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  1. #1
    Mechagnome Tekloth's Avatar
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    [Fangs of the Father] - F.A.Q

    So lately I've seen an inflation in topics concerning the most basic, already stated things concerning the daggers, so I thought I'd write up an F.A.Q about them, to help the people seeking for information actually find it faster than scouring through 34 pages on the original legendary thread.

    Please DO NOT post anything that's not related to the F.A.Q in this topic, there's a topic already made for discussing about the daggers.

    Also, please read the entirety of this post before posting questions, just in case the answer you're looking for has already been answered in this post.

    F.A.Q

    0.00001. Right, so I have been looking around and got this question: Why is there no mutilate dmg increase? I mean, combat got Sinister Strike, and Sub got Revealing Strike. Is the fact that they're daggers a high enough boost for assassination that they don't need any dmg boost? Will the 3 specs be even with the daggers having a boost to combat and sub?
    I do hope you're kidding? Added for the sake of troll value and fun!


    Jokes aside, here's the F.A.Q

    1. Where do you start the quest chain?
    You obtain the first quest, Proving Your Worth from Lord Afrasastrasz, inside the raid instance, right next to the entrance and to your right.


    2. Will I be able to obtain the legendary daggers from the LFR?
    No, the LFR is excluded from all legendary content, including pickpocketing Hagara.


    3. How long will it take to obtain the daggers?
    According to my calculations, it should take around 7-9 weeks on 25man, and 14-17 weeks on 10man to obtain a pair of daggers.


    4. But the legendaries are daggers! They're useless for combat!
    Actually, no. The damage buff from the main hand dagger increases the damage done by your Sinister Strike and Revealing Strike by 45%. Making them useful for combat aswell.


    5. Will the damage buff from the main hand also increase the buff given by Revealing Strike for your next finisher by 45% as well?
    No, the damage buff is for the initial damage only.


    6. But I'm a casual, I don't have access to a raiding guild, can I still obtain even the phase 1 daggers?
    The first phase only requires the 4th boss to be pickpocketed, after that it's only solo content from there. So yes, anyone who can get to pickpocketing Hagara (in a PuG, not LFR), will be able to obtain at least the 1st phase of the daggers.


    7. I'm getting less stacks in a 3-minute fight as combat as opposed to a lot more stacks as assassination, what's going on?
    Blizzard seems to have balanced the proc rate around the specs, for example combats lower proc rate could prehaps be explained with Restless Blades.


    8. Well what is the proc rate per spec then?
    Assassination: 23.139% chance on white/yellow melee landing, no ICD.
    Combat: 9.438% chance on white/yellow melee landing, no ICD.
    Subtlety: 28.223% chance on white/yellow melee landing, no ICD.
    These chances are multiplied by 0.9 for lvl 89 targets, 0.8 for lvl 90 targets, 0.7 for lvl 91 targets, 0.6 for lvl 92 targets, and 0.5 for lvl 93+ targets.
    After adding a stack, if you have >30 stacks, you have a [1/(51-stacks)] chance to proc the Fury buff.
    NOTE THAT CURRENTLY POISONS CAN PROC STACKS, SO ASSASSINATION HAS SIGNIFICATELY HIGHER PROC RATE THAN WHAT IS SAID HERE


    9. Are there any guides for the legendary quest chain?


    10. What materials are required to complete the quest chain?
    For phase 1, you need to pick pocket Hagara for a [Cryptomancer's Decoder Ring], 10.000g to obtain the [Charging Decoder Ring] and 12 hours of real time (NOTE: not game time) for the quest item to be charged to a [Charged Decoder Ring]. You then turn in the Ring along with a [Solved Cipher], which you get from using the charged ring to solve a [Singed Cipher] obtained from Corastrazsa in the Vermillion Redoubt in Twilight Highlands. For phase 2, you need 333 [Shadowy Gem], collected from [Elementium Gem Cluster] dropped by the Dragon Soul bosses. Each boss will drop 1 Cluster in 10man, and from 1 to 3 clusters in 25man mode. A single cluster can contain anywhere from 3 to 9 Shadowy Gems. For phase 3, you need 60 [Elementium Gem Cluster] dropped by the Dragon Soul bosses plus a [Fragment of Deathwing's Jaw] after turning in the Clusters mentioned before.


    11. If the Gems come from the Clusters, can I accidentally destroy a Cluster for the Gems while on the phase 3 quest to collect the Clusters?
    No, you can't destroy the Clusters while you're on the quest to collect them.
    SPELL_FAILED_CUSTOM_ERROR_149 = "You cannot deconstruct Elementium Gem Clusters while collecting them!";


    12. Can you obtain the [Cryptomancer's Decoder Ring] by sneaking up to Hagara without killing anything?
    No, the location of Hagara cannot be accessed until you have cleared the first 3 bosses. Also, Hagara becomes available after a gauntlet-style trash event. She does not aggro after the gauntlet event ends if no one is standing in the middle, thus giving you more than enough time to stealth and pick pocket her. If it all goes wrong though (read: she detects you and starts attacking), you'll still have Vanish and/or Shadow Dance to back you up.


    13. Could a 25man raiding rogue go into a 10man group which has cleared up to Hagara, pick pocket her, not get saved and start collecting Clusters from the first boss in the 25man?
    It's possible, but 10/25 is irrelevant. You can do it in both raid sizes because as long as you don't participate in the kill of a boss in the instance, you won't get a normal mode ID.


    14. Can multiple rogues pick pocket Hagara during the same reset?
    Currently this is possible by letting a rogue pick pocket her and then wipe/reset her to make her despawn (thus resetting the pockets) and do it again for the other rogues.


    15. Will the proc from the legendaries have any effect Relentless Strikes?
    No, using a finisher will still use up the 5 combo points you have, and the proc will just instantly generate another 5 CP's for you to use.


    16. In a 25 man, can a single rogue open both clusters or is it planned for 25's to have 2 rogues run it at the same time?
    Yes, a single rogue can open both clusters.


    17. How does the wing-effect work on the daggers?
    The wings pop out when you gain the Fury of the Destroyer proc, and last for the duration of the proc. Apparently you can also use the daggers as a parachute for 15 seconds with a 5-minute cooldown, also causing the wings to appear.


    18. Do we know the stats on the legendaries??


    19. Do you have to be online for the 12 hours required for the Decoder Ring to charge?
    No, the timer counts down even if you are offline.


    20. I've sneaked my way through Gilneas only to find that another rogue is killing Hiram Creed, what do I do!?
    Fear not! Anyone standing in the room with the Assassinate Creed quest will get the kill. Thanks Lachtobi!


    21. I wonder if its possible for a non-rogue to summon a rogue guildmate right to Creed. The guards and mobs are phased right?
    You cannot use Have Group, Will Travel while you're inside Gilneas on the quest Assassinate Creed.


    22. Why is my DPS lower as combat with Fear and Vengeance when compared to a normal mode Dragon Soul 2.6 Main Hand?
    From what I know, the superior weapons for combat are as follows: Legendary daggers > Heroic DS weapons > Phase 2 daggers > Normal DS weapons > Phase 1 daggers.


    23. Is the drop rate of the clusters/gems any different on Heroic than it is on Normal?
    The drop rate of the clusters/gems remains the same regardless of which difficulty you killed the boss in.


    24. Can 2 rogues collect the Clusters at the same time?
    Yes, BUT only 1 rogue can loot the Clusters from a single boss, thus effectively doubling the kills required for both rogues if they choose to collect them at the same time.



    If you have any feedback on the F.A.Q you can PM me on the forums, that way you can be sure that your feedback will be read. Any suggestions for improving the post are appreciated as well.

    If you have, or know questions and/or answers not mentioned in this post so far, do post them here so I can add them to the list.
    Last edited by Tekloth; 2012-09-04 at 06:16 AM. Reason: Updates

  2. #2
    Reported for sticky. Really, i'm tired of people asking "but can i get the quests on LFR?"

  3. #3
    Sticky this sweet looking thing.

    In the department of super-marginal-and-borderline-ridiculous stuff: I've noticed that you can target Hagara during the gauntlet - anyone tried Shadowstepping up to her? Would be a way to solo that bit.

  4. #4
    this might be a stupid question and i very much doubt ya can but is it possible to get the qst and stealth your way upto hagara to pickpocket her??

  5. #5
    Mechagnome Tekloth's Avatar
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    11. Can you start the quest chain by sneaking up to Hagara without killing anything?
    No, the Hagara event begins with a gauntlet-style trash event. To pick pocket her, you need to Shadow Dance or Vanish in the middle of the fight and then pick pocket her.

    Reading the F.A.Q before posting is HIGHLY recommended

    EDIT: Redid the wording on 11 to make it a bit more clear.
    Last edited by Tekloth; 2011-11-18 at 10:47 AM.

  6. #6
    Nice FAQ. The number of topics about the daggers has indeed increased a lot in the past few days.

    11) She doesn't aggro instantly after the gauntlet is over if nobody is standing in the middle area. If people don't leave their totems there or are slow, you can pickpocket her without wasting cooldowns.

    12) It's possible but 10/25 is irrelevant. 25m rogue (if clearing thursday, for example) could also join another 25m group on wednesday who cleared up to Hagara. As long as you don't kill a boss you won't get a normal mode ID.

  7. #7
    You may want to add this link into your thread matey. Has everything we need to know about FotF Dagger quest(s), and it's constantly getting updated.

    http://ptr.wowhead.com/forums&topic=196454

    -Az.

    Oh, never mind that actually, just noticed you already supplied the link.
    Last edited by Aziell; 2011-11-18 at 12:32 PM.

  8. #8
    Legendary! Holo's Avatar
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    Looks good, sticky please.

    i5-3570k @ 4.4GHz|8GB DDR3 1600MHz|EVGA GTX 670 FTW x2 SLI|Samsung 830 128GB SSD

  9. #9
    Mechagnome Tekloth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashvael View Post
    Nice FAQ. The number of topics about the daggers has indeed increased a lot in the past few days.

    11) She doesn't aggro instantly after the gauntlet is over if nobody is standing in the middle area. If people don't leave their totems there or are slow, you can pickpocket her without wasting cooldowns.

    12) It's possible but 10/25 is irrelevant. 25m rogue (if clearing thursday, for example) could also join another 25m group on wednesday who cleared up to Hagara. As long as you don't kill a boss you won't get a normal mode ID.
    Thanks for the clarifications! I'll add them to the FAQ.

  10. #10
    High Overlord Ulmaz's Avatar
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    14-16 weeks for 10man, gg

  11. #11
    Mechagnome Tekloth's Avatar
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    Bumping this up a bit, if anyone has any questions not already mentioned in the FAQ do post them here.

  12. #12
    I'd say add what the proc rates for the different specs are, at least what has been determined as of now.

  13. #13
    Mechagnome Tekloth's Avatar
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    Added those in as well now that I found them.

  14. #14
    Thanks a lot =)

  15. #15
    It is fairly interesting how much of it is solo work, though to be fair you still have to raid for these things...anyways great FAQ for sure, summarizes the most important aspects of the quest nicely.

  16. #16
    Herald of the Titans T Man's Avatar
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    Simple queston, not seen it yet but it does bug me.

    With the last set of legendries in the past only 1 person could collect the mats at any given time.

    Am I right in understanding that with the daggers the clusters are given to you when a boss dies under currency, does this mean more than 1 rogue can collect the mats at the same time?

  17. #17
    No, this is not correct. The two currencies you get in Dragon Soul (one from the first 7 bosses and one from Madness of Deathwing) are both used for jewelcrafting gems. The legendary clusters drop from bosses just as the previous farming parts for the legendaries did.

  18. #18
    stickie!
    in a 25man can a single rogue open both clusters or is it planned for 25's to have 2 rogues run it at the same time?
    if you can't have both unopened clusters can you just open one then receive the other afterwards?

  19. #19

  20. #20
    I'm hoping I'm missing something here but if I am reading things right once we get the stage 1 daggers and start collecting boss drops, we need 333x Shadowy Gem which we get by looting and opening Elementium Gem Cluster. Once we have the phase 2 dagger we then need to collect another 60x Elementium Gem Cluster. Would this mean then that say a 10man raid with 2 rogue, both rogues could there their p1's in short order but then rogue1 collects clusters for the ~15 weeks until he has completed his legendary before rogue2 can even start on phase 2?

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