Still, there are some parses in the top logs that feature Unholy, and they're still competitive at least.

I still am of the belief that Howling Blast is the best AE move in the game right now, since it doesn't have any cap on damage, aside from pulling threat and getting punched in the face

Actually, in the heroic version of HW the AOE is not a small section of the encounter. Review the logs. On every fight Unholy is ahead. Magmaw is a horrible choice to look at for Frost AOE damage as many guilds, such as mine, are having the hunters aoe the adds.

[Cows For Life]

Nerfing purge pretty much nails the coffin shut for resto shaman in competitive PvP. Hopefully it's only for Enhancement and Elemental. If not, there's really no reason to bring one over a Holy Paladin. All other benefits of a shaman are already covered by infinitely better classes.

You mean they just realized that Spellsteal and Purge were too powerful? It was immediately obvious to anyone that was playing once 4.0.1 went live. Playing my mage at the time, against any class that could dispel it meant I had no buffs at any time, period. By the same token, playing against anyone that had buffs meant that they belonged to me no problem.

EMFH buffed again, does this mean you can use two overpowered PVE trinkets in PVP again?

[Rennadrel]

I am curious as to know what they plan on doing with Howling Blast for Frost Death Knights. Yes, it's quite possibly the most overpowered DPS ability in the game right now and one reason would be that it can hit an unlimited number of targets. I think the damage on it is fine, mine hits for like 6k per target which is reasonable for an AoE and far better then the terrible AoE that Retribution Paladins have (Divine Storm and Holy Wrath are terrible for damage).

I think they need to just set a limit on how many targets Howling Blast can hit, ideally 8 would be the maximum number of targets since it does use a Frost Rune. Of course they could also take it off the Frost Rune use and make it use Runic Power (ideally 10) and hit a maximum of 5 targets at the same damage level it currently does. Also doing so could give you the option of a free choice of Frost Strike or Howling Blast that doesn't use Runic Power which would be awesome. I think as a whole, DK's have a pretty good AoE setup as it is if you are Frost at least, Howling Blast is overpowered but we can't use Death and Decay in dungeons because it is a high threat generator and breaks CC so ideally it can only be used on single target bosses in Unholy spec. So it's basically Pestilence and Blood Boil which aren't great for damage, but Pestilence helps spread diseases on multiple targets which is handy when you don't need to CC or have mobs out of the range of Pestilence.

---------- Post added 2010-12-31 at 11:49 PM ----------

Actually, in the heroic version of HW the AOE is not a small section of the encounter. Review the logs. On every fight Unholy is ahead. Magmaw is a horrible choice to look at for Frost AOE damage as many guilds, such as mine, are having the hunters aoe the adds.

I did 24k on Halfus in all heroic blues as Frost Dual Wield (aside from Soul Blade in my main hand) and I only used Howling Blast 5 times to help kill the whelps. I still pulled 6.8 million damage on the boss directly, so yeah Frost is just fine if you are dual wielding, and Unholy AoE is pretty bad in my opinion. Diseases may hit for a lot of damage, but when Howling Blast crits for 15k on like 10 targets, there is no way Unholy's diseases hitting that many targets could come close to the same kind of damage. And from what I have seen, you need to use a 2 hand weapon as Unholy to put up the same kind of numbers that I can do as Frost DW, since the other DK in my guild is Unholy 2H spec, I am Frost DW.

---------- Post added 2010-12-31 at 11:55 PM ----------

I simply hope they fix retribution threat. Doing avarage dps but our threat is as if we were nuclear powerstations.

Try playing a DW Frost DK. Get an Obliterate crit proc right off a trash pull and even if your tank has threat on one target, you will instantly pull aggro.

[MasterHamster]

I do not grasp the "Rets might be too low".
They are more or less in last.

Buuuut we'll see when they get a new mastery. Besides, if they stick to making Divine Purpose grant 3 Hand of Light they'll probably be overpowered instead.

[Airwaves]

And yeah, they are saying SV are too high in fights with alot of AoE - not too high during single target tank-n-spank.

100k dps on trash before last boss in H stonecore isn't op!




What?

[Deleted]

So, what is the deal with hunters? Are they just buffing mm and bm or are they nerfing sv as well?

[The Doctor]

"We also might nerf warrior stuns."

thank. god.

[Deleted]

Awesome, why dont u make poly cast time 2.5 secs, remove cone of cold talant, remove deep freeze and elemental nova....

Ok, I myself play a rogue. We are pretty much balanced atm.
But I am sick of hearing all this whining against frost mages in PvP.
Ok ice lance is an instant cast that can crit for about 18-20k ish with some resi IF the mage has a FoF proc.
Removing deep freeze - yeah right, it is the only stun in frost spec that is viable and they can use it like what, each 30 seconds?
I mean what have players to complain about, each good player who knows to play there class has a fair chance vs a mage.
Ok they can freeze and kite us around, but we got counter abilities to use then...so many classes can dispell all the frost, U-Dk's are immune to magic attacks 24/7 with there bubble thing, us rogues can use glyph of garotte (5second silence) and have 5seconds time to burn the mage time, not even going to talk about ferals here.
Warriors, lol they can charge 2times in like 2secs then have 30sec cooldown and can go 2secs again and all that to hit us with an 35k heroic strike next lol.
The only thing that imo should get nerfed bout pvp frost mages is ring of frost maybe, its to hard in BG's.
All the rest who is complaining frost mages are to hard and can't win from them obviously (no offence) does not know how to handle them in PvP.
Period.

regards