Paladin PvP is simply is a disapointment after 4.3

[Frog]

Ret Pallies are just fine. You need more practice.

Prot Paladins are inferior to other FCs, yeah. Nobody said every class was gonna be good at FCing.

no they are not fine. only someone with absolutely no tiniest clue about pvp/arena in S11 could say that

if youre retri theres only one hope: spec holy. the 60% hammer crit nerf broke retris forever in arena, the only good (active) retri left is Vanguards

@Uriel: thats a prot only talent... Ret doesnt get 3HP from Divine Plea

[zcks]

As I said in another thread

Afraid if your waiting for blizzard to balance PVP especially ret paladins in PVP your going to be waiting forever.

First & foremost WOW is a pve focused game, blizzard only added PvP because of popular demand & has always put very little effort into it vs PVE. At most they only really do major PVP based changes when one of 2 things happen.

1: Large numbers of people complain because of imbalance (note if it is complaints about the imbalance of classes which the designers have personal attachment to IE rogues, warriors & mages then they will often ignore the complaints unless those complaints progress to the point people quit in mass.)

2: When the players of a class/spec which has been historically a free kill finally get tired of their BS & threaten to quit in mass. This however generally leads to blizzard rushing through allot of changed without thought, testing or collecting feedback which causes #1 to happen which in turn leads to sweeping unrelenting nerfs to the class/spec in question like what happened to ret in early wrath.


The best solution is to realize what WoW is, a PVE game with PvP tacked on as an after thought. It's not that it would be impossible for it to become a balanced PvP game it's just that it's impossible with the management team that it has because they refuse to make the changes which the design team has stated are a necessity for it to happen.

Those changes are as follows.

1: A vast expansion on the list of abilities which have separate or altered effects when used on an NPC vs when they are used on a player controlled character.

2: An expansion to the list of abilities available to certain classes/specs which currently & historically have had anemic toolkits for specific roles. Examples would be enhancement shaman & ret paladins who have very small toolkits for their melee roles.

3: This is a choice between 2 options, either A: make each spec of each class hyper specialized in its role & effectively remove the ability to fill off roles with any success (even when outgearing the content greatly) or B: give every class/spec capable of filling 2 or more roles a stance/presence/form type system so that it can be done in a balanced matter.

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Other then doing the last 3 things listed here ^ there is no real way to balance WoW PvP & sadly they are unlikely to happen with the people in charge of management because they are too stuck in their ideas which even they admit cannot be balanced properly.

[Gringgotts]

you may use Divine plea before using zealotry cause it grands 3 points of Holypower and both has similar CD

........................................Only prots get 3 holy power from divine plea.

[Ichimarunico]

Hm. I'm rolling kids with a Ruthless weapon and 371 gear from last season's honor, almost 1800 with only 2 losses so far. Honestly the only thing that I even look twice at is a mage, but they hard counter every single class in the game aside from UH DK so oh well.

[Deleted]

you may use Divine plea before using zealotry cause it grands 3 points of Holypower and both has similar CD

No it doesn't, only as Prot and Prot doesn't have Zealotry.

[Vampiroth]

I run shadow priest ret in 2s and it works just fine. Ret burst is extremely high. And 3 holy power insta heals are OP.

[Rhonen]

Sorry, but I'm having loads of fun in BGs. I gave up on arena long ago, but BGs are still fun for me as Ret. Kill to death ratio is generally 5:1 unless I run into pre-mades. Sure, I no longer get those massive, almost guaranteed crits from HoW during AW, but it's not generally needed if I'm playing smart and not trying to run into a group of allies solo.

Interrupt and belf aoe interrupt/silence bound to 7 and shift+7 on my Naga makes it all good in the hood when dealing with those nasty healers and dps casters. And I never pop wings when fighting mages...I just play them straight up. I rarely get kited 1v1. A mage spending time trying to ss my freedom or waiting for me to pop wings is a dead mage.

"BG hero" until Dec. 20th!

[greyghost]

you must be a new kid on the blocks
i used to nuke both locks and mages quite often when paladin class has cleanse
so dont post or even talk about things that you dont have any idea please
it makes you cluless poster like many trolls in this forums

**looks at talents**

**sees talent that allows Cleanse to function as the exact way that helped Paladins counter Mages a year ago**

Yeah, you're an idiot that'll probably just claim "LOL JUST TROLLIN" in 3 pages.

Get out.

[Requital]

Can't tell if Trolling from poor post or not...

When was Ret ever a Mage Counter?

Seal of Blood countered a ton of CC another reason they removed it IMO. Currently Ret is no longer dependent on AW which is great but they are still easily controlled.

---------- Post added 2011-12-10 at 07:38 PM ----------

I've played retribution since vanilla. Retribution paladins were absurdly underpowered throughout TBC.

No they weren't, Alliance Paladins were because they had Seal of Vengeance still, Horde Paladins had Seal of Blood and by no means were weak. Some of my best BG / Arena memories come from TBC when matches were more about strategy and less about zerg and explode the opponent.

---------- Post added 2011-12-10 at 07:42 PM ----------

**looks at talents**

**sees talent that allows Cleanse to function as the exact way that helped Paladins counter Mages a year ago**

Yeah, you're an idiot that'll probably just claim "LOL JUST TROLLIN" in 3 pages.

Get out.

Seriously you have no idea what you are talking about our cleanse use to be way more powerful than the crap it is now.

[zcks]

**looks at talents**

**sees talent that allows Cleanse to function as the exact way that helped Paladins counter Mages a year ago**

Yeah, you're an idiot that'll probably just claim "LOL JUST TROLLIN" in 3 pages.

Get out.

This ^ shows you have no idea WTF your talking about.

Back in TBC & wrath it did not removes snares unless those snares were magic based. It is the fact that it removed magic debuffs that made it so good because there were allot of things it allowed you to remove including CC on your teammates.

[Retripala]

Ugh.. yeah ret has been my mine for awhile. But I totally used to get on my 70 mage back in wotlk and duel and almost always win against lvl 80 rets. Ret is not a mage counter.. nor has it ever been. A good enough ret will beat a mage if he uses all of his cool downs the right way. But truthfully any ret and mage (frost) of same skill level, the mage is very very likely to win.

[Deleted]

Hm. I'm rolling kids with a Ruthless weapon and 371 gear from last season's honor, almost 1800 with only 2 losses so far. Honestly the only thing that I even look twice at is a mage, but they hard counter every single class in the game aside from UH DK so oh well.

Yeah you are rightz baby
Only mages, lol hard tbh
Are you high or what and name your combo and name of your team so we can see how good you are
Oh god i Will Tell you combos WHO can kick your butt so you can win against sp, lock, dk or even badly player rogue
You know what i play rogue and eat them without Any problem
Stop trolling FOR gods sake man

---------- Post added 2011-12-11 at 10:30 AM ----------

**looks at talents**

**sees talent that allows Cleanse to function as the exact way that helped Paladins counter Mages a year ago**

Yeah, you're an idiot that'll probably just claim "LOL JUST TROLLIN" in 3 pages.

Get out.

You fucking noob troll
Could u please fick off and troll somewhere other forums
They cleanse in WOTLK and paladin fouls remove frost Nova easily and all lock and sp dots druid skare and more
So shut the fick up and move
And yes i used to kick mages and locks With My retri
Good luck

---------- Post added 2011-12-11 at 10:35 AM ----------

I run shadow priest ret in 2s and it works just fine. Ret burst is extremely high. And 3 holy power insta heals are OP.

Ehm burst and retri is not right combo anymore
Any half brak ed noob arena or pvp player Will dispell your shiny wings or you Will be lolcced till they drop
So i wish i fouls meet sp/retri combo in arenas popcorn and TV while i kick your butt With My rogue

Infracted

~Fiddlesnarf

[Shockzalot]

Just don't dual Frost Mages...

As for in BG's / Arena, we are one of the best support classes. I do 2's with a DK friend and we roflstomp *most* combos, Selfless Healer is amazing when spec'd into Last Word, you can literally get your partner to 100% health then pound on someone with 12% increased damage. You also have HoF and HoP for your partner, while using Cleanse on yourself to remove movement impairing debuffs.

My only gripe with Ret is that Warriors & DK's do more damage from the start as their damage cooldowns don't rely on a build up. I wish Zealotry was changed to not require 3 Holy Power, would make a huge difference.

Are you playing in the 1500 bracket or what? Seriously, lol. It's really not that difficult to lock down the Ret with CC, endlessly kiting if you're ranged or to simply force you to play defensively by training you forcing you to bubble up then it's over shortly afterward. Hand of freedom is instantly removed by dispel, purge or spell steal. Have fun going oom spamming cleanse on yourself vs a frost mage or hunter. It's real smart to focus the DK that can heal itself with Dark pact, Lichborne/DC spam in addition to being healed by his partner for incredible amounts, so obviously you're playing in the low brackets because most combos in higher ratings will push your shit in and they'll do it with ease.

[Deleted]

Are you playing in the 1500 bracket or what? Seriously, lol. It's really not that difficult to lock down the Ret with CC, endlessly kiting if you're ranged or to simply force you to play defensively by training you forcing you to bubble up then it's over shortly afterward. Hand of freedom is instantly removed by dispel, purge or spell steal. Have fun going oom spamming cleanse on yourself vs a frost mage or hunter. It's real smart to focus the DK that can heal itself with Dark pact, Lichborne/DC spam in addition to being healed by his partner for incredible amounts, so obviously you're playing in the low brackets because most combos in higher ratings will push your shit in and they'll do it with ease.

My 2's with the DK is for just for cap, I never claimed to be some PvP god. However Ret is viable in 3's and 5's and Rated BG's, you just have to be a good player.

[Deleted]

Yea, I got it:
-Warriors suck in PvP
-Hunters suck in PvP
-Paladins suck in PvP
Whine threads for every single one of them...

It's funny, because 2 of the 3 classes listed got buffed this patch (yes buffed, and finally got the roflcrit talent fixed) And yet there are people whining. Besides, was ret viable before 4.3 then? no, it wasn't, so why do these threads have to come up every patch? We already know this. "Ret needs -insert something another class has-" or "noes Y mages b dispelling our wings"

[Foxroth]

Yea, I got it:
-Warriors suck in PvP
-Hunters suck in PvP
-Paladins suck in PvP
Whine threads for every single one of them...

Yeah, there is always ppl crying, in every class.

But still I feel Ret is not in a good place.
Due the lack of mobility, Ret is just too easy to CC. :/

Or that is, what I feel. (I play only bg's thou.)

[Jetadin]

I see post, i read post.

I LOL at the naysayer, positive posts related to the current state of ret.
Because the VERY BEST they have to say on a positive note is, "Ret is fine," "With the right comp [you can be carried]."

Ret is in awful shape, but at least we get some ability to damage that the other team has to react to right away. It sucks when they do, but fun when they don't

[Reith]

Yeah, there is always ppl crying, in every class.

But still I feel Ret is not in a good place.
Due the lack of mobility, Ret is just too easy to CC. :/

Or that is, what I feel. (I play only bg's thou.)

Well, if anything, that's where Retribution shines: battlegrounds.

[Gungnir]

Well, if anything, that's where Retribution shines: battlegrounds.

I second this statement.

Even in my full PvE gear, I find myself hitting like a museum and forcefully raping the bejeezus out of people. BG's as Ret is truly an enjoyment in life.

[Deleted]

retri paladins were in a good place and was the counter class of mages and locks with cleanse, not like a kneejerks of casters now.
we were a proud shinny melee , not bitches of casters like now /warriors are included).
if you dont know the class that you play, DONT POST HERE and act as if you know any shit about that class.

You sir are the one here who doesn't know a shit about his stuff. Ret PvP in BC was horrible - even in full epic PvP gear nearly any other class in greens could make a mockery out of you, unless you got incredibly lucky.