No Character Progression Beyond Lvl.80?

[Deleted]

I hope ArenaNet has something in GW2 similar to the Hall of Monuments in Guild Wars 1, a place where you can put your trophies, titles, achievements etc. If anything it gives you a concrete, over-arching goal in the game and gives you a sense of character progression as you see your Hall progressively growing and being filled with artifacts, rares and challenging titles.

This is not confirmed, but it's very possible since there is HOM in GW2 where you can get your rewards from gw1. So, expanding it as a feature of GW2 should not produce problems, especially since they have quite robust achievement/trophy system in place anyway.

[Barrowmore]

Actually the devs have confirmed that your will accumulate lots of trophies in your Home Instance. You even get a journal that records your adventures from the moment you create your character. Even your friends can enter your Home Instance, see all of the trinkets you've collected, and read your journal.

[Odeezee]

I hope ArenaNet has something in GW2 similar to the Hall of Monuments in Guild Wars 1, a place where you can put your trophies, titles, achievements etc. If anything it gives you a concrete, over-arching goal in the game and gives you a sense of character progression as you see your Hall progressively growing and being filled with artifacts, rares and challenging titles.

i believe that is your home instance in GW2

[Purple]

Some of you have obviously never played the first game, level 20 was the cap, you could reach it in a day and there are people that have been playing that game for years - a game where your hard to get gear rewards are purely visual and have no statistical value over the easy to get gear rewards because you can put any stats you need on any armor your class can wear.

The first game sold more than six-million units. It has lasted years and years, with people still playing it even today.

I'm not really worried about a lack of people playing due to no carrot hanging off a stick.

[omlech]

Some of you have obviously never played the first game, level 20 was the cap, you could reach it in a day and there are people that have been playing that game for years - a game where your hard to get gear rewards are purely visual and have no statistical value over the easy to get gear rewards because you can put any stats you need on any armor your class can wear.

The first game sold more than six-million units. It has lasted years and years, with people still playing it even today.

I'm not really worried about a lack of people playing due to no carrot hanging off a stick.

This should probably be a sticky.

[Mkalafut]

Some of the comments just piss me off to no end. This is NOT World of Warcraft. This is GUILD WARS. If anyone here has played Guild Wars 1 you'd know that the idea of earning max armor / weapons doesn't mean the end of the game. Quite frankly, if I can have the same gear (max armor + weapons) and not have to update them every x number of months because some big new rehashed boss was released, I'm fine with that.

Having to constantly grind grind grind just to get your carrot on a stick (lol, you'll never catch it guys, FYI). is just stupid. I'd much rather be rewarded for what I do and have those rewards matter. There will be character progression past level 80. You just won't be able to flex your penis at the guy who has a lower iLevel than you.

---------- Post added 2011-11-14 at 05:05 PM ----------

Quote Originally Posted by muchtoohigh View Post
As much as people want to hate on the 'endless grind' aspect of WoW, it is that very aspect that has allowed it to be so popular for so long. Take raiding out of WoW and the game would have died years ago.
People are sheep. I'd rather pay my fee for the game, play it for free, get what I earn, and not have to run endlessly on the gear treadmill. Why even bother with heroics? Next expac the greens will replace them! Lol what a joke. I'll stick to the GW philosophy and if you'd rather grind in WoW for the rest of your life, more power to ya. I find my time and money a bit more valuable than that though.

---------- Post added 2011-11-14 at 05:55 PM ----------

Quote Originally Posted by Mif View Post
Yep.
People are just QQ'ing because they're isn't an increase in stats to make them more powerful, thus feel superior to other players.
This 100x. My friends who still play WoW can't understand why I enjoy getting new shiny weapons and pieces of armor with no stat increases. What's the point of playing if you can't get better stats as you go? Some people are just stupid and/or won't ever understand it. That's fine they can stick to WoW we'll have our fun with GW2.

[Fencers]

Rewards != progression as the OP is asking.

Also rewards such as in GW1 are carrots on sticks. It's merely personal how badly you want that carrot. Whereas those carrots in WoW/EQ style MMOs are mostly compulsory.

Lots of terrible posts on this subject unnecessarily explaining the reward system of the GW franchise.

[Bartuc the Bloody]

Not at all. I didn't say that. All I mean is that improving your actual skill as a player takes longer the better you are. (WoW) A player who has just started competitive PVP a few months ago will progress at a much faster rate than a 6 time Gladiator. And I agree, If GW2 can keep me playing and excited without dangling shiny loot in front of my nose then I can ask for nothing more. In fact i'd prefer it.

There is still shiny loot to be gotten, the difference being it's just cosmetic. You can still improve your character, I have no doubts that ANet has long term progression in mind so don't worry. It's a hard thing to accomplish, keeping players interested in a game without having everything turn into a grind (carrot on a stick) because mostly it's the player that won't push themselves to actually enjoy the game.

I play WoW still (well .. skyrim atm) but my point being that it's boring even though I could still progress my character in stat's but that is not fun to me. That gear that I grinded for is just going to be replaced next patch and I can't even access that gear without getting better gear than I had in the first place because the game just won't let you (stat progression).

It's a terrible design imo and so is holy trinity, about 2 weeks ago I was looking for a tank and heals for CoC. I am on a very busy server, and after 4 hours I finished every other quest in twilight highlands, did some dungeons and got 346 gear faster than I could even find anyone interested in helping me out with the quest. All I got was trolls and people asking ridiculous amounts of gold to tank/heal for me. It's a fucking retarded ass system.

The only reason I wanted that gear was so I could do heroics and eventually raid with my guild which imo is where the real fun starts because you are progressing with your friends and it's not just a grind anymore it's team play and you are actually ENJOYING yourself. It takes SO LONG for that to actually happen.

I don't give a fuck about gear, I just want to PLAY the fun parts of the game. And if gear is your thing, there will still be hard to attain gear in GW2 but it's just cosmetic. No restrictions to places you can go other than level for dungeons and stuff. That is GREAT design. Sorry for my long rant.

[Newbryn]

There is still shiny loot to be gotten, the difference being it's just cosmetic. You can still improve your character, I have no doubts that ANet has long term progression in mind so don't worry. It's a hard thing to accomplish, keeping players interested in a game without having everything turn into a grind (carrot on a stick) because mostly it's the player that won't push themselves to actually enjoy the game.

I play WoW still (well .. skyrim atm) but my point being that it's boring even though I could still progress my character in stat's but that is not fun to me. That gear that I grinded for is just going to be replaced next patch and I can't even access that gear without getting better gear than I had in the first place because the game just won't let you (stat progression).

It's a terrible design imo and so is holy trinity, about 2 weeks ago I was looking for a tank and heals for CoC. I am on a very busy server, and after 4 hours I finished every other quest in twilight highlands, did some dungeons and got 346 gear faster than I could even find anyone interested in helping me out with the quest. All I got was trolls and people asking ridiculous amounts of gold to tank/heal for me. It's a fucking retarded ass system.

The only reason I wanted that gear was so I could do heroics and eventually raid with my guild which imo is where the real fun starts because you are progressing with your friends and it's not just a grind anymore it's team play and you are actually ENJOYING yourself. It takes SO LONG for that to actually happen.

I don't give a fuck about gear, I just want to PLAY the fun parts of the game. And if gear is your thing, there will still be hard to attain gear in GW2 but it's just cosmetic. No restrictions to places you can go other than level for dungeons and stuff. That is GREAT design. Sorry for my long rant.

Quoted for truth, I personally prefer aesthetic over item level or any kind of power boost, pretty much the way I see all things anyways yea I'm pretty shallow, but having my character look the way I want trumps any kind of super powered gear that could ever be offered to me

[vilhelm1992]

You go for titles and achievements that is kind of what you did in GW1, in wow as much as you like to kid yourself you dont give a flying fhawk about the numbers, you like to go around in "rare" armour and impress people with the size of your epeen, so you go for the hard and challenging things, get a title/achievement that not meny people have have a laugh with your friends

[Fencers]

You go for titles and achievements that is kind of what you did in GW1, in wow as much as you like to kid yourself you dont give a flying fhawk about the numbers, you like to go around in "rare" armour and impress people with the size of your epeen, so you go for the hard and challenging things, get a title/achievement that not meny people have have a laugh with your friends

Many people do enjoy the mathematics behind their gear threshold.

It's simply two different, equally valid, systems in GW and WoW.

The reward of gear in WoW is access to greater content. Ad infinity. The reward in GW is looking cute. Ad infinity.

[Deleted]

Many people do enjoy the mathematics behind their gear threshold.

I guess saying that I'm and IT guy is really not enough -I am a math freak. Coder by heart. I really liked WoW system because I could swim in spreadsheets, databases while building my next character's setup. My role as a main tank was enforcing it even further. Unfortunately in the end.. my time spent OUTside of the game while crunching the numbers was higher than actual play.

That is why I'm more than interested in GW2's horizontal progression. Despite the constant item LvL it will still provide enough fuel for freaks like me to play around with stats - mostly due to many weapon/armor modifications and unique stats composition. While not dragging me AWAY from the game. It's not hard to hit this particular balance spot.

The reward in GW is looking cute. Ad infinity.

Huh..? Well.. one can really make it as a goal to concentrate on "cute" ;p. But it's actually all about prestige - it's true both for WoW and GW2. Even in WoW while getting that item with +20 more agi was nice, it was even better when you could show it off to people. I've seen many people even changing their talent builds after getting an item from final boss of current tier. Your Achievement log is a nice proof of what did you kill in WoW, but nothing says it lauder than big a$$ shoulders made out of that boss's skin :P.

Unfortunately, in WoW not every new tier was made out of pure "awesomenesssssssssss" - which resulted in your char looking not exactly like one would wish. Thankfully, in GW2 you will be able to choose: if you want to keep this new set gained from uber hard dungeon or use transmutation stone to move stats to "better looking" one.

[Jovanaar]

The thing I'm wondering is sidekicking.

Sidekicking is great, and adds so much more challenge into the game. However.

I am an level 80 warrior doing a level 27 dynamic event. I am scaled to level 29. And succes, I get a gold medal and I'm running towards the chest. Will I get level 27 stuff? or level 80 stuff.

[Maarius]

The thing I'm wondering is sidekicking.

Sidekicking is great, and adds so much more challenge into the game. However.

I am an level 80 warrior doing a level 27 dynamic event. I am scaled to level 29. And succes, I get a gold medal and I'm running towards the chest. Will I get level 27 stuff? or level 80 stuff.

that's a good question, I think we don't know yet
I'm asking myself at the moment: if you get downscaled, are your items downscaled too? a developer said, that a downscaled character is more powerful than a charakter with actually that level. I found no official statements on that either.

[whill4]

WoW's progression is fake and like OP already stated is just a carrot on a stick. There really isn't any progression because as you get stronger so does the content. For example your health may increase from 100 to 1000 from one expansion to the next but the bosses increases from a 1000 to 10,000. The overall scale from player to boss never changes. It's just a pseudo feeling of increase in power.

And one thing you are forgetting is that GW2 is extremely driven by the community. The community has a huge influence on how the world progresses and changes from Dynamic Events to WvWvW. The player base is the driving force behind how the world in general progresses. It won't be like other MMOs that every patch you are given a couple more raids, and then after you finish them all you can do is them over, and over, and over. The world and its content is constantly changing.

How endgame should look has been conditioned into our brains for far too long now. It's an extremely outdated system. What makes FPS so popular is you can pick up a controller and start playing right away. There is no grind. You are in the endgame from the beginning with the same weapons, armor, and stats as everyone else and can experience the same joy of shooting people in the face as everyone else. That is how it should be in any game...

[Deleted]

The thing I'm wondering is sidekicking.

Sidekicking is great, and adds so much more challenge into the game. However.

I am an level 80 warrior doing a level 27 dynamic event. I am scaled to level 29. And succes, I get a gold medal and I'm running towards the chest. Will I get level 27 stuff? or level 80 stuff.

Uhm.. you will never, NEVER get any items from open world DE. Only EXP, gold and karma (check wiki) - that's official and confirmed. It's because they do not want you to look for "that" particular DE because it has an item you REALLY need. You are free to roam and do whatever DE you want cause you will be able to buy karma rewards you want anyway.

So now the question is : will karma, gold and exp scale? In my opinion: yes. They are putting so much emphasis on replayability of the game that it would be very counter productive if it was otherwise.

[Einzweidrei]

Is fun not enough?

No, it's not.

If it were, then every commercial fantasy venture... like D&D or MTG or WoW... would have flopped, because people would have been perfectly content having fun sans the framework these products were providing.


Also, OBVIOUSLY part of the fun of an RPG for most everyone, including the OP, is leveling and finding new gear and acquiring new abilities. So even if a game were fun without any of those things, that doesn't mean it would be very much fun, or enough fun that people would play it instead of something else, etc.

[Jovanaar]

Uhm.. you will never, NEVER get any items from open world DE. Only EXP, gold and karma (check wiki) - that's official and confirmed. It's because they do not want you to look for "that" particular DE because it has an item you REALLY need. You are free to roam and do whatever DE you want cause you will be able to buy karma rewards you want anyway.

So now the question is : will karma, gold and exp will scale? In my opinion: yes. They are putting so much emphasis on replayability of the game that it would be very counter productive if it was otherwise.

Good point! So that would mean items will be world drops and/or purchasable from vendors etc.

[Blufossa]

No, it's not.

If it were, then every commercial fantasy venture... like D&D or MTG or WoW... would have flopped, because people would have been perfectly content having fun sans the framework these products were providing.

Also, OBVIOUSLY part of the fun of an RPG for most everyone, including the OP, is leveling and finding new gear and acquiring new abilities. So even if a game were fun without any of those things, that doesn't mean it would be very much fun, or enough fun that people would play it instead of something else, etc.

Fun is enough. People are just small minded and only want to see huge numbers or shiny bits that make them special. What's funny is, all those are easy to get in most MMOs now, regardless of how much you play or not.

I like how Guild Wars 2 will be making the whole game as your leveling experience AND "end game" content. As for gear and whatnot, people need to learn to let go. This new MMO will be changing the game scene and that scares people. I've play numerous games over the past 15+ years that have challenged the gaming experience over and over. I'm glad to welcome more change, so see where GW2 takes us the next few years.

I also find it funny that people anticipated Skyrim, but some of them are "unsure" or "dislike" Guild Wars 2....

When Guild Wars 2 is like the MMO version of Skyrim. Rofl.

[jvbastel]

IIRC some DE's like the shatterer do spawn a loot chest, think I saw this in the convention movies, not sure though