Page 1 of 6
1
2
3
... LastLast
  1. #1

    Post Mists of Pandaria PVP Info Summary and Breakdown

    Hello everyone, this post is essentially all currently released information regarding PVP in the upcoming Mists of Pandaria expansion. There is a quick summary here at the top, followed by a more in depth breakdown.

    Update 1: The PVP related information from the live developer Q&A on 27 October 2011 has been added.
    Update 2: Revised the parts about resilience with the new info on PVP power/defense, removed the cancelled Azshara Crater BG, and updated the names of the other two BGs.

    Quick Version:

    -Expansion focuses on Horde vs Alliance conflict (what exactly this means for PVP in the long run is uncertain).
    -Two new battlegrounds based on game types that are new to WoW. (Azshara Crater/DOTA BG has been cancelled)
    -Silvershard Mine (aka STV Diamond Mine) (Payload Style)
    -Temple of Kotmogu (aka Valley of Power) (Murderball Style)
    -One new arena map, Tol'vir Proving Grounds which is based on Nagrand Arena.
    -Resilience changed into PVP Power and PVP Defense, 30% damage reduction made baseline for all players.
    -Revised talent system (not PVP specific but will have a large impact).
    -Renewed focus on NATURAL world PVP (No Tol Barad/Wintergrasp type zone).

    Long Version:

    -Expansion focuses on Horde vs Alliance conflict (what exactly this means for PVP in the long run is uncertain).
    Chris Metzen touched on this in the reveal for Mists during the opening ceremony saying that one of the central themes of Mists was going to be renewed Horde vs Alliance conflict in the absence of an external threat. How this will affect the importance of PVP in the expansion remains to be seen, however three new battlegrounds would be the most ever included in an expansion so that is a start.


    -Two new battlegrounds based on game types that are new to WoW.
    The two new battlegrounds are based on entirely new (to WOW) game types, Murderball and Payload.


    -Silvershard Mine (aka Stranglethorn Diamond Mine)

    -15v15
    -A Goblin Mine located below northern STV.
    -Payload Style Gameplay.
    -Escort mine cars to depots scattered throughout the map.
    -There will be multiple tracks the mine cars can run on and players will be able to choose to send them on different paths as they run.
    -When a team successfully escorts a cart to a depot they score a point, first team to three wins

    Here is an enlarged version of the SSM/SDM concept map, I also re-did all the text to make it more easily readable.
    http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n...ondMineMap.jpg

    And a smaller version that can fit in the post, also with cleaned up text.


    Here is the SSM/SDM concept art. (click to view, didnt want to force-load so many images)
    http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n...ConceptArt.jpg

    SSM/SDM looks like a very interesting map although I am a bit concerned about a few things:
    1. It may be overly complicated, and may require a great deal of situational awareness and coordination. A lot of BG players tend to zerg around mindlessly and dont do the best job focusing on objectives. The way this map is designed I can easily see new players getting very confused about where to go and what to do.
    2. Allowing a single player to make critical decisions such as where to send a mine cart has the potential to create drama and social discord in pug/random BG's as people are going to disagree about where the carts should be sent and be frustrated when players make what they consider to be poor choices about where to send the carts.
    3. If someone needs to sit next to a switch for a large part of the game deciding where to send mine carts it could potentially be quite boring for that player, unless they need to constantly fight to defend the switch.
    4. If it's 15v15 that means it may not be included in the RBG map rotation, although they could make a 10v10 version just for rated.


    -Temple of Kotmogu (aka Valley of Power)
    -Located in the Vale of Eternal Blossoms.
    -Murderball style gameplay.
    -Teams compete to capture and hold an object in the center of the map.
    -Holding the object earns points.
    -Multiple point zones.
    -More points for standing closer to the center of the map with the object, less for hiding on the outside edges.
    -Object deals damage to holder.
    -Damage from object to holder increases over time.

    Here is the ToK/VoP concept map.


    Here is a breakdown of the point zones on the map. (click to view, didnt want to force-load so many images)
    http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n...fPowerMap2.jpg

    ToK/VOP looks like it will be a ton of fun. It has simple easy to understand gameplay and should make for quick and constant action as well as varied and dynamic strategies and tactics. The map is simple and straight forward, the mechanics are great, this BG will be a huge winner IMO.


    -One new arena map, Tol'vir Proving Grounds (TPG) which is based on Nagrand Arena.
    -Located in Uldum
    -Simple layout based on Nagrand Arena
    -Sense of place in the world
    -Simple square shape with 4 square shaped pillars.

    Here is the map for Tol'vir Proving Grounds.


    This should be a nice addition to the arena map rotation and should provide some much needed additional variety as long as they can make sure it is clean and doesn't have any nasty geometry issues.


    -Resilience replaced with PVP Power and PVP Defense (from the dev watercooler on stat changes):

    -We are renaming this stat to “Defense (PvP)” or possibly “PvP Defense.” All players will have 30% base Defense, the same way all characters have some base Stamina.
    -PvP gear will have Defense on it, as well as a new stat, “Power (PvP).” Power increases the damage you do to other players as well as the healing you do to other players in PvP situations.
    -If you have a lot of Power, you’ll do more damage to other players, but they likely have Defense as well. If you fight players in lots of PvE gear, they’ll take more damage. Likewise, a player in PvE gear won’t have enough Power to effectively penetrate your Defense.
    -The names PvP Power and PvP Defense may not be final, but we’re leaning towards going with stat names that are obviously PvP-related, rather than “fluffier” names that might not be as easy to grasp. We want it to be clear to players that neither Power nor Defense have any relevance when fighting creatures, such as in dungeons or raids.
    -PvP gear will be lower in item level than PvE gear of an equivalent tier, however the Power and Defense stats will make sure that PvP gear is more powerful in PvP (both offensively and defensively) than PvE gear. In our budgeting system, the PvP stats will be free rather than causing other stats, such as Strength or haste, to be smaller as a result of including Power or Defense.
    -The goal of this change is to make it easier for a PvP player to participate in PvE, or for a PvE player to get started in PvP. Currently, we feel it is too large a barrier to go from one to the other, and the result has been that we see more and more players choosing to focus exclusively on only PvP or PvE. In earlier expansions, it was more feasible to use PvE gear in Arenas or Battlegrounds until you acquired the more useful PvP gear. The same was true of being able to use your PvP gear in a dungeon or raid until you acquired something better. In Cataclysm, stepping into PvP with no PvP gear would result in a player being so ineffective that it was difficult to even make progress towards acquiring PvP gear.
    -For the higher-end of PvP or PvE (say Gladiators or heroic raiders), we believe those players will still gravitate towards the dedicated PvP or PvE gear. It is the players who are working towards those two end games that will benefit more from some cross over. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/454...-3_1_2012#blog

    -Revised talent system (not PVP specific but will have a large impact).

    The new talent system should provide a lot of fun and dynamic game play as people will be able to experiment with tons of different builds and customize their characters more than ever before. It will also make PVP more interesting because you really will have no idea talents any given player has until you fight them, where as now it is fairly easy to predict/guess. I predict this will make PVP a lot more fun.


    -Renewed focus on NATURAL world PVP (No Tol Barad/Wintergrasp type zone).
    The developers stated a few times, primarily in an interview with Tom Chilton by Direct TV, that they want to re-emphasize natural world PVP in Mists and move away from the kind of artificial world PVP created by wintergrasp and tol barad. The two ways they mentioned they were going to encourage this were by pushing players together more while questing, and through the addition of old-school style world raid bosses similar to the original Azergos. As guilds try to down these world bosses players of the opposite faction will naturally show up to gank and wipe them. They also very briefly mentioned the possibility of adding incentives for raiding enemy towns/quest hubs (level appropriate of course, no lowbie stomping). I am personally all for these changes and I think they will make world PVP much more fun. Good world PVP can't be scheduled and heavily structured, it needs to just happen on its own spontaneously, at least IMO.


    -Info about PVP from the live Dev Q&A 27 Oct 2011:

    Q: At Blizzcon Tom Chilton mentioned possible incentives for raiding enemy towns to encourage world PVP in mists, can Greg or Cory elaborate on this at all? (My question! =D)
    A: In regards to extra rewards for world pvp, we are contemplating the idea of increasing players conquest point caps by an extra 10-15%.

    Q: Hey there. Will Pandaria have a new Dalaran like city or will we be using the ones already existing ingame?
    A: We will have separate player hubs for both the Horde and Alliance on Pandaria. Separate hubs means we do not have to make them sanctuary and will encourage world PVP. These hubs will have access to an AH, Bank and general vendors. Valor, conquest, profession and faction vendors will be scattered around the world to encourage travel.

    Q: I think I read somewhere that resilience is becoming a base stat in MoP -- if this is the case, what does that mean for PvP gear and/or does this mean that end game guilds will be top in PvP.
    A: Resilience will still be an important stat for competitive PvP. Likewise, PvE gear will still be the best gear for PvE. The hope is to lower the barrier of entry by making the gap smaller (but not trivial).

    Q: One of the current issues discouraging World pvp is the presence of highly overpowered guards around cities and hubs, 1-shotting anyone who engages in PvP. How will this be in MoP?
    A: We know this is an issue in the current game and we plan to address it in Mists. We want to encourage world PVP, not make it a one-shot game for NPC guards. This is one of the main reasons we decided to make two separate player hubs instead of a shared sanctuary.

    Q: What place will the World Bosses have in the scheme of raid difficulty and the item level of gear they drop? Will they be a mandatory part of the raiding cycle?
    A: We want the world bosses to be optional, kind of like Baradin Hold.
    (This might mean they will drop PVP gear, at the very least they will encourage world PVP.)

    Q: I don't like PvP, I play on a PvP server, because my friends on a PvP server and most people from my country is playing on that particular server. I have to face world PvP every time I am doing my business in the new hubs in Pandaria? I love the new zone, but I don't want to be backstabbed by a rogue while I am selling my stuff, or buying equipment. Can non-interested players avoid the world PvP
    A: Yes, we certainly don't want you to always be back-stabbed while you are setting up your auctions. However, if a group of the opposing faction wants to form a raid and attack your city, we want them to have a chance to be successful. So yes and no. =)

    Q: With the world PvP that is being talked about, are there any plans to add any Quest Hubs in Mists of Pandaria which functions like a smaller scale of Baradin Hold/Wintergrasp that will change faction when it is assaulted? Maybe even ones with actual leveling quests instead of just more dailies to add a dynamic questing experience like the ones that were talked about at Blizzcon?
    A: Yes, this is exactly the kind of thing we are thinking about. We will share more info on our ideas for this soon. The idea is that we want to give players more options and not just always have one place to go or one thing to do.

    Q: With the new talent system, will you start to follow the model in place with Collosus Smash, where a move functions completely differently in PVE and PVP?
    A: We don't have a problem with specific mechanics working differently in PvP and PvE. Curse of Doom worked that way for years. Same with PvP durations on debuffs. What we don't want to do is just launch into having different coefficients and talents and everything for PvP and PvE. That just doubles the size of the game which makes it more complex to balance and harder for players to understand.


    Overall I am hopeful that Mists will make the PVP side of the game more enjoyable and bring a fair amount of new content. I look forward to getting new details on these battlegrounds, systems, and design philosophies as development progresses.

    I hope this summary has been helpful, I will update it as new info becomes available, if you notice any errors or anything I may have missed please let me know! =)


    Anti-Plagiarism Notice: This post is my original work and my intellectual property but may be shared and re-used freely for non-profit use so long as I am credited as the original author and the MMO-champ forums are credited as the original source. If you wish to use my work on a for-profit website please contact me through private message here on the forums and obtain my prior consent.
    Last edited by Eldacar; 2012-03-20 at 03:05 PM.
    @EldacarJS - Warcraft PVP Enthusiast, Theorycrafter, and Blizzard PVP Forum MVP

  2. #2
    Stood in the Fire QwertySham's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    California
    Posts
    393
    Not too stoked about the mine battleground. But I Really like what they are doing with the orb of power, very good concept.

    Guess we'll have to wait and see how the mine one plays out.


    btw- Good post :P

  3. #3
    If they want conflict visible in Mop then they need to emphasize world pvp more than just world bosses or dailies...
    I know removal of flying mounts or lfd tool is out of the question (2 things that destroyed most of world pvp along with 50k guards everywhere with 50 miles agro range) but what they should do is to firstl make weather effects appear more frequently and cover whole zone.
    However those weather effects should be altered so that for the duration of this weather effects you cannot fly in the zone at all. Have some msg that storm is comming or something and you have 1 minute to land with your mount or you will be thrown off of it.
    It would also make zones more dynamic and give feeling of world around you being abit more alive and ever changing while giving world pvpers area to bring war feeling to the game.

  4. #4
    new arena is just a reskin of nagrand arena with 4 pillars nothing new and it looks lame the bg's and everything else look cool

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by shadowforge666 View Post
    new arena is just a reskin of nagrand arena
    I am perfectly okay with this.

  6. #6
    I'm glad to see battlegrounds that are new gametypes to WoW, even if we've seen them elsewhere. I'm getting tired of capture the flag and capture the point.

  7. #7
    new arena is just a reskin of nagrand arena with 4 pillars nothing new
    I think that is a good thing TBH. When Blizz has attempted to introduce new mechanics to arena maps they have almost always been disasters. When it comes to arena simple maps are the way to go, and a nice re-skinning of an existing map is a good way to increase visual variety without causing a lot of drama.

  8. #8
    Scarab Lord Nest's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Finlanders
    Posts
    4,825
    Awesome summary.
    New arenas and BG's are always a good thing and can't see how anyone would think that it's bad.
    I hope that MoP is balanced PvP wise, might be great fun. ;3
    Heyoo!

  9. #9
    -Azshara Crater (AC)
    -No other real details were given on this, it seems to be the least developed concept thus far, there are no maps or concept art available.
    I watched the stream on this, I was sure they showed an in-game (not concept) map of a new bg with DOTA style lanes.

  10. #10
    I watched the stream on this, I was sure they showed an in-game (not concept) map of a new bg with DOTA style lanes.
    Are you sure you arnt confusing this with the new PVE scenario with a similar map layout? I watched that section of the panel 5X now and havent seen anything WoW-Dota Related beyond the cursory mention of it. If you can link to a video of that part of the panel or a screenshot of the map you are talking about I would be very appreciative =)

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Eldacar View Post
    Are you sure you arnt confusing this with the new PVE scenario with a similar map layout? I watched that section of the panel 5X now and havent seen anything WoW-Dota Related beyond the cursory mention of it. If you can link to a video of that part of the panel or a screenshot of the map you are talking about I would be very appreciative =)
    hmmm... yeah it may have been now you mention it. My bad.

  12. #12
    hmmm... yeah it may have been now you mention it. My bad.
    Ya the way that scenario was layed out it almost looked like a BG.

  13. #13
    Old God PizzaSHARK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Oklahoma, USA
    Posts
    10,768
    Still irritated that they went for Murderball over Bombing Run.

  14. #14
    Valley of Power (Murder Ball) BG would be awesome, they have this exact type of BG in Rift and it is awesome so in WoW it would be un-believable.

    As for the DOTA style map, that would be insane, first person DOTA, people play DOTA as a standalone game and it is HUGELY successful, so this would be amazing in WoW, can see it being very popular if the implement it correctly.

  15. #15
    This all sounds very promising. There is one thing that holds me back from doing "world-pvp" in Cata. Which are the lvl 90 guards that are absolutely facestomping everything in their path. I hope Blizzard will fix that issue aswell.

  16. #16
    awesome post matey!!

    i love the orb concept thingy, seems cool!

  17. #17
    Old God PizzaSHARK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Oklahoma, USA
    Posts
    10,768
    Quote Originally Posted by Crableg View Post
    Valley of Power (Murder Ball) BG would be awesome, they have this exact type of BG in Rift and it is awesome so in WoW it would be un-believable.

    As for the DOTA style map, that would be insane, first person DOTA, people play DOTA as a standalone game and it is HUGELY successful, so this would be amazing in WoW, can see it being very popular if the implement it correctly.
    We were way overdue for a deathmatch BG, which is exactly what Murderball is - Deathmatch with pretenses to strategy.

    Bombing Run is still the greatest gamemode ever created for any game, ever. It's unfortunate it doesn't see much love.

  18. #18
    Dreadlord Angrybathtub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    The Great White North
    Posts
    769
    "Horde vs alliance" expansion jk shut up pvp guy

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Angrybathtub View Post
    "Horde vs alliance" expansion jk shut up pvp guy

    The fact that they are even mentioning things like World PvP and Ganking is a promising sign.

    My stance is optimistic for this one.
    "I never met a miner who complained about the weather"

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Dexiefy View Post
    I know removal of flying mounts or lfd tool is out of the question (2 things that destroyed most of world pvp along with 50k guards everywhere with 50 miles agro range)
    Yep, and they're adding scenarios (mini pve instances) to that list.

    Flying mounts will prevent any form of interesting world pvp to happen as usual, the only thing one can hope for is a non-flyable daily quest hub.

    but what they should do is to firstl make weather effects appear more frequently and cover whole zone.
    However those weather effects should be altered so that for the duration of this weather effects you cannot fly in the zone at all. Have some msg that storm is comming or something and you have 1 minute to land with your mount or you will be thrown off of it.
    It would also make zones more dynamic and give feeling of world around you being abit more alive and ever changing while giving world pvpers area to bring war feeling to the game.
    They could do a lot of interesting things, but if they had anything related to world pvp planned for MoP they'd have mentioned it. They haven't, ergo it's not happening.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •