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  1. #21
    That has to be almost the funniest troll ever!

    Perhaps he's been playing WoW too long to remember that playing a game should be enjoyable. I still play GW1 to this day because it is (a) enjoyable and (b) free to play. Stopped playing WoW some months ago now because it's just a gear race to be honest, and no real further storyline depth, and a grind fest. I know many players that only 'play' WoW 2-3 nights a week for 2-3 hours to raid with their guildies just to get more gear. If they enjoy that, good for them and that is fine. WoW is sadly one dimensional now and that's almost fair after 6 years of being the most successful mmo - note that this does not mean it is the best to play though.

    Further, don't forget, GW1 only has 1 expansion and that is GW:EotN. Nightfall and Factions and Prophecies are all stand-alone, playable worlds and that they all have a common underlying theme is even more brilliant. The other little storyline missions and quest strings that link GW1 to GW2 is a another feather in the cap of a free to play mmorpg that shouldn't have survived over a long period of time.

    To this day, the devs are still putting out small patches for GW1, but those mostly address events and slight pvp imbalances that may still occur.

    Also, many GW2-bashers are overlooking the number of ways that you will be able to play your character and how this will actually benefit the game and its longevity.

    I hope fervently that GW2 in no-way resembles WoW when it comes to skills and gameplay. I hope that the devs do not ask big WoW guilds to test the game out, so that we don't get another WoW-dungeon/raid experience (can see SWTOR suffering from this) and so far it all looks like GW2 will indeed be the fantastic creation that many are waiting for.
    Last edited by Southern; 2011-12-18 at 10:13 AM. Reason: Dbl-ctrl+V

  2. #22
    Do realize Warcraft and SW:TOR are two of most highly successful MMOs ever created. Hardly suffering in any regard.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Markluzz View Post
    There are no subscription fees, which means once you buy the game it's yours, most likely meaning they won't add in patched content except to fix bugs unless you buy it because it would be pointless to give things to players who aren't paying for them.
    I have to assume you really haven't tried out GW1, which would be the best example of something like the model GW is going for, in terms of supporting itself financially. You paid for campaigns, that's true enough but even between campaigns, GW had patches, small and large, as well as seasonal events. Essentially it supports itself two ways:

    1. Campaign sales.
    2. The Online shop, which sells things like vanity items (vanity items being things like costumes you can display over your real gear, for fun and, well, vanity), extra character slots, character renames, character recustomizations and the like.

    Things that might be nice, that you might like, but things that you certainly don't need to function in the game.

    (For example in WoW you pay every month, so although patches are free, they keep you playing and paying), while I know some gamers will literally play whatever game, single player or multi-player over a long time that was never even intended for the game, but most gamers will play the game and once they beat it they move to something else. Although in other Pay to Play MMO's like WoW people will keep playing the game because the content keeps coming and it keeps giving them stuff to do.
    There are a great deal of working no monthly free models out there, some obviously more greedy than others, but many of them, like the current GW1 model, are very fair and manage to support the game nicely.

    In all honestly, monthly fees aren't required of any MMO, at all. Monthly fees are just one possible model out of several viable models. There are even models out there that let you buy, say, a month of playtime, that only gets used up while you're actually playing - not while you're offline (that example comes out of China, mind you).

    I get they can do expansions, but wouldn't it have been better for GW2 to make it pay to play and add patched content, because otherwise I do not see how GW2 will survive with a constant player base for over a year. It seems like a great game, but does not look profitable for them (not that I should care besides the fact that making profit is what keeps them making games).
    The first Guild Wars was released in 2006, had sold more than six-million units, is still supported even to this day, and, more importantly, is still played, even to this day. Past that, now that they no longer release new GW Campaigns, it's had - free - content patches adding things like new quests, events and even items (Winds of Change, as one example). That's in addition to smaller balancing patches.

    You don't even need to look at GW1 as your only example, there are more examples of viable models, outside of the monthly fee model, out there. The monthly fee model is just one viable model out of several for supporting a game financially.
    Last edited by Purple; 2011-12-18 at 10:56 AM.

  4. #24
    Mechagnome Mkalafut's Avatar
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    So tired of seeing threads like this.. Seriously go look at GW1, which by the way still has many active users and has remained free to play with FREE, that's right, FREE game updates and patches. You pay just about as much as you do for WoW expansions, too. Every couple of months to a year, they will come out with one yes. That and micro transactions, which again, YES people do buy, will keep the game afloat. I'm not alone in saying that GW2 will become my main MMO and once it's released, there won't be much getting me away from my keyboard and mouse.

    If you don't think that GW2 will keep your interest, fine. But don't go around creating another pointless thread about wondering whether or not GW2 will last. Just because it's free to play doesn't mean it's the red headed step child of the MMO genre.

    ---------- Post added 2011-12-18 at 11:17 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Fencers View Post
    Do realize Warcraft and SW:TOR are two of most highly successful MMOs ever created. Hardly suffering in any regard.
    Pointless post is pointless? This isn't about SW:TOR or WoW.

    Also back on topic, as Purple pointed out. Winds of Change, (War in Kryta, etc.) are perfect examples of the major updates that you get out of the game.
    Last edited by Mkalafut; 2011-12-18 at 11:18 AM.

  5. #25
    www.tf2.com

    look at team fortress 2 for a successful f2p model that keeps itself fresh. if u r worried that f2p means no new content, then u r worried for nothing.
    new content keeps the players that pay for in-game items playing. the paying customers will subsidise the non-paying customers.

    i think the developers would have long discussed and concluded the how the game would be profitable and popular for the long run way before they conceived anything else. i would not worry about such a fundamental issue.

  6. #26
    Herald of the Titans Platinus's Avatar
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    Guild wars 2 will be fine with the current model. But won't they do some free content patches aswell? Or will it all be expansions?

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  7. #27
    I'm sure there will be some free content patches, just like with GW1. If demand is high enough it will come.

    But realistically, the majority will be from "expansions". Instead of paying $15/month you'll pay $40 every 6 months.

    While it may work out to being almost the same amount of cash, the expansions will be optional - whereas the $15/month that WOW or SWTOR charge are not optional. You'll be able to play GW2 without paying for any expansions, if you like.

  8. #28
    Mechagnome Vewen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Borzo View Post
    I'm sure there will be some free content patches, just like with GW1. If demand is high enough it will come.

    But realistically, the majority will be from "expansions". Instead of paying $15/month you'll pay $40 every 6 months.

    While it may work out to being almost the same amount of cash, the expansions will be optional - whereas the $15/month that WOW or SWTOR charge are not optional. You'll be able to play GW2 without paying for any expansions, if you like.
    And you forget that WoW ALSO charges money for expansion packs. So that has to be taken into account as well.

  9. #29
    The frequent expansions and in-game shop (non-gamebreaking stuff such as character slots, costumes, character creation) will provide a steady cash flow.
    The F2P model is outdated and frankly makes developers lazy. So what if nobody liked the new patch? They still pay, right?
    Arenanet has an incentive to make great content, or it won't be bought. And they have shown with Gw1 that they still provide frequent bug fixes, free content and balancing (skills, pve/pvp) as well after six years. And the cost of expansions will never be higher per month than the $15/month. Plus a game as WoW also had the occasional $40 expansion on top of the monthly fee.

    I also really like the video in post #12.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Mkalafut View Post
    Pointless post is pointless? This isn't about SW:TOR or WoW.
    Read the post above mine. Learn2forum. XD

    The guy above me was talking about perceived flaws in Warcraft/SW:TOR. Which is pretty flimsy as they are highly successful games. The former so success it has dominated the market, solely defined 2nd era MMOs and become a cultural touchstone. Bioware inviting prestige guilds to testing is hardly causing SWTOR to "suffer". It's a smashing success as is (quite obviously) the Blizzard juggernaut of MMOs.

    GW2's differences from those tropes is no great shakes.

  11. #31
    most of the money will come from the ncsoft store, where people can buy thinks like armor skin or weapon skins

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Purple View Post
    The first Guild Wars was released in 2006, had sold more than six-million units, is still supported even to this day, and, more importantly, is still played, even to this day. Past that, now that they no longer release new GW Campaigns, it's had - free - content patches adding things like new quests, events and even items (Winds of Change, as one example). That's in addition to smaller balancing patches.
    It was released in April 2005 actually. My necromancer was created in June 2005 and had his 6th birthday present this year.
    Other than that no comment

  13. #33
    Herald of the Titans Keosen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jit View Post
    Guild wars 1 thats all I can say for now.
    GW1 wasn't successful enough to judge form it the no-sub plan.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Keosen View Post
    GW1 wasn't successful enough to judge form it the no-sub plan.
    Wasn't successful enough? Hmmm, Strange that 7 million copies would disagree

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Sundreamer View Post
    most of the money will come from the ncsoft store, where people can buy thinks like armor skin or weapon skins
    I'm pretty sure the in-game shop will not sell armor and weapon skins. Otherwise, source ?

    And it is Guild Wars/Arenanets store. Not NCsoft.
    Last edited by Ghostrider; 2011-12-18 at 07:44 PM.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostrider View Post
    I'm pretty sure the in-game shop will not sell armor and weapon skins. Otherwise, source ?
    He's referring to the vanity items that transform your armour into a specified look. It doesn't do anything but change the look. See it as a transmogrification but with unique skins. Bit like an overcoat :P
    It's already used in GW1 so highly likely it will be used again.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Keosen View Post
    GW1 wasn't successful enough to judge form it the no-sub plan.
    It's one the most successful PC games ever made. And the most successful B2P game in existence currently. So much so Anet are able to double (triple?) their staff and fund an entire sequel without an Activision on their shoulder.

    How is Guild Wars 1 not successful and proven as a business model?

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Karei View Post
    He's referring to the vanity items that transform your armour into a specified look. It doesn't do anything but change the look. See it as a transmogrification but with unique skins. Bit like an overcoat :P
    It's already used in GW1 so highly likely it will be used again.
    You mean a costume. Not to be confused with armor skin.

    http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Costume

  19. #39
    Going from the GW1 model, which has worked for quite a bit of time, the gw2 store will not be selling actual weapon armor or skins. As this is one of the main points of guildwars, after reaching max lvl in gw1, you went hunting for the peices of gear you found to be the coolest looking. Im guessing the store will sell full costumes tho, like the ones in gw1's store now, along with the usual account things like name changes, character slots, extra storage slots, and others. Transmog potions of other chars in game may be available, but in gw1 you currently have to either farm for those or get them in a 6th year b-day present.

  20. #40
    I think more people will go to it, I know the monthly fee for SWOTR is quite offputting considering I always return to WoW. Whether it will last, well definitely, there's a huge buzz around it and I think people want a change so yeah, i'm hoping it all goes well.

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