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  1. #221
    You can drop this complaint on Blizzards doorstep.

    They gave everyone a "free" 90 just for buying the expansion. The content from 90 to 100 is so easy most classes can solo it at level. And the barriers to enter heroics are little more than a minor annoyance. I mean they practically give you your first epic and the Proving Grounds are just a DPS race (at least for DPS they are).

    I had a level 100 Hunter, today, insisting that his pet "didn't have a growl" because it wasn't on his pet's action bar. He argued with the group for half the dungeon. We finally booted him.

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by Drathos View Post
    including all the hunters who pull EVERYTHING with Barrage.
    Admittedly I'm guilty of this, although in my defense barrage is a very strong ability which I actually need to practice using for raiding and more than once I have seen it shoot arrows at a 90 degree angle to where I'm standing to pull packs horizontal to where I'm standing.

    Not that this alleviates me of any fault, just a fwiw on the unpredictability of barrage.

  3. #223
    Quote Originally Posted by Twotonsteak View Post
    I had a level 100 Hunter, today, insisting that his pet "didn't have a growl" because it wasn't on his pet's action bar. He argued with the group for half the dungeon. We finally booted him.
    Yeah not defending him too much but Blizzard have made certain spells/abilities/passives very difficult to find with all the ability adds/losses/passives/talents swapping around.

    I'd imagine a lot of new hunters don't realise your pet is using about double the abilities it has on its bars just on autocast in spellbook. Another good example is that Prot Pallies passive damage reduction isn't listed as a passive in the spellbook, and yet is always in play.

    Still completely his fault, and since he kept arguing it he only compounds his responsibility for the mistake, but just saying things aren't as clear cut as they once were when looking at spellbook + talents was 100% transparency on abilities.

  4. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Yeah, I know, it can be frustrating when you're actually trying and it seems like everyone else is watching Seinfeld and eating Pop Tarts the entire run. I've just never really found myself believing I was doing everyone a favor though, but I get it.
    I think my premise was more "I'm already doing a lot more than they are, so why is the onus on me to do even more for them than I already am instead of the other way around" but it may not have come across that way.

  5. #225
    The Patient
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    I have to say, doing lvl 100 dungeons (I only do them for bonus bag) I only have encountered a few "bad" people, a hunter that would pull the whole train carriage on grimrail or the people who wont stop tunneling 2nd boss when she's bubbled on iron docks, but I tend to ask people if they know what to do when I start the dungeon so if I need to explain something I will.

  6. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by tibben View Post
    I'm not entirely sure why anyone runs heroic dungeons. Once you have completed the legendary ring requirements the only other reason to do them is to get Leeroy or Croman, which you should be creating your own group for, not using LFD. You can do LFR and the world bosses to get better gear than heroic dungeons. On my DK I hit 638 item level after running 4 heroics (one of which they were already on the last boss) and running the 2 wings of LFR. At that point I no longer had any incentive to do heroic dungeons. Why are you still doing them?
    I'm wondering the same thing. Presumably by this point, the only ones still running them are newly dinged alts, i mean, once you've finished a zone or two you can literally level off garrison quests- it'll take a while but it's doable over a few months or so. Personally i've not done a 5man in weeks, and when the time comes that any of my alts really need the ring i'll grab some guildies.

    So yeh, the only ones running 5 mans are badly geared alts trying for the ring. Big suprise, people are worse on their alts than on their mains, so over time the skill and average ilvl in 5mans most likely goes down. Wonder if anyone has the stats on this?

  7. #227
    It's always been like that.

  8. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanadei View Post
    Admittedly I'm guilty of this, although in my defense barrage is a very strong ability which I actually need to practice using for raiding and more than once I have seen it shoot arrows at a 90 degree angle to where I'm standing to pull packs horizontal to where I'm standing.

    Not that this alleviates me of any fault, just a fwiw on the unpredictability of barrage.
    Oh, I know it's unpredictable as all hell. It's still kinda funny to see hunters move into the train carriages so they're too close to the next pack, or use it while the tank is pulling mobs away from the flower seeds in Everbloom. It's not as bad as moonkins popping Starfall, though. That shit pulls the entire instance, not just the next 1-2 packs.
    Last edited by Tradu; 2015-01-02 at 02:28 AM.
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  9. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by Calaba View Post
    I'm wondering the same thing. Presumably by this point, the only ones still running them are newly dinged alts, i mean, once you've finished a zone or two you can literally level off garrison quests- it'll take a while but it's doable over a few months or so. Personally i've not done a 5man in weeks, and when the time comes that any of my alts really need the ring i'll grab some guildies.

    So yeh, the only ones running 5 mans are badly geared alts trying for the ring. Big suprise, people are worse on their alts than on their mains, so over time the skill and average ilvl in 5mans most likely goes down. Wonder if anyone has the stats on this?
    This might come off as a bit abrasive, and I don't actually have anything against you or your post, I just feel like it is coming to some odd conclusions and results I disagree with.

    To break it down:

    1. While you can get gear from garrisons/LFR/World bosses, dungeons are more renewable/reliable to get you from 615-630 or so. No one is saying you should do the latter instead of the former, but plenty of people do both.
    2. Generally even when it is an alt, and I can only speak from personal experience, people like getting things done in one go. Waiting for "months" so my garrison can gear my alt for me is my definition of drudgery.

    3. I can honestly say that if 5 mans were just badly geared alts, they would be about 10x as successful. The fact is that the issues in dungeons are rarely caused by gear, and usually caused by horrible performance. And I don't mean "oh I've never played hunter before whoops I accidently tab targeted a pack and pulled so sorry guys" kind of bad, I mean "I am a tank but I may as well shift out of bear form and heal myself up for a bit o wait im dead wtf" kind of bad.

    I think others would agree that alts aren't the problem, slowpoke levellers/new boosters/the usual crowd of bads is the problem.

  10. #230
    I've had very few bad groups.

    If anything I seem to remember it being worse in the past, not better.

    Really people vastly exaggerate.
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  11. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    I've had very few bad groups.

    If anything I seem to remember it being worse in the past, not better.

    Really people vastly exaggerate.
    I don't remember seeing anyone (bar one post about boosting) arguing to the contrary.

    I fully believe random dungeons (since the advent of the cross-server autoqueue and the death of server-bound communities) have always been awful.

  12. #232
    Legendary! Thallidomaniac's Avatar
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    Wouldn't the availability of PvP gear, namely the Conquest gear since people who did Arena every week should have their weapon by now, also contribute to this?
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  13. #233
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanadei View Post
    I fully believe random dungeons (since the advent of the cross-server autoqueue and the death of server-bound communities) have always been awful.
    Absolutely agree with you. My hubby recently started into WoW, "Wait, I can play a dwarven brewmaster???" So, Dwarven Monk Tank it is. We decided to not boost him, but play through dungeons and quests, so he gets the hang of it (especially as tank). My heart bleeds, when I see Texts like "Waht you wait fo tank" in (lvl 55) instance Chat, just because my husband stands still for five seconds while switching two skills in his bar, to make one of them better reachable... After 15 minutes playing in the dungeon the first time he stood still for a short time. You would never have seen something like this, when dungeongroups were made up completely by players from the same server... He luckily did not see it. I am looking forward to 90+, when we can play with guildmates...

    I agree with the argument, that it's not the gear - but the attitude. As healer in randoms I get yelled at, because the tank pulls more mobs than he can tank, I end up with half the group due to healing aggro and still should catch up with him to get him back into healrange, because he runs off again. Sometimes I wonder what I missed (stopped playing during cata firelands, returned for WoD) in pandaria... Did you not have to heal there?
    Also, not learning fight mechanics is not a gear problem. Dungeons are not laid out for super gear, but for quest-greens, specked with blues. Making proving grounds more difficult also does not mean, that a player puts more effort into it while in a pug. Still a lot of people level normally, not choosing to boost. Still, they won't buff/silence/control their pets, do crappy damage, chainpull, yell at tank/heal/dd and roll need on bop stuff they can't even equip.
    Against something like this, no proving grounds, no equip, no elitism helps anything.

    Well, only help is, find a mature guild and don't do pugs (or at least take two guildmates with you, who are not jerks, this actually helps a lot)...

  14. #234
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    I believe that random LFG was a complete success after the nightmare of TBC group forming personally. This expansion started off great with people really wanting to learn mechanics but under geared, now its just under geared people who don't have a clue as everyone else has no reason to go in as Blizzard removed any rewards worth the effort. LFG has always had that odd group that goes wrong, but my overall percentage of good-bad is massively skewed in favour of good, much like my pvp experiences, its almost as if random grouping created random chances of good/bad runs regardless of what you do.

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