why does khadgar have medivhs staff?

[Dixiespork]

<Tin Foil Hat>

Khadgar is last boss of WoD

</Tin Foil Hat>

[Vynestra]

I'm sorry but Khadgar is WAY ahead of Jaina. Apprentice of Medivh and wielder of Atiesh, Greatstaff of the Guardian, as well as studying under A'dal.

Jaina has gotten stronger the last year or so, but she's nowhere close to Khadgar.

Jaina is a pretty damn strong mage, I think you are under-estimating her. And also under-estimating the staff she has charged with the thunder kings leftover power as well. Khadgar may have Atiesh and may be very strong, but I do believe Jaina is stronger. You didn't see Khadgar helping at all during the Theramore battle and you didn't see him get appointed to leader of the kirin tor lol.

And even if Khadgar is stronger in a 1v1 scenario, Jaina has the entire kirin tor at her back, and the council of 6. Her political power far exceeds Khadgars. She also has a boyfriend that was the aspect of magic who is still very powerful. Jaina has an entire city at her back, Khadgar does not.


Also, In the legendary questline in the foundry, and you can see it in the ach that we need to save khadgar when things take a turn for the worst, Garona actually poisons Khadgar, with a magically enchanted blade. Luckily we're there to save him and Jaina is there as well talking to him. You can hear it all here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTHM4rX1xDI She does even admit that we'd be lost without him, so while there are some head butting the two do get somewhat along.

[Northem]

Let's see, Khadgar currently has no beard, nor wrinkles and neither has the appearance of an old man of 100 years basically because he no longer has the aging curse that his former master Medivh gave to him when he was possessed by Sargeras, i.e. Khadgar appears now with the age that he really has: a 50-something (if Khadgar still had the curse of aging, his appearance would be something like this).

It is assumed that it was to be published a short story (it seems it no longer will be published at the end) where was explained an adventure that Khadgar had in Kharazhan just before the events happening in WoD.

In that story was to be explained as Khadgar had a series of prophetic dreams about the evils to come, in which always appeared crows, indicating that his former master Medivh was behind those dreams.

Then, promoted by his strange dreams, the old Khadgar embarked on a solitary mission in the vast and enchanted Palace of Kharazhan. His hunch comes true when he discovers that it was a "trap" of his former master Medivh, who had led him to there to prove him through a series of challenges.

In short, Khadgar finishes defeating an echo of Medivh, proving his worth facing to the upcoming challenges, so at the end his old teacher rewards him by:

• Removing his aging curse (so now he looks the age he really has)
  
  
• Transferring to him all residual power that the echo of Medivh still had (becoming Khadgar the mage alive most powerful of the world)
  
  
• Teaching him his most personal "tricks" (like transform himself into a raven)
  
  
• And finally granting him his old staff: Atiesh (omitting any reference of the one who must not be named)

[Wrathonia]

It is assumed that it was to be published a short story (it seems it no longer will be published at the end) where was explained an adventure that Khadgar had in Kharazhan just before the events happening in WoD.

I'm sorry, what? Where was this ever stated? Just sounds like a fan theory and wishful thinking.

[Aquamonkey]

Jaina is a pretty damn strong mage, I think you are under-estimating her. And also under-estimating the staff she has charged with the thunder kings leftover power as well. Khadgar may have Atiesh and may be very strong, but I do believe Jaina is stronger. You didn't see Khadgar helping at all during the Theramore battle and you didn't see him get appointed to leader of the kirin tor lol.

And even if Khadgar is stronger in a 1v1 scenario, Jaina has the entire kirin tor at her back, and the council of 6. Her political power far exceeds Khadgars. She also has a boyfriend that was the aspect of magic who is still very powerful. Jaina has an entire city at her back, Khadgar does not.


Also, In the legendary questline in the foundry, and you can see it in the ach that we need to save khadgar when things take a turn for the worst, Garona actually poisons Khadgar, with a magically enchanted blade. Luckily we're there to save him and Jaina is there as well talking to him. You can hear it all here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UTHM4rX1xDI She does even admit that we'd be lost without him, so while there are some head butting the two do get somewhat along.

Jaina was made leader of the Kirin Tor because of Krasus' prophesy. She attacked Thalen with all her might when his back was turned and it barely phased him.

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I'm sorry, what? Where was this ever stated? Just sounds like a fan theory and wishful thinking.

He's just making shit up while ignoring canon and WoG.

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Let's see, Khadgar currently has no beard, nor wrinkles and neither has the appearance of an old man of 100 years basically because he no longer has the aging curse that his former master Medivh gave to him when he was possessed by Sargeras, i.e. Khadgar appears now with the age that he really has: a 50-something (if Khadgar still had the curse of aging, his appearance would be something like this).

• Removing his aging curse (so now he looks the age he really has)
  
• And finally granting him his old staff: Atiesh (omitting any reference of the one who must not be named)

Will we find out what made Khadgar de-age and have Atiesh? Is he “our” Khadgar?
Not de-aged. Just freshly-shaved. (DaveKosak)

Med'an is non-canon.
Comics are canon. (MickyNeilson)

´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

[Vynestra]

Jaina was made leader of the Kirin Tor because of Krasus' prophesy. She attacked Thalen with all her might when his back was turned and it barely phased him.

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He's just making shit up while ignoring canon and WoG.

- - - Updated - - -

Will we find out what made Khadgar de-age and have Atiesh? Is he “our” Khadgar?
Not de-aged. Just freshly-shaved. (DaveKosak)

Med'an is non-canon.
Comics are canon. (MickyNeilson)

´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

Thalen had plot armor, obviously he wasn't going to die. I do think however somewhere in 6.1 she will kill him or somewhere down the road he'll die. Hopefully by her hands.

[Aquamonkey]

Thalen had plot armor, obviously he wasn't going to die. I do think however somewhere in 6.1 she will kill him or somewhere down the road he'll die. Hopefully by her hands.

What plot armor? Her attack did NOTHING to him. And they captured him anyway. He was knocked out by Pained sneaking up behind him and smacking him with the butt of her sword. Could have just as easily been written for him to get knocked out by Jaina's attack instead.

Jaina whirled and, with all her might, sent a massive blast of arcane energy directly at Thalen Songweaver.
In his arrogance, he was not expecting it. He stumbled back but recovered quickly. The blood elf stared at Jaina. For an instant, it appeared as if Thalen would protest his innocence, but then his white brows drew together as he sneered and lifted his hands.
He dropped like a stone. Pained stood behind him, still holding the sword whose hilt had so inelegantly yet efficiently disabled the foe.
--Tides of War

All of Jaina's might < butt of a sword.

[Vynestra]

What plot armor? Her attack did NOTHING to him. And they captured him anyway. He was knocked out by Pained sneaking up behind him and smacking him with the butt of her sword. Could have just as easily been written for him to get knocked out by Jaina's attack instead.

Jaina whirled and, with all her might, sent a massive blast of arcane energy directly at Thalen Songweaver.
In his arrogance, he was not expecting it. He stumbled back but recovered quickly. The blood elf stared at Jaina. For an instant, it appeared as if Thalen would protest his innocence, but then his white brows drew together as he sneered and lifted his hands.
He dropped like a stone. Pained stood behind him, still holding the sword whose hilt had so inelegantly yet efficiently disabled the foe.
--Tides of War

All of Jaina's might < butt of a sword.

You're clearly taking that too literally. And do you expect an arcane blast to take someone out completely? I imagine if it was Khadgar the same would have happened, or any mage. All of her might doesn't mean her strongest spell, it just means she sent a massive blast of arcane energy. It wasn't meant to kill him. I love how you take this ONE instance and base her ENTIRE magical existence and power, and say she is weak due to it. You just don't like Jaina from the sounds of it.


I could easily take the part from the icc 5 man pit of saron when she sends out all those ice lances and single handedly takes out a small army, with one spell. We could go on for days. But basing her magical prowess one ONE instance, doesn't cut it.

[Aquamonkey]

You're clearly taking that too literally. And do you expect an arcane blast to take someone out completely? I imagine if it was Khadgar the same would have happened, or any mage. All of her might doesn't mean her strongest spell, it just means she sent a massive blast of arcane energy. It wasn't meant to kill him. I love how you take this ONE instance and base her ENTIRE magical existence and power, and say she is weak due to it. You just don't like Jaina from the sounds of it.

Yes I expect that when someone attacks with all their might, the person is at least knocked over. Jaina was able to knock down Thrall multiple times and he's god-mode plot armor. Her attack against Thalen barely made him stumble and he wasn't even expecting it.

Her expertise is teleportation.

[Wrathonia]

You're clearly taking that too literally. And do you expect an arcane blast to take someone out completely? I imagine if it was Khadgar the same would have happened, or any mage. All of her might doesn't mean her strongest spell, it just means she sent a massive blast of arcane energy. It wasn't meant to kill him. I love how you take this ONE instance and base her ENTIRE magical existence and power, and say she is weak due to it. You just don't like Jaina from the sounds of it.


I could easily take the part from the icc 5 man pit of saron when she sounds out all those ice lances and single handedly takes out a small army, with one spell. We could go on for days. But basing her magical prowess one ONE instance, doesn't cut it.

Doesn't change the fact that even though he wasn't expecting it, all it did was make him stumble. He even quickly recovers. So he found her best attack pretty laughable.

[Vynestra]

Yes I expect that when someone attacks with all their might, the person is at least knocked over. Jaina was able to knock down Thrall multiple times and he's god-mode plot armor. Her attack against Thalen barely made him stumble.

So I don't see the arguement, you are disproving the fact that she is weak by saying she can knock thrall down multiple times. And also you probably didn't see where I said she took out a small army on pit of saron with one massive ice lance spell. And Thalen definitely isn't stronger than Jaina, so I don't even see the point of this argument anymore.

Doesn't change the fact that even though he wasn't expecting it, all it did was make him stumble. He even quickly recovers. So he found her best attack pretty laughable.

Once again where is it stated that was her best attack? And iirc she is more of a frost mage than arcane or fire. Maybe her mightiest arcane blast, but not her strongest spell by far.

[Aquamonkey]

So I don't see the arguement, you are disproving the fact that she is weak by saying she can knock thrall down multiple times. And also you probably didn't see where I said she took out a small army on pit of saron with one massive ice lance spell. And Thalen definitely isn't stronger than Jaina, so I don't even see the point of this argument anymore.

Once again where is it stated that was her best attack? And iirc she is more of a frost mage than arcane or fire. Maybe her mightiest arcane blast, but not her strongest spell by far.

She must be pretty shit with arcane magic if she can't even knock over someone with their back turned.

She had the Focusing Iris when she fought Thrall.


Also, I like how your rebuttal is that it's just because I don't like Jaina. When I've given a direct quote and examples. We're comparing magi, so examples of her attacks being ineffectual against other magic users is completely relevant. Her being able to wipe out a group of non-magical forces doesn't really matter.

EDIT: And it was a group of basic skeletons that she takes out in Pit of Saron, which were first weakened by a blizzard.

[Northem]

I'm sorry, what? Where was this ever stated? Just sounds like a fan theory and wishful thinking.

Perhaps do you have another reasonable explanation that answers all the questions that currently have no answer in relation to the honorable Archmage of the Alliance known as Khadgar?

[Deleted]

He killed Medivh in AU Azeroth and took his staff and tomes

[Traveler Voltin]

You're clearly taking that too literally. And do you expect an arcane blast to take someone out completely? I imagine if it was Khadgar the same would have happened, or any mage. All of her might doesn't mean her strongest spell, it just means she sent a massive blast of arcane energy. It wasn't meant to kill him. I love how you take this ONE instance and base her ENTIRE magical existence and power, and say she is weak due to it. You just don't like Jaina from the sounds of it.


I could easily take the part from the icc 5 man pit of saron when she sends out all those ice lances and single handedly takes out a small army, with one spell. We could go on for days. But basing her magical prowess one ONE instance, doesn't cut it.

Jaina is the strongest Human FEMALE wizard alive.
Compared to the male human wizards. she is weak

[Aquamonkey]

Jaina is the strongest Human FEMALE wizard alive.
Compared to the male human wizards. she is weak

Also, Khadgar is powerful on the level of all magi ever (without qualifiers for race or gender):

"Khadgar, one of the most powerful magi in Azerothian history."
--Tides of War

[Traveler Voltin]

Also, Khadgar is powerful on the level of all magi ever (without qualifiers for race or gender):

"Khadgar, one of the most powerful magi in Azerothian history."
--Tides of War

being medivh's aprentise sure does wonders i guess.
But yeah Jaina is weak

[FayrenPickpocket]

She must be pretty shit with arcane magic if she can't even knock over someone with their back turned.

She had the Focusing Iris when she fought Thrall.


Also, I like how your rebuttal is that it's just because I don't like Jaina. When I've given a direct quote and examples. We're comparing magi, so examples of her attacks being ineffectual against other magic users is completely relevant. Her being able to wipe out a group of non-magical forces doesn't really matter.

EDIT: And it was a group of basic skeletons that she takes out in Pit of Saron, which were first weakened by a blizzard.

Arcane mages didn't have a knock back at that time (neither did frost or fire, and they still don't.) Arcane blast does damage, not a knockback. Why should NPCs get super glorified spells that players don't?

[Deleted]

If I understand the rough consensus of this thread correctly, Khadgar is in fact impersonated by someone (Sargeras, Wrathion etc) who, in an attempt to impersonate him, transform into someone who doesn't look one bit like the Khadgar we know. In impersonating a 70+ year old bearded white haired man, he/she shows up as a beardless 30 year old dude with completely different outfit, height, everything. And having done so he/she (the impersonator) indeed successfully dupes the brightest and the greatest of Azeroth into not even questioning if this is Khadgar.

Yeah, fo sho. Obviously this is the most logical explanation for Khadgar not looking one shit like we're used to.

Well done, compadres, well done.

[Northem]

If I understand the rough consensus of this thread correctly, Khadgar is in fact impersonated by someone (Sargeras, Wrathion etc) who, in an attempt to impersonate him, transform into someone who doesn't look one bit like the Khadgar we know. In impersonating a 70+ year old bearded white haired man, he/she shows up as a beardless 30 year old dude with completely different outfit, height, everything. And having done so he/she (the impersonator) indeed successfully dupes the brightest and the greatest of Azeroth into not even questioning if this is Khadgar.

Yeah, fo sho. Obviously this is the most logical explanation for Khadgar not looking one shit like we're used to.

Well done, compadres, well done.

THAT is the most logical explanation so far