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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Ighox View Post
    Of course SWTOR will still be really successful, even if the game is shit there will be enough subscribers to make it a success.
    Star Wars is such a huge franchise that people will play it no matter what.

    But yeah, expected Blizzard to start doing some PR soon because of Rift / SWTOR, Rift already makes blizzard look bad at times because of how fast they release content with 20 times less subscribers, that's also why Blizzard said they wanted to get out expansions faster than they have been previously.

    On one hand, I feel the 1year sub move is a really cheap and desperate move for WoW subs, but on the other hand it's a pretty damn good offer and even I am considering it and this is coming from someone who's basically done with the game forever. (Except for maybe a few weeks at MoP beta/launch.)

    But it's great either way, the MMO market is finally seeing some rivalry and if companies keep pushing eachother it will be better for all of us.
    the 1year sub deal is stupid. Your not going to play both if you really raid, else I really feel as if your no better than half the (people) standing in those Q&A lines "woo panda!" kinda guy. Get out, get sunshine on your skin!!!

    Now in other news, never played diablo...never will. just not my kind of game, plus i will NOT play another mmo untill gw2. Thus, my 15$ a month for wow stands cause I might not be sure if I will play next month if acts of god occur.

  2. #22
    High Overlord Zachyveng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luph View Post
    Wait what? What has MoP "stolen" from SW:TOR. The only thing the game appears to have borrowed from other MMO's is the scenarios feature, which existed in Warhammer and does not exist in SW:TOR.

    SW:TOR has no new features other than voice acting.
    Well (and note I'm not saying Bioware created this) they are doing their whole game so that no classes have an autoattack, and they've kind of put that out there. Now recently Blizzard is doing a class without autoattacks. Now I'm not saying they copied but you can definitely see why some people would see it that way when they announce it at the same time that they announce they're adding other changes that came from different games.
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  3. #23
    Lets be objective here. Blizzcon confirmed a system that ToR is copying leads to cookie cutters and will eventually need to be changed when it comes to the talent tree's. We have to see how this pans out and if ToR does not end up being another cookie cutter fest.

    It also confirmed Blizzard is running out of fresh ideas and is trying to pull another EQ by taking ideas from ToR, Rift, and GW2 and apply it to outdated technology.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Zachyveng View Post
    Well (and note I'm not saying Bioware created this) they are doing their whole game so that no classes have an autoattack, and they've kind of put that out there. Now recently Blizzard is doing a class without autoattacks. Now I'm not saying they copied but you can definitely see why some people would see it that way when they announce it at the same time that they announce they're adding other changes that came from different games.
    City of Heroes actually started that trend, if I remember right. No such thing as an auto-attack, if you want to do damage you have to manually activate your attacks. Also, to be fair, from what I have seen the classes in ToR all have a freebie ability to be used in place of an auto-attack. So it's just an auto-attack without the ability to toggle it on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Puremallace View Post
    Lets be objective here. Blizzcon confirmed a system that ToR is copying leads to cookie cutters and will eventually need to be changed when it comes to the talent tree's. We have to see how this pans out and if ToR does not end up being another cookie cutter fest.

    It also confirmed Blizzard is running out of fresh ideas and is trying to pull another EQ by taking ideas from ToR, Rift, and GW2 and apply it to outdated technology.
    That cookie cutter excuse has always been bull. It's Blizzard way of saying "We really don't want to have to balance all these talents, so we'll make it so we don't have to." Like how mastery was supposed to be their balancing factor, they could just go in and tweak those numbers. They want to be able to focus on JUST that, and to not have to balance entire tree's anymore. That's why you don't see a combination of the old talent system and the new, it's much easier for them to balance specs when they know what everyone is taking ((All the mandatory talents)) since they forced them onto you, and just giving people six fluff abilities.
    Last edited by palladiamors; 2011-10-27 at 01:50 PM. Reason: Quote, missed a word.

  5. #25
    Stood in the Fire Yossarian's Avatar
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    how much is swtor going to cost? is it going to have a monthly fee? and is it going to have EU servers at launch? i'm curious, even though my hearth is with blizzard

  6. #26
    Can you count the number of updates Blizzard has added, let's see new expansion. Now today armor set preview, question and answer with the dev's, 12 month lock in etc of course Blizzard see's SWTOR as a legit threat. If you put SWTOR on the internet. It's something fans have been wanting for years. Their are huge differences in Blizzard and Bioware that no expansion can over shadow. SWTOR is story driven game play mostly. I do not know much about their combat but I saw a bounty hunter spraying fire on a foe and Sith Warrior leaping over a massive hound jumping through the air.

    Some people I believe give Blizzard too much credit. Do you think Blizzard is doing all these updates this month because they care about the community? I bet you think strippers like you too. No it's because they have lost a million subscribers with their last expansion. Why should this one be any different. Why must I wait eight months to over a year to an expansion that isn't here here and repeatedly grind the current dungeons knowing it's "all going to be replaced" I have played Dragon Age and Mass Effect. "Nothing that Blizzard throws at me can distract me from SWTOR" in the game. It's all a marketing ploy. If they can keep you distracted and hooked on their game they know you won't play another.

    Personally. Look at the big picture. SWTOR was a massive hit in the 80's and still is. It's fan base reaches "everyone" from mostly at adults because they were out when the movie first came out but also appeals to young teens etc. They had six movies combined.(That is alot of movies) they have a very loyal fan base. Granted, Star Wars Galaxy s did suck ...but that wasn't made by bioware. And the game sucking as it did. Still was there because of the fan base. Just remember the MOP isn't even in the early stages of beta. You have months at least to wait for that and a year or more for mop. Judging I would say early next year.

    Just be smart and look at Blizzard is doing with how many updates they did this past month. Combined with their overall average update every 3-5 months and their constant telling you content will be out "soon" seems like they are working really fast this time around. Try swtor at least and decide. Or play both. Swtor won't kill warcraft but it's a great game and a ton of fun. If your too distracted by Blizzard marketing ploy with shiny products to even test out the game. Then nothing I say will convince you.

  7. #27
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    SWTOR = instanced leveling? No thanks, I was thinking of switching to SWTOR, however after reading I dropped the idea of even doing so.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Graafaap View Post
    SWTOR = instanced leveling? No thanks, I was thinking of switching to SWTOR, however after reading I dropped the idea of even doing so.
    Say whaaa?? The only times you get instanced is when you do parts of your personal story, the rest is open world with everyone else.

  9. #29
    The Lightbringer vian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terito View Post
    Theres a website that tracks this, and this trend has not occured, granted they weren't cancelled either, but I wasn't serious that they would be, only making a point. I'll get you a link if you want, but if your a SWTOR guy, you should already know about darthhater, and they post the updated pre-order standings regularily
    Like said, personal experience.
    Working at a store, selling games all day and hearing what the customers have to say now after blizzcom.

    ---------- Post added 2011-10-27 at 02:17 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    how much is swtor going to cost? is it going to have a monthly fee? and is it going to have EU servers at launch? i'm curious, even though my hearth is with blizzard
    Yes to both questions.
    Last edited by vian; 2011-10-27 at 02:22 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by bizzy View Post
    yeh but lava is just very hot water

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Rugdoctor View Post
    I don't really feel that Blizzcons announcements had too much effect on my ToR plans. My CE is still preordered and once December rolls around I will be shifting the majority of my time over to ToR. I'm unfortunately locked in on a continued raiding schedule with my guild because they're friends of mine, so I went ahead and subbed for the 1 year of WoW. To be honest my big 2 reasons for locking in were 1) Diablo 3 (clearly) and 2) I'm on the fence about MoP, I don't care one way or the other about Pandaren my biggest concern is the direction theyre moving with the Pet Battles and the new talent system. Somehow I feel like they're gearing this expansion in the same trend they've been following, which has catered to the completely untalented and mentally useless group that play this game. Mind you I don't expect everyone to be an extremely good raider, but it used to be that people got scrubbed out by the generally difficulty and I was okay with that, I've grown very weary of being surrounded by horrible players who can't handle the most basic of boss mechanics. If I wanted a mindless mob to fight I'd go play a Korean click-to-move and be done with it. I digress though - I'm not sure I will like MoP, at the moment I stand fairly certain it will be the expansion that makes me wave the "So long and thanks for all the fish" flag and move on with my gaming life... An opportunity to find that out before I have to fork out the $50, combined with having a neat mount for the remainder of my time, and not having to go stand at gamestop at midnight for my copy of D3 are all well worth that 1 year for me. As for any of it affecting ToR? Can't say it did, I'm still extremely excited and it's nice to see Blizzard scrambling a little bit. BioWare is in a very similar position to where Blizzard was when WoW first dropped. Most of these other MMO companies were moderately successful yes, but none of them were household names. BioWare has the financial backing and enough IPs in their aresenal to afford to put forth the same kind of work into their MMO as Blizzard did, and I think this is the first time that's really happened. It's going to be an interesting first year.
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  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Rugdoctor View Post
    I don't really feel that Blizzcons announcements had too much effect on my ToR plans. My CE is still preordered and once December rolls around I will be shifting the majority of my time over to ToR. I'm unfortunately locked in on a continued raiding schedule with my guild because they're friends of mine, so I went ahead and subbed for the 1 year of WoW. To be honest my big 2 reasons for locking in were 1) Diablo 3 (clearly) and 2) I'm on the fence about MoP, I don't care one way or the other about Pandaren my biggest concern is the direction theyre moving with the Pet Battles and the new talent system. Somehow I feel like they're gearing this expansion in the same trend they've been following, which has catered to the completely untalented and mentally useless group that play this game. Mind you I don't expect everyone to be an extremely good raider, but it used to be that people got scrubbed out by the generally difficulty and I was okay with that, I've grown very weary of being surrounded by horrible players who can't handle the most basic of boss mechanics. If I wanted a mindless mob to fight I'd go play a Korean click-to-move and be done with it. I digress though - I'm not sure I will like MoP, at the moment I stand fairly certain it will be the expansion that makes me wave the "So long and thanks for all the fish" flag and move on with my gaming life... An opportunity to find that out before I have to fork out the $50, combined with having a neat mount for the remainder of my time, and not having to go stand at gamestop at midnight for my copy of D3 are all well worth that 1 year for me. As for any of it affecting ToR? Can't say it did, I'm still extremely excited and it's nice to see Blizzard scrambling a little bit. BioWare is in a very similar position to where Blizzard was when WoW first dropped. Most of these other MMO companies were moderately successful yes, but none of them were household names. BioWare has the financial backing and enough IPs in their aresenal to afford to put forth the same kind of work into their MMO as Blizzard did, and I think this is the first time that's really happened. It's going to be an interesting first year.
    This pretty much sums up how I feel.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Graafaap View Post
    SWTOR = instanced leveling? No thanks, I was thinking of switching to SWTOR, however after reading I dropped the idea of even doing so.
    It is 17 worlds each being the size from 2-4 WoW zones depending on who you talk to. Only instancing which would qualify more as phasing is the personnel story stuff. It has a very Aion feel to it where there are artificial barriers to keep you from leaving a pre defined zone limit.
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  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Ighox View Post
    Of course SWTOR will still be really successful, even if the game is shit there will be enough subscribers to make it a success.
    Star Wars is such a huge franchise that people will play it no matter what.

    But yeah, expected Blizzard to start doing some PR soon because of Rift / SWTOR, Rift already makes blizzard look bad at times because of how fast they release content with 20 times less subscribers, that's also why Blizzard said they wanted to get out expansions faster than they have been previously.

    On one hand, I feel the 1year sub move is a really cheap and desperate move for WoW subs, but on the other hand it's a pretty damn good offer and even I am considering it and this is coming from someone who's basically done with the game forever. (Except for maybe a few weeks at MoP beta/launch.)

    But it's great either way, the MMO market is finally seeing some rivalry and if companies keep pushing eachother it will be better for all of us.
    You really overestimate the power of the franchise.

    Most of the games star wars makes, fails save for KOTOR lol. Now I know SWTOR is an almost spiritual successor to KOTOR, this only gives it possibility of success, not "still will be really successful".

    You also overestimate how much of the franchise actually ennjoys 1. rpg's. 2.mmo's 3. games in their entirety. And 4. Have time to play the game even if they do like it.

    This whittles the game down, the problem with a defining franchise also is - some won't like the direction, the way the story goes, how the game handles etc etc.

    Suddenly a big game with an epic franchise and following becomes a niché title with a devoted community. I don't expect it to be really successful at all, but I certainly don't imagine it will flop but time will tell.

    Also you say the 1 year is a desperate move for WoW subs, I would say its more a calculated move. They don't have to do it at all, but it is a powerful investment bargaining chip. Stabilising any loss in subs no matter how meager makes investors happy. It isn't a futile and desperate attempt to stop wows decline, its a very clever calculated move to make wows degeneration towards a more stabile subscription figure slower.

    I'm not for or against either company, competition is good, but I think you are playing SWTOR far too high. You're not a "wow's going to die" but you are putting a lot of faith in something that is as likely to fall by the wayside as LOTR was, aswell as warhammer, and age of conan, all having respectively MMORPG friendly universes, I would guesstimate SWTOR at 2 mil sub cap, and falling somewhere to 1 million stable swiftly, perhaps a little more or less, and this won't be stealing 1 mil of WoW subs eiither, more than 50% i expect to come from other mmos or not from an mmo background at all.
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  14. #34
    Scarab Lord Blznsmri's Avatar
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    I feel as MoP is a poor attempt to stay competitive really. Taking ideas of other MMOs and trying to impliment their mechanics on a seven year old engine will more than likely crash and burn. I mean yeah, WOO! Paladins finally get a snare! But I don't pvp so it's no big deal at all to me. Not worth another 60+ dollars.
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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Graafaap View Post
    SWTOR = instanced leveling? No thanks, I was thinking of switching to SWTOR, however after reading I dropped the idea of even doing so.
    Could you elaborate?
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  16. #36
    Scarab Lord Trollsbane's Avatar
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    Game vs game threads aren't really what we want in the forums. While I don't doubt your intentions OP (They're actually pretty good), we've seen this thread before, and it'll turn out the same as the others. "X Game stole from Y Game who stole from Z game." "Then don't play X game. Have fun with your Y game." "Z game is dead. Long live the Y game." And those would be the more civil comments the thread will recieve.

    Closing.

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