Page 46 of 48 FirstFirst ...
36
44
45
46
47
48
LastLast
  1. #901
    Deleted
    Big gratz!

  2. #902

    Holy Hell, people

    What has been established:

    1. Their double lockouts for were FL only
    2. Their double lockouts did not have any effect on the number of DWs attained
    3. #2 has already been categorically itemized by a poster above, by date. A number of their DWs were created through PUGs or absorbed through recruitment
    4. They identified a requirement (heavy burst) and geared/recruited/specced for it

    Know what all of this amounts to? They played the game better and got the big W first. Class stacking has always been a viable strategy - since Vanilla. I, a veteran rogue in our guild, who was present for world first Vanilla Ragnaros, had to sit out on one of the first of few Ony40 kills in the world because they needed a non-guildy hunter for the air phase. Was I butt hurt a bit by it afterwards? Sure, but my guildleader was leading a world first progression guild, not a "everyone come out and play the class you have the most fun with and let's have fun killing the boss!!!1" guild.

    Is anything stopping Paragon/Blood Legion from recruiting a couple out-of-guild mages or sub rogues to ease spine? Nope. If they identified the need for burst early on and didn't do anything proactive about it, then they weren't truly playing for world first. If they did identify this, and the classes did show up, and they still don't have a kill, then it's a failure to execute. If they were executing near-perfect but a member was underperforming, then they should have immediately replaced them. None of this is the # of dragonwraths or FL lockouts. This is failure to do what needed to be done for a world first kill. This goes for any guild. Anyone not acknowledging this is willfully ignorant.

    I did want to touch on the question of race, since it has been directly or indirectly brought up because of this. I was a competitive gamer for quite some time prior. I played 1v1 and TDM competitively in Quake 2, 3 and 4(lol4) and then raided competitively in EverQuest & WoW. There are a couple certainties I've learned from both genres: EU teams are traditionally amazing at communication and 'group think', and Asian teams are traditionally amazing at individual execution. Am I surprised a Korean guild took world first? Hell no. There was an asian EQ raiding guild back in the day (Arirang) that was something like 13 people two/three boxing players and keeping up relatively well in the server raiding circuit.

    KIN Raiders identified the need for burst, satisfied the burst check through whatever means possible and then executed the fight(s) perfectly. They did what needed to be done for the kill, so congrats to them.

  3. #903
    spine of deathwing heroic = around 300 attempts
    madness of deathwing heroic = killed at 108th attempt

    source from playforum interview on kin raiders after the kill

  4. #904
    Deleted
    Big gratz, somewhat unexpected but very welcomed. Hoping for a continued place in the first place in the future!
    Only if you could have played on english realms so understanding your kill videos would have been a tad bit easier

  5. #905
    The Patient sixx's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    I'm everywhere and nowhere at the same time!
    Posts
    322
    Quote Originally Posted by hunterxbro View Post
    Yea but does blood legion have 7 arcane mages with legendary staves? Nope, the koreans did.. Wanna know why? They have a roster of 50 people and chop it down to raid stack with what they need, 2 firelands lock outs per week = more classes with staves.
    Dude... I dunno if you serious or just a bad troll...

    Any other top guild out there haves all their casters with legendaries... They all have the same amount of legendaries.

    ---------- Post added 2011-12-20 at 02:34 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by IJustMyUsername View Post
    What has been established:

    1. Their double lockouts for were FL only
    2. Their double lockouts did not have any effect on the number of DWs attained
    3. #2 has already been categorically itemized by a poster above, by date. A number of their DWs were created through PUGs or absorbed through recruitment
    4. They identified a requirement (heavy burst) and geared/recruited/specced for it

    Know what all of this amounts to? They played the game better and got the big W first. Class stacking has always been a viable strategy - since Vanilla. I, a veteran rogue in our guild, who was present for world first Vanilla Ragnaros, had to sit out on one of the first of few Ony40 kills in the world because they needed a non-guildy hunter for the air phase. Was I butt hurt a bit by it afterwards? Sure, but my guildleader was leading a world first progression guild, not a "everyone come out and play the class you have the most fun with and let's have fun killing the boss!!!1" guild.

    Is anything stopping Paragon/Blood Legion from recruiting a couple out-of-guild mages or sub rogues to ease spine? Nope. If they identified the need for burst early on and didn't do anything proactive about it, then they weren't truly playing for world first. If they did identify this, and the classes did show up, and they still don't have a kill, then it's a failure to execute. If they were executing near-perfect but a member was underperforming, then they should have immediately replaced them. None of this is the # of dragonwraths or FL lockouts. This is failure to do what needed to be done for a world first kill. This goes for any guild. Anyone not acknowledging this is willfully ignorant.

    I did want to touch on the question of race, since it has been directly or indirectly brought up because of this. I was a competitive gamer for quite some time prior. I played 1v1 and TDM competitively in Quake 2, 3 and 4(lol4) and then raided competitively in EverQuest & WoW. There are a couple certainties I've learned from both genres: EU teams are traditionally amazing at communication and 'group think', and Asian teams are traditionally amazing at individual execution. Am I surprised a Korean guild took world first? Hell no. There was an asian EQ raiding guild back in the day (Arirang) that was something like 13 people two/three boxing players and keeping up relatively well in the server raiding circuit.

    KIN Raiders identified the need for burst, satisfied the burst check through whatever means possible and then executed the fight(s) perfectly. They did what needed to be done for the kill, so congrats to them.

    I approve this. Same thing I've been thinking...

  6. #906
    Herald of the Titans
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Taco Bell
    Posts
    2,599
    Quote Originally Posted by Sjekboef View Post
    they raid 7 times a week... 2 a day or something? Man. Sorry to say but if that's true: get a life!
    It's what all WF guilds do. It's several weeks of intense activity and drops to normal activity after the race is over.
    I'm a crazy taco.

  7. #907
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaneiac View Post
    Lich King Heroic was downed in like, 4 weeks. And they had 50 attempts per week. You can deduce that Heroic LK would have died in a matter of days if there wasn't a restriction on attempts.

    This is no different.

    Listen, and please read this:

    BLACK TEMPLE WAS CLEARED IN 8 DAYS
    FIRST 3 BOSSES OF SUNWELL WERE KILLED THE SAME DAY. THE NEXT 3 WERE KILLED WITHIN 1 WEEK OF EACH BEING AVAILABLE

    Dude, this is not a new phenomenon. It's been going on since BC. Shit is dying incredibly fast. 14 days for an unlimited, ungated final raid is actually pretty long.
    It saddens me that so many here pay attention to this race and talk about how easy DS is when it's just a ridiculous conclusion and things have always died so fast...

    It also saddens me how so many people here are too lazy to read ANYTHING, and just make their "lol 19 legendaries" posts and never realize how wrong they are.

  8. #908
    Quote Originally Posted by Herecius View Post
    I will certainly agree on this point. A longer race in general is more fun, though at the same time, both Sunwell and ICC had to be artificially extended with gating to make the race longer, and I'm not too fond of gating at all. I wish there was some magical way to make bosses take longer to kill without making them absolutely impossible, but that's probably just a pipe dream.
    Though this is still gating, make it so you have to attune again. make it so players have to build an object or get a drop in the raid to open up different parts of the dungeon. drop 2 in 10 man, and 5 in 25 for equality. It should reduce alt swapping and many of the other tricks guilds do to cheese gear.

    Or maybe there is no solution other than like you said, make it super hard. I don't know. If I had the answer, I would be a game designed.

  9. #909
    Anyone else getting a laugh at all these sore losers trying to dig up anything they can to make this world first seem less epic, or not count? Can't a guild just be, I dunno, good? As soon as Paragons name isn't in the title its suddenly a giant conspiracy. Losing sucks, but get over it I say and give these guys a damn high five for cleaning house!

  10. #910
    Quote Originally Posted by nehunter View Post
    historically?

    BC - Sunwell gated
    Wotlk - ICC gated
    During which time, guilds spent gearing up.

    There was a lot of gearing time, and those guys were far better geared (relatively) than the people now were.

  11. #911
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Sjekboef View Post
    they raid 7 times a week... 2 a day or something? Man. Sorry to say but if that's true: get a life!
    Actually, if youd have understanding how this all works youd know that.. Well.. 95% of the very users on these forums, play alot more than many people in the world top guilds.

    The REAL hardcore players are the casuals, yes thats right casuals.

  12. #912
    LFR
    Normal
    Heroic
    Korean

    Gratz again guys

  13. #913
    Quote Originally Posted by linusivar View Post
    LFR
    Normal
    Heroic
    Korean

    Gratz again guys
    LMAO


    Grats to them

  14. #914
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaneiac View Post
    Lich King Heroic was downed in like, 4 weeks. And they had 50 attempts per week. You can deduce that Heroic LK would have died in a matter of days if there wasn't a restriction on attempts.
    Yeah cause no one gathered gear for a whole raid in those 4 weeks from 11 other bosses / completed shadowmourns.. way to go champ

  15. #915
    Class stacking is clearly hacking... Damn those Koreans for stacking Mages.... or

  16. #916
    @foolishness
    In the case of Nef, it was somekind of a exploit that got hotfixed like 1 or 2 days after

  17. #917
    KIN Raiders said they had about 300+ tries for the Spine and 108 tries for Madness

  18. #918

  19. #919
    Blademaster
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    26
    To everyone saying that the resets gave them double the staves, they head 19, 4 of which were from people joining the guild right before 4.3. While paragon had 27 staves, so the double reset did not give them any advantage at all. Paragon's alts were all fully geared out in 4.2 heroic gear, KIN was not ahead of anyone in anything but skill and tactics.

  20. #920
    Quote Originally Posted by Knaar View Post
    @foolishness
    In the case of Nef, it was somekind of a exploit that got hotfixed like 1 or 2 days after
    Ya, they were rooting the adds, right? Regardless, it was class stacking and resulted in a WF end boss kill, no? Hell rooting had WAY more of change on the encounter then legendaries.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •