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  1. #1
    Stood in the Fire SaltLakeAtrocity's Avatar
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    Madness of Deathwing issues (10man)

    After almost one-shotting the entire fight on our first attempt before being foiled by a dc'er, we ended up spending the rest of the night wiping to the same spot in the fight. Fourth platform on the very first Elementium Bolt that spawns after Nozdormu's buff is canceled out.

    As a guild who spent about 3 months working on Heroic Ragnaros before this tier, we're almost completely 391s (besides one recently recruited member who is mostly 378s). We should be completely overgeared for any and all aspects of this fight.

    Running 2 tanks, 3 healers, and 5 dps. The order of buffs that we kill off was Ysera, Alexstraza, Nozdormu, Kalecgos, thereby ensuring that the Elementium Bolts didn't deal any raid damage whatsoever until the last platform. Our issue is once we GET to that platform, no matter how we react to the bolt it causes fundamental issues that are not dealt with in guides (presumably the guides were made in PTR where the fight is, again presumably, undertuned).

    We tried stacking everyone at the front side of the platform by the Limb Tentacle as the maximum possible range from the Bolt with a Power Word Barrier and Aura Mastery. The issue with this is when the Elementium Bolt spawns, despite EVERY dps in the group burning down the Mutated Corruption from the moment it spawns it still has a good 5 to 6 million health at this point, therefore a tank is still needed to be near point blank to the Monstrosity while damn near the Elementium Bolt at this same time. There is a huge RNG factor with this that is also noticed, as half the time Impale is being used at the same time the Elementium Bolt is still alive creating an impossible situation. The other half the the time when Impale and the Bolt are off set in a way that makes it possible, Impale is used just seconds before the Bolt reducing the tank's health to dangerous levels right before the impact. Even with saving all cooldowns for the tank at this moment, its still a 50/50 chance whether or not he'll be killed by this process or survive it with less than 20k health in a situation he's potentially completely out of range of heals for. Our best attempts on this fight were mere lucky chance the tank ended up surviving thisand letting us proceed with the rest of the fight, but that was only about half the pulls that we tried with this strategy.

    We tried stacking everyone up at the opposite of the platform near where the aspect is, thereby being able to include the tank IN the Power Word Barrier being used and making sure he's within range of the healers at all times. With this strategy we've tried both spreading out after impact and burning down the Bolt while remaining stacked up, and both ways we get spiky deaths from the ensuring Crush from the Corruption. If we're stacked up it hits the raid and causes at least 1 to 3 people to randomly die, and if we spread out it still instantly kills whoever it inevitably targets. Pulls with either variation of this strategy always failed to beat the soft enrage of Cataclysm due to dead dps.

    We have not tried 6 dps and 2 healing this fight yet, and I am only half-sure that would even change anything (5-6million health is alot for only one other dps to be able to kill; and although the extra dps would be able to guarantee that last tick from the Bolt wouldn't go off, the lack of heals would make the initial impact cause more spiky deaths).

    I am sure there's some fundamental thing that's incredibly obvious that we missed or that we're not doing, but there just isn't that much info on this fight yet and we've been bashing our heads against it for too long.
    -- We'll Dance As The Palaces Burn --

  2. #2
    Drop a healer and kill Nozdormu's platform last. You never eat a bolt, you don't really use 3 healers in that fight to their potential except when a bolt hits anyways, or towards the end of p2 if you don't have an active lust. You could drop a tank and a healer and 7 dps it to push phases faster as well and make killing the bolt and aoe'ing the bloods a non-issue

  3. #3
    this is just an idea, but would it be possible for you to use unholy death knight's AMZ + priest bubble for the elementium bolt? That should easily stop the bolt from killing off people with 2 reductions used at once. I got stuck on this platform was well with a pug group and just trying to offer something haven't tried to help survive the bolt damage.

  4. #4
    We used a similar setup of two tanks, three healers and a similar kill order. We found using heroism on the fourth platform for the Mutated Corruption would kill it at or near the time the bolt came out, removing Impale and the cone damage from the equation. The last section of the fight did not seem to require heroism on 10-man.

  5. #5
    Stood in the Fire SaltLakeAtrocity's Avatar
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    I don't think its relevant for the particular spot in question that we're wiping on. But our comp running this fight is:

    TANKS
    Protection Warrior
    Feral Druid

    HEALERS
    Restoration Druid
    Discipline/Holy Priest
    Holy Paladin

    DPS
    Combat Rogue
    Elemental Shaman
    Balance Druid
    Marksman Hunter (in the place of our usual Arcane Mage who couldn't make that night)
    Destruction/Demo Warlock (running Destro the whole night due to the OP usage of bane of havok)
    Last edited by SaltLakeAtrocity; 2011-12-07 at 05:34 PM.
    -- We'll Dance As The Palaces Burn --

  6. #6
    Our group used the same kill order as yours except we used one Paladin tank for the whole fight and our other tank was DPS. Our paladin tank had enough cooldowns between bubble, bop and his regular defensive cooldowns but you need to be prepared to cancel the bubble and bop asap to prevent any raid deaths due to aggro.

    We were able to kill the Mutated corruption before the elementium bolt on every platform except the last where it was killed pretty well as soon as the bolt hit and we were able to quickly switch to it.

    For the final bolt, our group stacked at the back of the platform near the mutated corruption, except on the other side of the platform. The tank then faced it towards the limb tentacle. We made sure we didn't stack up until right before the bolt hit to ensure we wouldn't get pounded. At that point we would stack barrier, aura mastery, and I think we also used Divine Guardian as well as putting Pain suppression on our tank who was standing away from the group and we didn't really have any issues with people dying at all.

    Edit: In response to slow dps on the mutated corruption, make sure your dps are saving their 2 minute cooldowns for that point of the fight on every platform. There is no need to use them on the limb tentacle whatsoever and ensure your combat rogue is using tricks on your highest dps whenever they can while attacking the mutated corruption. as I stated we were able to kill it before the bolt every time using a Boomkin, warlock, ret paladin, frost dk, Rogue, and enhance shaman. We did not bloodlust at all during any of these platforms and instead used it as soon as the elementium terrors spawned in p2 to help our single tank with tetanus stacks.
    Last edited by Ranam; 2011-12-06 at 08:18 PM.

  7. #7
    Stood in the Fire SaltLakeAtrocity's Avatar
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    We haven't run solo tank yet, but I can't help but feel like on the last platform a second Impale would still go off thereby wiping us. You guys actually kill the Corruption before a second Impale or just run cooldowns to survive the theoretical 800k ish damage that the tank takes with the debuff?
    -- We'll Dance As The Palaces Burn --

  8. #8
    Our platform order was identical. Solution: Save Lay on Hands. Easier with a pally tank but you have a Holy Paladin so it'll work just the same. Also tell your disc to be better.

  9. #9
    We ran 6dps/2tanks/2heals, and we only had 1 impale per platform, the final mutated corruption was iffy for a second impale to go off, but I'd put money on having the 7th dps make that more guarenteed, especially with kalecgos' buff.

  10. #10
    We went with this setup:

    Feral druid tank

    Resto shaman
    Priest (can't remember spec, prob disc)
    Holy Paladin

    Frost DK
    Rogue
    Rogue
    Affli Lock
    Balance Druid
    Arcane Mage

    We pretty much brute forced the encounter. Our kill order was Ysera > Alex > Nozdormu > Kalecgos, meaning we only had one elementium bolt that wasn't slowed down by Nozdormu. We managed to kill the Mutated Corruptions before the bolt had spawned, but on the last mutated corruption we popped heroism to guarantee it, since heroism really isn't needed in the second phase.

    Also make sure that dpsers are popping their cooldowns on mutated corruptions. And for when the elementium bolt landed I (Frost DK) popped icebound fortitude for the initial impact, and then AMS for the ticks whilst we killed the bolt. Killing all the previous tentacles quickly means your tank should be able to hit the last platform with cooldowns ready also, so make sure dps is on the top of their game.

  11. #11
    We went Ysera > Alexstraza > Kalecgos > Nozdormu with 1 tank, 3 heals and rest DPS.

    We had a Paladin tank that was able to survive the 3rd and 4th sets of Impales (2 each) by clever usage of cooldowns. It went something like this:

    3.1: Divine Protection + Spirit Link

    3.2: Ardent Defender (always live, never die, huehuehue)

    4.1: Guardian of the Ancient Kings + DP

    4.2: AD again


    Using that, we could have him live without Kalecgos's DPS so that we could keep Nozdormu's Time Zone to make the bolts trivial.
    Alt-aholics Anonymous member since 2005.

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    85 Restoration Shaman, Elemental off-spec.

  12. #12
    We did it last night with the same strat you used Salt with that order of aspects...
    Make sure you have your healers and dps that do not have bubble/cloak/etc to be under the claw of the dragon. You should also use Aura Mastery, and another CD during the hit. Pally healer should bubble and go nuts on raid/tanks. If you are having a gear problem with one member during the bubble of the holy pally he can Hand of Sacrifice the current tank tanking or someone who dies alot during that phase. I would personally save lust til the end ~ sub 5mill and use raid cds there when they come up...

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by flashur View Post
    And for when the elementium bolt landed I (Frost DK) popped icebound fortitude for the initial impact, and then AMS for the ticks whilst we killed the bolt. Killing all the previous tentacles quickly means your tank should be able to hit the last platform with cooldowns ready also, so make sure dps is on the top of their game.
    We had 5 dps and the Bolt didn't tick at all once it landed... How can you not manage the same with 6?

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by SaltLakeAtrocity View Post
    We haven't run solo tank yet, but I can't help but feel like on the last platform a second Impale would still go off thereby wiping us. You guys actually kill the Corruption before a second Impale or just run cooldowns to survive the theoretical 800k ish damage that the tank takes with the debuff?
    I can't seem to recall, typically when DBM warned that the bolt was coming soon on that platform the Corruption was at ~10-15% so I (ret paladin) would bubble through and I believe our rogue cloaked through the bolt and stay on it while our casters helped and it would either be dead or at around 2ish% right as the bolt landed therefore dying before it got off another impale Our tank was able to survive a second impale on multiple attempts, however, but I guess that's where it helps to have Ardent Defender.
    Last edited by Ranam; 2011-12-06 at 08:35 PM.

  15. #15
    Deleted
    I cannot believe how a prot paladin is making this fight trivial..
    We're using FDk+ Enha sham on tentacle's, and on the 3 platforms, they even die before casting 2nd impale, so i have cooldowns for every platform.
    On the last one, the whole raid, except me stack under the claw, and im just using buble on the 2nd impale, negativating(spelling?) all the damage from impale + bolt.


    We're using 1 tank 3 healers 6 dps.
    Our roster is -

    Tanks :
    Prot paladin

    Healers:
    Hpala
    Rdruid
    Dpriest

    Dps:
    Enha sham
    Frost DK
    Boomkin
    Hunter
    Lock
    Ele sham.

    If platforms are 1 2 3 4
    We're doing 3-1-2-4.
    Our gear isn't that good 381-386iLvl tops, while we farmed 6/7h FL for a while, but RNG is pretty bad with us.

  16. #16
    How my guild handled this was lust on Platform 4 to get the tentacle down before the bolt hits, which usually was the cause of our deaths. Phase 2 you really dont need lust if you can handle adds well.

  17. #17
    Do the same platform order in your first post drop 1 healer, 2T,2H,6Dps

    On last platform kill tentacle before meteor spawns, When you get to phase 2, deal with the first 5 adds properly (3 tentacles / 2 big dudes) once they die, lust and just tunnel the boss, ignore 2nd set of adds, just call out shrapnel so ppl can hit Dream. Also after the first set of tentacles are down and the big adds are out, anyone that didn't have shrapnel target them should be hitting dream.

    We did the exact same order as you on our kill, with the changes above, after spending hours tinkering with other orders (we got p2 in 2 pulls doing G>B>Y>R, so we didn't change it for a while trying to make it work) once we switched to G>R>Y>B it took 2 pulls, cause we didn't pop CD's on the Blue platform 2nd set of blistering tentacles.

  18. #18
    Have you warrior take the Mutated Corruption during the impale+elementium bolt, have him pop Last Stand+Shield Wall before bolt, and both of the buffs will still be up for impale. have him pop Enraged regen as well (this increased the amount of time the healers have to react to low health). You do not need to stack at the opposite end of the platform from the bolt, simply be max range (40ish yards) so that all ranged DPS can immediately get on bolt and reduce its AoE time. This method worked for our attempts, with me being the prot warrior (in my offspec ~380 ilvl).

    Also, running 2 heals 1 tank works well if you have the gear (385+ or so). this makes burning down Corruptions before 2nd impale easy (as long as you always keep a DPS aspect buff). Of course, this is depending on the comfort of your healers.
    Last edited by Dodrin; 2011-12-06 at 08:43 PM.

  19. #19
    Deleted
    I am a feral tank and I always take the second impale. Have him Glyph Frenzied Regeneration and use it with Survival Instincts and Barkskin. I survive at over 60% every freakin time. It is clearly a tank issue

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Whoopsa View Post
    We went Ysera > Alexstraza > Kalecgos > Nozdormu with 1 tank, 3 heals and rest DPS.

    We had a Paladin tank that was able to survive the 3rd and 4th sets of Impales (2 each) by clever usage of cooldowns. It went something like this:

    3.1: Divine Protection + Spirit Link

    3.2: Ardent Defender (always live, never die, huehuehue)

    4.1: Guardian of the Ancient Kings + DP

    4.2: AD again
    AD has a 3-minute cooldown so I don't see how that could work. Did he bubble 4.2?

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