Dragon soul: Your protective services is no longer needed.

[PopeJamal]

As someone who's not even raiding on his main right now because the guild need heals I have little sympathy for people who can't switch specs to help out their guilds. It really isn't that hard to gear/learn a second role and there's no reason not to given that it's completely foreseeable that it will be needed.

I'd have to agree. I don't understand all the complaining. It sounds like the same "It's all about me!" attitude from "Joe Casual" that has, supposedly, "ruined" the game.

"Let the best man raid!". Isn't that the hardcore ethos? If you aren't needed to tank anymore, then switch to DPS or Heals. If you can't get a spot healing or DPSing, then obviously you just aren't good enough for the job. A more suitable candidate was available, so step aside. Step up your game and try to get on the "A Team" next tier.

I'm starting to think that alot of the "Johnny Awesome" tanks here in the forums aren't really as awesome as they would have people believe. It's been my experience that a good player is a good player across the board. They can tank, DPS, and Heal. Possibly on multiple classes, but at least two out of the three roles on the same class.

[Deleted]

The thing is - I don't like to heal, I can get used to DPSing (but it is boring - at least on the 85s I currently have) but what I really like in raiding is tanking, it is simply more engaging (for me, at least) and I can't wait for active tanking system promised for warriors, pallies, druids and monks.

For the better part of this expac you're expected to bring 2 tanks on 10 man (T11 - Atramedes, Mag'Maw (normal only though), V&T (normal only), Al'Akir (normal only as well) - 4/12 or 1/13, T12 - Ryo, Domo, eventually Baleroc - 2/7) and then you get to T13 and half of the fights doesn't require second tank. What about those peeps that truly and only enjoy tanking, finding DPS to be mundane and boring, healing whack-a-mole greenbar game? I know that me, and my feral tank co-raider think the same, why when we want to raid together in our group we're forced to do something we don't like at all? For the better part of the raid?

Also, look at it that way - if 40-50% of fights is going to be solotanked per tier, don't you think it'll make number of mainspec tanks even smaller? Which will then cause even longer dungeon queues.

[theyanger]

I'd have to agree. I don't understand all the complaining. It sounds like the same "It's all about me!" attitude from "Joe Casual" that has, supposedly, "ruined" the game.

"Let the best man raid!". Isn't that the hardcore ethos? If you aren't needed to tank anymore, then switch to DPS or Heals. If you can't get a spot healing or DPSing, then obviously you just aren't good enough for the job. A more suitable candidate was available, so step aside. Step up your game and try to get on the "A Team" next tier.

I'm starting to think that alot of the "Johnny Awesome" tanks here in the forums aren't really as awesome as they would have people believe. It's been my experience that a good player is a good player across the board. They can tank, DPS, and Heal. Possibly on multiple classes, but at least two out of the three roles on the same class.

That's not actually how it works though. In a good guild everyone pulls their weight, some maybe more than others fine, but you're not being herded out by scrubs, and you don't have the gear to compete with them, especially when it matters (early on during progression) because of finite VP and loot drops. It's retarded that it's come to this, EVERY tank I know is more than willing to dps, the willingness has nothing to do with it.

[Judge Malthred]

Every guild currently have at least 2 main spec tanks because that have been the model thus far during this and previous expansion.
The new tier, even though it's still on the PTR, provide us with a majority of solo-tank encounters, which means guilds with two tanks will basically drop from 100% attendance to 50% bench status.
It frightens me that it'll result in me burning out on the bench and loose dedication since I would have a hard time keeping up with our DPS, not because of skill - but because of a gear gap created by I obviously having to pass on every upgrade and thus will not be brought instead of a full time main-spec DPS.
It's gonna be a race against time for our guild to reach hardmodes where i once again will not just be dead weight.

How are you fellow tank; handling this issue, and is it really an issue?

THe 3 new 5 mans are ilvl378 gear and have full armor sets, + weapons etc. Won't take long at all to catch up. And how many plate DPS'ers are in your raid that you have had to pass on every single dps upgrade that has dropped in the many months FL has been out?

[Komie]

Every guild currently have at least 2 main spec tanks because that have been the model thus far during this and previous expansion.
The new tier, even though it's still on the PTR, provide us with a majority of solo-tank encounters, which means guilds with two tanks will basically drop from 100% attendance to 50% bench status.
It frightens me that it'll result in me burning out on the bench and loose dedication since I would have a hard time keeping up with our DPS, not because of skill - but because of a gear gap created by I obviously having to pass on every upgrade and thus will not be brought instead of a full time main-spec DPS.
It's gonna be a race against time for our guild to reach hardmodes where i once again will not just be dead weight.

How are you fellow tank; handling this issue, and is it really an issue?

Does your guild like you?

Do you consider your guildies to be your friends? Do your guildies consider you to be their friend?

If yes, I see no reason why they wouldn't want to raid with one of their friends. They'd simply start letting you get dps gear and let you raid with them as dps instead of a tank.

[Canbie]

I don't mind single tanked fights. I do mind encounters with adds thrown in just to require a second tank. (As well as taunt rotates fights because of a debuff)

[Yunru]

You can get some easy gear in new heroics once they are realised (you will have to respec every raid tho). Not the best but at least something.

[Deleted]

Jugde Malthred:

Started raiding FL quite late : end of july.

(some of the kills on hc, didn't bother to differentiate).
12 Alys kills : 1 plate helmet
15 Shannox kills : 2 axes, 1 neck, 1 belt (tanking belt, but usable by DPSers)
9 Raggy kills : 0 maces
14 Ryo kills : 1 pair of gloves
15 Beth kills : 1 pair of boots

Shared boss loot : does that sword even exist?

I raid with Frost DK and Fury War. Yep, 10 man loot is... bad to say the least...

Komie:

I do like my guildies, I do like to raid with them, feeling's mutual. However, I don't like to DPS, why is it forced down my (or our feral tanks') throat like this this?

[Pavidus]

same thing goes for healers in firelands, 3 healers for ragna and 4 for major : d

Both of those are 2 healer fights. Should probably put more pressure on your healers to pull their weight.

[ambident]

Jugde Malthred:

Started raiding FL quite late : end of july.

(some of the kills on hc, didn't bother to differentiate).
12 Alys kills : 1 plate helmet
15 Shannox kills : 2 axes, 1 neck, 1 belt (tanking belt, but usable by DPSers)
9 Raggy kills : 0 maces
14 Ryo kills : 1 pair of gloves
15 Beth kills : 1 pair of boots

Shared boss loot : does that sword even exist?

I raid with Frost DK and Fury War. Yep, 10 man loot is... bad to say the least...

Komie:

I do like my guildies, I do like to raid with them, feeling's mutual. However, I don't like to DPS, why is it forced down my (or our feral tanks') throat like this this?

If you are in a hardcore guild, your guild is better off replacing you with a tank that can offspec dps or a dps that can offspec tank. No different than replacing a dps/healer that refuses to use the appropriate spec for whatever encounter.

Dual spec is there for a reason, put the guild ahead of yourself or they will move on without you.

[Deleted]

If you are in a hardcore guild, your guild is better off replacing you with a tank that can offspec dps or a dps that can offspec tank. No different than replacing a dps/healer that refuses to use the appropriate spec for whatever encounter.

Dual spec is there for a reason, put the guild ahead of yourself or they will move on without you.

I never said I'm in a hardcore guild, I just play casually. We're just a bunch of friends back from TBC. Lemme ask you this - why, due to blizz's design philosophy either me or the other tank will be left with much less satisfying (for them) role for half of the raid? I don't mean 2/12 fights, I do mean almost half of the freakin' instance...

[Muschi]

The only fights so far in Cata that have had engaging tanking mechanics with several tanks included have been (in my opinion) Cho'gall, Nef, Omnomnomtron, Ascendant council and Shannox. Countinc all the bosses in Cata, that's not an awful lot of fights.

[rijn dael]

If your guild will be working on normals for the first few months of 4.3, then I really feel your pain

On the plus side, the fights aren't that hard, and you will be able to use the LFR to acquire some dps gear - so you should be able to up your dps even if you don't get geared pre-4.3?


@Muschi
I agree that most fights have been pretty boring tankwise, but I did enjoy alysrazor too - especially when we were learning it, as it is one of the few fights where tanking-dps matters - or at least, dps couldn't carry a bad tank without noticing

The change to not having to care about threat, without introducing active tanking though.. gah, I don't enjoy tanking that much anymore.

[deviancee]

Both of those are 2 healer fights. Should probably put more pressure on your healers to pull their weight.

geez, i was talking about 25 man..

[Goregasm.]

A lot of tanks do not want to dps... we rolled tank for a reason. With the major tank shortage, why not making more encounters with at least 2 tank min... maybe even 3 tanks. I dont want dps people to feel forced to tank, but as a tank, I dont want to be forced into DPSing... specially considering 1 tank in a 25 man is a broken ratio.

[Daverid]

I don't mind single tanked fights. I do mind encounters with adds thrown in just to require a second tank. (As well as taunt rotates fights because of a debuff)

Pretty much this, I get real frustrated when Blizz just throws in that simple 'Taunt at X stacks' mechanic to force a second tank..

Blizz have proven they can make interesting 2 tank fights in the past... It's sad they can't seem to pull them out very often.

Time to really press my DK partner to make a DPS set by the end of FL so that I can tank everything instead :S

[FenrisUy]

Every guild currently have at least 2 main spec tanks because that have been the model thus far during this and previous expansion.
The new tier, even though it's still on the PTR, provide us with a majority of solo-tank encounters, which means guilds with two tanks will basically drop from 100% attendance to 50% bench status.
It frightens me that it'll result in me burning out on the bench and loose dedication since I would have a hard time keeping up with our DPS, not because of skill - but because of a gear gap created by I obviously having to pass on every upgrade and thus will not be brought instead of a full time main-spec DPS.
It's gonna be a race against time for our guild to reach hardmodes where i once again will not just be dead weight.

How are you fellow tank; handling this issue, and is it really an issue?

what were you doing during 4.2?

I mean that tier of 7 bosses has 3 1 tank fights. Baleroc, Domo, and Ryo

[Cute Chen]

A lot of tanks do not want to dps... we rolled tank for a reason. With the major tank shortage, why not making more encounters with at least 2 tank min... maybe even 3 tanks. I dont want dps people to feel forced to tank, but as a tank, I dont want to be forced into DPSing... specially considering 1 tank in a 25 man is a broken ratio.

That might work if you rolled a pure tank class, but there isn't one. Man up and learn your class. If your guild complains that you do low DPS, tell em to give you more gear.

[Ceria]

I really like solo tank fights since it gives me a break, a change of pace for a fight or two. Somedays I'll tank it, sometimes my compatriot will tank it. It all works out well and helps prevent burnout.

[Deleted]

I used to heal quite alot before but I still had a DPS offspec for fights where either a resto druid wasnt good at all or if the didnt require that many healers, the tanks I've played with during the years have never complained about going DPS. You simply just have to rotate around if you both are good (Unless you're a DK tank then I would understand why they want another tank).

If you dont have a full complete offspec set, your guild cant complain at you at all. And we do have the secondary talent spec for a reason. Its better to go offspec instead of being benched right?