Affliction M+

[Pelleas]

Hey guys - couple questions I need help with running my lock in M+

1) GoSup or GoSac? I tried both and getting mixed results. Wondering what is the best talent in theory for Mythic+ (when GoSup I switch demons for bosses too)
2) SC or Singularity? I read a lot that Singularity is the M+ goto choice but getting some bad results there too. What do you recommend?

many thanks!

-P

[Deleted]

1) GoSup. It also gives you a small stun on trash. Even if is really short, it can be useful if used as an AoE interrupt. Although you should prepare facing pet IA issues which can often be frustrating/laughable.

2) SC. Singularity is pretty crap. Not only it results in a lot less damage (Cause you can spam less Seeds), but its giant range often pulls trash that you wouldn't want to.

[Deleted]

1. GoSup. They nerfed GoSac several times and the Infernal does as much AOE damage and it gives you a stun. In the higher keystones just use the Doomguard for single target damage at all times, unless you have to have the stun. The basic story is they made some changes to make a pet class want to actuall yuse a pet instead of just summoning it once an hour to dispose of it for a buff of some sort

2. Soul Conduit. Singularity's cooldown is too long, it's total crap on bosses and the pull radius is way too big, anyway at higher keystones it's not just about spamming aoe and that's all Singularity does. You'd probably do as much AOE anyway with the extra shards for spamming more Seed of Corruption, but if you dump Agony on a loa dof trash mobs you will never run out of shards anyway. And like I said if you take it you lose Conduit which is a HUGE dps loss on the bosses which are almost all single target

I wish there was an actual use for Singularity, there simply isn't, it's a filler talent. Never see anyone using it, ever.

Maybe if they redesigned it so that the damage got higher the fewer targets it hit it would be OK. But basically it;s rubbish.

[muto]

MG/Contagion/Coil/Seeds/Soul Leech/Sup/Soul Conduit

Infernal for trash, and Doomguard for bosses. Some occasions where you need interrupts, then Doomguard on trash.

[Deleted]

1) GoSup. It also gives you a small stun on trash. Even if is really short, it can be useful if used as an AoE interrupt. Although you should prepare facing pet IA issues which can often be frustrating/laughable.

2) SC. Singularity is pretty crap. Not only it results in a lot less damage (Cause you can spam less Seeds), but its giant range often pulls trash that you wouldn't want to.

What kind of stun do you mean? Is there a stun when you (re)summon the infernal?

[Inshabel]

What kind of stun do you mean? Is there a stun when you (re)summon the infernal?

Meteor Strike, the Infernal's Command Demon ability, you've never used it?

[Deleted]

What kind of stun do you mean? Is there a stun when you (re)summon the infernal?

The Infernal has an ability called Meteor Strike which is a 2-second stun on a 1 minute cooldown.

If you don't take the Supremacy talent but have Doomguard and Infernal as temporary pets, iirc when you summon the infernal he does a Meteor Strike on summon.

To use this ability you can either locate it on the pet's cast bar, or use Command Demon, which for the Infernal causes it to cast Strike.

Personally I tend to use specific pet commands because Command Demon is different for each pet. Though obviously it is easier to keybind.

[SpikeySquad]

Just for an opposite opinion I tend to go with Infernal at all times unless it's a mainly single target boss that we need to kill ASAP, we need an extra interrupt, it's some annoying affix (though to be fair that little AoE is not going to be the main issue) or I know it's somewhere where I may pull with Infernal.

[Tolian]

MG/Contagion/Coil/Seeds/Soul Leech/Sup/Soul Conduit

Infernal for trash, and Doomguard for bosses. Some occasions where you need interrupts, then Doomguard on trash.

Why would you use contagion rather than AC in mythic+? Isn't AC just crazy stronger with all the Seed spreading on trash packs? Other than on the bosses, I don't tend to get a lot of UA casts off in the first place unless it's a particularly high key, or raging affix, etc. Curious to hear if there's a good reason for it that I'm not aware of.

[pappaslop]

Why would you use contagion rather than AC in mythic+? Isn't AC just crazy stronger with all the Seed spreading on trash packs? Other than on the bosses, I don't tend to get a lot of UA casts off in the first place unless it's a particularly high key, or raging affix, etc. Curious to hear if there's a good reason for it that I'm not aware of.

Contagion is far stronger for ST (bosses and priority target) and AC is essentially pointless when you are using seeds - corruption is constantly being reapplied and most of the time it just isn't needed (at least from my experience).

I prefer MG/Contagion/Coil/Seeds/Soul Leech/Sup/Soul Conduit as well - it's the most well-rounded build... Obviously, affixes change and you might find yourself with a varying group composition so there can be other variables to consider.

[Deleted]

Mg+Contagion results in more damage on ST for bosses. Also, if you use Sow the Seeds +Contagion, in an AOE pack you can burst for ~20% more damage ( Contagion+ the damage from Agony, UA, corruption, which get buffed) a specific target you want to kill faster than the other.

[Tolian]

What I was thinking of was less the fact that you don't have to worry about reapplying Corruption, which obviously isn't an issue with Seed spam, but more that typically things in sub-10s tend to die too fast to do much more than cast a few seeds and a few agonies for shards. In that case, on trash packs, you wouldn't seem to get much benefit from Contagion because by the time you get out at least 1 agony and a seed to spread corruption, then cast one or two UAs, then start draining, you're gonna get at best one or two ticks from the UAs before it dies. As opposed to cycling thru mobs with Agony/Seed, Agony/Seed, etc, until the pack is dead, and corruption is hitting much harder on stuff while they're alive due to AC.

Again, this is affix dependent as some of them create priority targeting situations, and its not optimal for single target boss damage. However, it seems that most of the focus of getting thru a plus fast enough is dealing with the trash, not the bosses. Dunno. My thought on it anyway. Just seems like stuff doesn't live long enough for Contagion's 18% on one mob to outweigh AC's 25% on the entire pack (for corruption dmg).

[chrewm]

Go ahead and try it out if you want.

Im positive I'd never lose to a warlock using AC over Contagion. The boss damage alone is so much more... Plus there are a lot of trash packs that have 2 big mobs. YOu'll lose there too. You might come ahead slightly on big packs. But at the end of the dungeon, when everyone checks the overall meter (the one that matters) you'll be short.

[Cheze]

if what you want is more trash/cleave damage take ELT instead, not AC. Any time you are aoe-ing vs trash packs you're casting seed enough to maintain 100% uptime on corruption anyway

[Tolian]

It's all the same to me, I don't have any skin in the game. I just wanna do what's the best damage (overall). I'm just saying that I didn't see how a spell that's predicated upon focusing a single mob would be better overall damage. Typically I run plenty of M+ during the week though, so I may as well give it a shot and see.
@Cheze - Lol, TBH I'm so used to only thinking of Contagion/AC on that tier that I forgot about ELT. With regard to the corruption though, again uptime isn't what I was saying AC was good for. It's the bonus to each tick of corruption that I think is the argument in favor of using it.

[Cainium]

@Cheze - Lol, TBH I'm so used to only thinking of Contagion/AC on that tier that I forgot about ELT. With regard to the corruption though, again uptime isn't what I was saying AC was good for. It's the bonus to each tick of corruption that I think is the argument in favor of using it.

Contagion works for all damage. So if you SoC a big mob with UA on it, it takes increased damage from SoC and Soul Flame as well, and as already pointed out, it's stronger on bosses.

[Deleted]

It's all the same to me, I don't have any skin in the game. I just wanna do what's the best damage (overall). I'm just saying that I didn't see how a spell that's predicated upon focusing a single mob would be better overall damage. Typically I run plenty of M+ during the week though, so I may as well give it a shot and see.
@Cheze - Lol, TBH I'm so used to only thinking of Contagion/AC on that tier that I forgot about ELT. With regard to the corruption though, again uptime isn't what I was saying AC was good for. It's the bonus to each tick of corruption that I think is the argument in favor of using it.

It is better overall damage because the big aoe packs do not last long enough for AC to be a meaningful damage increase, and in all dungeons there are many trash pack with 2/3 adds (and bosses, ofc) where contagion is better

[glickz]

MG/Contagion/Howl/Sow/BurningRush/Supremacy/SC is going to serve you well in almost every dungeon. Howl as an off gcd interrupt, Meteor Strike and having the option to summon a Doomguard at certain points in a dungeon are all considerations to have in mind.

There's definitely an argument for ELT on fortified or very low level keys to buff your Soul Flame. Having to reapply the buff midcombat is really punishing and your quality of life is going to be way higher just running Contagion. I've tried AC on very high keys where the pulls are awkwardly grouped but I wasn't that impressed. Once you lose your T19 4 piece and maybe still don't have your helm it will improve significantly. Soul Harvest is solid for Upper Kara but I don't think I would run it anywhere else. Sow is just too powerful on big pulls.

As far as the new changes go, I don't think anything will change for m+. PS is a powerful spell but it's just going to end up pulling unwanted trash or not lining up with the pace of the dungeon in most cases.