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  • Sargeras

    364 58.80%
  • Old God forces

    255 41.20%
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  1. #301
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."

    http://wowpedia.org/Herald_Volazj

    A number of Faceless Ones have similar quotes.

    http://wowpedia.org/Mindbender_Ghur%27sha
    http://wowpedia.org/Erudax
    Quote Originally Posted by Torgent View Post
    Blizzard has been quoted before as saying the Titans have killed many of them. Killed.
    Originally Posted by Dave Kosak
    Not every Old God is still alive and plotting. The Titans actually did kill a lot, so this particular Old God is dead. And is safely dead. Not all of the Old Gods were entombed. (Source)

    Y'shaarj breathed love and exhaled hate, inhaled peace and breathed violence... Plus, his name was y'SHAarj. It's pretty safe to connect the dots. :smileyhappy: But Y'shaarj itself is very, very, very dead. (Source)
    Last edited by Aquamonkey; 2013-12-10 at 08:52 PM.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  2. #302
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Originally Posted by Dave Kosak
    Not every Old God is still alive and plotting. The Titans actually did kill a lot, so this particular Old God is dead. And is safely dead. Not all of the Old Gods were entombed. (Source)
    Thanks, I was being lazy

  3. #303
    Warchief shoc's Avatar
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    Considering Sargeras' prime directive is to destroy Azeroth, wouldn't it be in his best interest to destroy the Old Gods to do so? Just imagine the chaos if he killed every Old God, Azeroth would be beyond fucked.
    Shrek is love, Shrek is life.

  4. #304
    Quote Originally Posted by shoc View Post
    Considering Sargeras' prime directive is to destroy Azeroth, wouldn't it be in his best interest to destroy the Old Gods to do so? Just imagine the chaos if he killed every Old God, Azeroth would be beyond fucked.
    Azeroth would be gone :P

  5. #305
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Originally Posted by Dave Kosak
    Not every Old God is still alive and plotting. The Titans actually did kill a lot, so this particular Old God is dead. And is safely dead. Not all of the Old Gods were entombed. (Source)

    Y'shaarj breathed love and exhaled hate, inhaled peace and breathed violence... Plus, his name was y'SHAarj. It's pretty safe to connect the dots. :smileyhappy: But Y'shaarj itself is very, very, very dead. (Source)
    Quote Originally Posted by Torgent View Post
    Blizzard has been quoted before as saying the Titans have killed many of them. Killed.
    Your exact same source also very explicitly says that there are not 7 Sha, and that there are actually only 6. It also contradicts with previous lore in the Tribunal of Ages.

    http://wowpedia.org/Tribunal_of_Ages

    "Abedneum yells: Designation: Old Gods. Old Gods rendered all systems, including Earthen defenseless in order to facilitate assimilation. This matrix destabilization has been termed the Curse of Flesh. Effects of destabilization increased over time.
    Brann Bronzebeard yells: Old Gods eh? So they zapped the Earthen with this Curse of Flesh. And then what?
    Kaddrak yells: Accessing. Creators arrived to extirpate symbiotic infection. Assessment revealed that Old God infestation had grown malignant. Excising parasites would result in loss of host--
    Brann Bronzebeard yells: If they killed the Old Gods Azeroth would have been destroyed."

    Last I checked, Azeroth was still around.

    Not to mention that death itself is very ambiguous in the Warcraft universe. Consider that he actually talks to us...

    All of his whispers:

    You can never leave this place. There is no way home.
    You will die when you leave this place. There is nothing left of your world.
    You have already lost.
    All of your friends are dead.
    No one is coming to save you.
    Your allies will leave you behind.
    You cannot succeed. Your cause is hopeless.
    Your allies think you are weak.
    You do not have the strength to defeat him, you are too weak to carry on.
    With each threat unraveled, a step closer to my realm.
    Another blemish on your soul.
    You will rest in Ny'alotha.
    You should kill them all. You must kill them all.
    Eyes are the windows to the soul. Shatter them forever.
    Pluck their wings. Leave them broken.
    Pay the cost of greatness.
    All should bow before you. Make them!
    All that you have accomplished, all that you have won, yet still you lick the boots of kings.
    Carve more slowly, that I may feed.
    Embrace your rage.
    Caress your fear.
    Gorge your hatred.
    Voice your doubts.
    When you walk among the black forest, you will see.
    I can taste the essence of your soul... it is sweet...



    http://wowpedia.org/Y%27shaarj
    Last edited by Larynx; 2013-12-10 at 09:06 PM.

  6. #306
    Brewmaster Lime's Avatar
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    Maybe the Old Gods can die, but after being given enough time, they reform. They'd be outside the cycle and they could die, proving that both sources are right. But that's just my speculation.

    Big thanks to Yoni for making this Avatar and Signature!

  7. #307
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    Your exact same source also very explicitly says that there are not 7 Sha, and that there are actually only 6. It also contradicts with previous lore in the Tribunal of Ages.

    http://wowpedia.org/Tribunal_of_Ages

    "Abedneum yells: Designation: Old Gods. Old Gods rendered all systems, including Earthen defenseless in order to facilitate assimilation. This matrix destabilization has been termed the Curse of Flesh. Effects of destabilization increased over time.
    Brann Bronzebeard yells: Old Gods eh? So they zapped the Earthen with this Curse of Flesh. And then what?
    Kaddrak yells: Accessing. Creators arrived to extirpate symbiotic infection. Assessment revealed that Old God infestation had grown malignant. Excising parasites would result in loss of host--
    Brann Bronzebeard yells: If they killed the Old Gods Azeroth would have been destroyed."

    Last I checked, Azeroth was still around.

    Not to mention that death itself is very ambiguous in the Warcraft universe. Consider that he actually talks to us...

    All of his whispers:

    You can never leave this place. There is no way home.
    You will die when you leave this place. There is nothing left of your world.
    You have already lost.
    All of your friends are dead.
    No one is coming to save you.
    Your allies will leave you behind.
    You cannot succeed. Your cause is hopeless.
    Your allies think you are weak.
    You do not have the strength to defeat him, you are too weak to carry on.
    With each threat unraveled, a step closer to my realm.
    Another blemish on your soul.
    You will rest in Ny'alotha.
    You should kill them all. You must kill them all.
    Eyes are the windows to the soul. Shatter them forever.
    Pluck their wings. Leave them broken.
    Pay the cost of greatness.
    All should bow before you. Make them!
    All that you have accomplished, all that you have won, yet still you lick the boots of kings.
    Carve more slowly, that I may feed.
    Embrace your rage.
    Caress your fear.
    Gorge your hatred.
    Voice your doubts.
    When you walk among the black forest, you will see.
    I can taste the essence of your soul... it is sweet...



    http://wowpedia.org/Y%27shaarj
    Because they didn't kill the old gods. They imprisoned them for exactly that reason.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lime View Post
    Maybe the Old Gods can die, but after being given enough time, they reform. They'd be outside the cycle and they could die, proving that both sources are right. But that's just my speculation.
    Well that is a possibility but in that same sentence he says Y'shaarj is very very dead. That seems pretty definitive that he isn't coming back.

  8. #308
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    Your exact same source also very explicitly says that there are not 7 Sha, and that there are actually only 6.
    Kosak doesn't say that there are only 6 Sha... He says there are 7, 1 for each of Y'Shaarj's 7 heads, but we only see 6 in the game. This interview happened just after MoP launch, what the 7th Sha was just wasn't revealed until SoO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    It also contradicts with previous lore in the Tribunal of Ages.

    http://wowpedia.org/Tribunal_of_Ages
    No it doesn't...
    Kaddrak yells: Accessing. Creators arrived to extirpate symbiotic infection. Assessment revealed that Old God infestation had grown malignant. Excising parasites would result in loss of host--
    Brann Bronzebeard yells: If they killed the Old Gods Azeroth would have been destroyed.

    How do you think they arrived at that conclusion? They killed some Old Gods, Y'Shaarj included and found out it was bad for the planet.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  9. #309
    Quote Originally Posted by Torgent View Post
    Because they didn't kill the old gods. They imprisoned them for exactly that reason.
    So then now that you apparently disagree with your own refernece

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Originally Posted by Dave Kosak
    Not every Old God is still alive and plotting. The Titans actually did kill a lot, so this particular Old God is dead. And is safely dead. Not all of the Old Gods were entombed. (Source)

    Y'shaarj breathed love and exhaled hate, inhaled peace and breathed violence... Plus, his name was y'SHAarj. It's pretty safe to connect the dots. :smileyhappy: But Y'shaarj itself is very, very, very dead. (Source)
    We go back to my original statement,

    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."

    http://wowpedia.org/Herald_Volazj

    A number of Faceless Ones have similar quotes.

    http://wowpedia.org/Mindbender_Ghur%27sha
    http://wowpedia.org/Erudax

  10. #310
    Field Marshal
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    Your exact same source also very explicitly says that there are not 7 Sha, and that there are actually only 6.
    Well there where 6 sha's in the Shoahoa(I don't know how to spell his name) who where defeated. So that is what he meant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    It also contradicts with previous lore in the Tribunal of Ages.

    http://wowpedia.org/Tribunal_of_Ages

    "Abedneum yells: Designation: Old Gods. Old Gods rendered all systems, including Earthen defenseless in order to facilitate assimilation. This matrix destabilization has been termed the Curse of Flesh. Effects of destabilization increased over time.
    Brann Bronzebeard yells: Old Gods eh? So they zapped the Earthen with this Curse of Flesh. And then what?
    Kaddrak yells: Accessing. Creators arrived to extirpate symbiotic infection. Assessment revealed that Old God infestation had grown malignant. Excising parasites would result in loss of host--
    Brann Bronzebeard yells: If they killed the Old Gods Azeroth would have been destroyed."

    Last I checked, Azeroth was still around.

    Not to mention that death itself is very ambiguous in the Warcraft universe. Consider that he actually talks to us...
    Well the Tribunal of Ages says all OG

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    So then now that you apparently disagree with your own refernece



    We go back to my original statement,

    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."

    http://wowpedia.org/Herald_Volazj

    A number of Faceless Ones have similar quotes.

    http://wowpedia.org/Mindbender_Ghur%27sha
    http://wowpedia.org/Erudax
    Do want to know how much legion members said they where invincable and nobody could threat them.
    Well look at them know

  11. #311
    Brewmaster Lime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torgent View Post
    Well that is a possibility but in that same sentence he says Y'shaarj is very very dead. That seems pretty definitive that he isn't coming back.
    Well, if I've learned anything from Blizzard, it's that nothing stays dead.

    The very very dead part doesn't change my thoughts. For instance, if Garrosh would've been allowed to continue, I could see the Old God using Garrosh as a means to manifest itself and grow it's corruption, slowly coming back. I wouldn't see it as being alive and plotting, just as a natural side effect for their deaths; they'd be doing it unaware. The fact that both C'thun and Y'shaarj whisper after they're dead furthers that speculation.

    But at the end of the day, thats just speculation and nothing more.

    Big thanks to Yoni for making this Avatar and Signature!

  12. #312
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    We go back to my original statement,

    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."

    http://wowpedia.org/Herald_Volazj

    A number of Faceless Ones have similar quotes.

    http://wowpedia.org/Mindbender_Ghur%27sha
    http://wowpedia.org/Erudax
    By all means, please take the subjective opinion of OG followers as facts despite what an author of the lore explicitly says...
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  13. #313
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Kosak doesn't say that there are only 6 Sha... He says there are 7, 1 for each of Y'Shaarj's 7 heads, but we only see 6 in the game. This interview happened just after MoP launch, what the 7th Sha was just wasn't revealed until SoO.
    It is ambiguous at best.


    "Assessment"?

    I don't think we have to assume they offed a few planets to realize that killing Old Gods was bad.

  14. #314
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    So then now that you apparently disagree with your own refernece



    We go back to my original statement,

    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."

    http://wowpedia.org/Herald_Volazj

    A number of Faceless Ones have similar quotes.

    http://wowpedia.org/Mindbender_Ghur%27sha
    http://wowpedia.org/Erudax
    There are old gods on other worlds. The Titans travel the universe and destroy and rebuild planets. They have killed many old gods. Don't argue about lore when you're missing the foundations of the argument lol.

  15. #315
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    By all means, please take the subjective opinion of OG followers as facts despite what an author of the lore explicitly says...
    It doesn't really seem subjective at all to me. Do you know what that word means? "They do not die." What is subjective about the statement?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Torgent View Post
    There are old gods on other worlds. The Titans travel the universe and destroy and rebuild planets. They have killed many old gods. Don't argue about lore when you're missing the foundations of the argument lol.
    Where was it stated that they killed Old Gods on other planets?

  16. #316
    Brewmaster Lime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    It doesn't really seem subjective at all to me. Do you know what that word means? "They do not die." What is subjective about the statement?
    Plenty of followers say that their king is a god, does that make it true? This could very well be the same thing.

    Big thanks to Yoni for making this Avatar and Signature!

  17. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    It doesn't really seem subjective at all to me. Do you know what that word means? "They do not die." What is subjective about the statement?

    - - - Updated - - -



    Where was it stated that they killed Old Gods on other planets?
    AskDev Was stated that there where more OG in other planets. Don't know if killed/imprisoned but atleast more

  18. #318
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    It is ambiguous at best.
    WTF are you talking about? There were always 7, it's just that only 6 were shown in game at the start.
    Originally Posted by Dave Kosak
    We've seen the number 7 quite a bit lately. You've got the 7 Sha manifestations, the 7 burdens of Shaohao, the 7 heads of Y'Shaarj, and in Jaina's book, the annihilation of the 7th Legion. So what's up with the number 7?
    The 7 heads of Y'Shaarj breathed out sort of the 7 burdens. Although, from an early draft of the story, we really only see 6 Sha in the game which has to do with the burdens of Shaohao. (Source)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  19. #319
    Quote Originally Posted by Lime View Post
    Plenty of followers say that their king is a god, does that make it true? This could very well be the same thing.
    And it could very well not be. Discounting several quotes by affiliated servants doesn't do anything else to the other mounds of evidence and obvious hints.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarPP View Post
    AskDev Was stated that there where more OG in other planets. Don't know if killed/imprisoned but atleast more
    It was also in TBC in at least two separate sources. There's still nothing to show that the Old Gods were killed.

    http://www.wowhead.com/npc=22137/
    http://www.wowwiki.com/Quest:Harbinger_of_Doom
    http://wowpedia.org/Harbinger_Skyriss
    Last edited by Larynx; 2013-12-10 at 09:29 PM.

  20. #320
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    And it could very well not be. Discounting several quotes by affiliated servants doesn't do anything else to the other mounds of evidence and obvious hints.

    - - - Updated - - -



    It was also in TBC in at least two separate sources. There's still nothing to show that the Old Gods were killed.
    You're discounting the author, but quoting fictional characters.

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