I can be brutal because I still love it

[Rebirth1108]

I like how you're trying to discuss something, but when met with actual testimonies from people who've gone through what you're describing, you're flat-out refusing to accept anything but your own point of view :/

All of this and then some, no reason with a 5yr old whining over and over...

[A dot Ham]

I like how you're trying to discuss something, but when met with actual testimonies from people who've gone through what you're describing, you're flat-out refusing to accept anything but your own point of view :/

Actually there have only be 3 'testimonies'...

Smokii - who wrote it gets better at lvls 14+ (i'm 21 and still experiencing issues with it)
Jvbastel - who said if tank is good shouldn't be an issue (what if tank is mediocre)

Then yours regarding higher level and threat reduction talents and aoe threat abilities on tanks.

General consensus is... it get better at higher levels. (Point Received)

But I haven't addressed (or refused to accept) those testimonies until this post...

---------- Post added 2011-12-22 at 06:39 AM ----------

All of this and then some, no reason with a 5yr old whining over and over...

LOL @ age.

You consider my post to be childish and yet feel the need to respond... really shows your maturity, LOL!

Thanks for putting me in my place Daddy!

[Gallahadd]

I kinda agree... I agree on the LOVING the game part at least :P

As for the swapping issue.. I've NEVER had a problem with this, mostly because for me the game itself autoswaps people, so say we have two people in shard one, and one in shard two, it'll autoswap everyone to shard one.

As for threat, it's mostly a L2P issue, I'm leveling a Tankasin, been a tank since ever in every MMO I've ever played, and I've got to say Tanking in Swtor is some of the hardest I've tried yet, so there is a pretty harsh learning curve on it, that should improve over time as people learn to tank with the new systems.

[Deleted]

Nope wrong. Next!

(1) If the design of the system were better players wouldn't be making errors. Its a poor design.

(2) Stealing and keeping aggro as a healer is NOT MY fault. If it was purely player error then dps would also pull and hold aggro, and that isn't the case. There ARE threat issues.

How about this post then?

His point is perfectly fine, TOR at this point isn't retard-friendly, you are in danger if you're not at least a little bit careful, and as a healer, you'll be generating threat from everything around you before the tank has aoe abilities or you have threat reduction. The whole 'issue' lasts for maybe 4-6 levels. If the tank as much as hits every mob that hasn't been cc'd with an attack before starting to focus on one, you'll have no problem at all. It does come down to player error.

[shadet]

Nope wrong. Next!

(2) Stealing and keeping aggro as a healer is NOT MY fault. If it was purely player error then dps would also pull and hold aggro, and that isn't the case. There ARE threat issues.

I presume

a) You are not trying to blame threat issues under level 17ish when tank classes have much better threat, a taunt and a guard spell..

b) You are always the focus of the Guard spell from the tank? If not... Ask for... Ney.. Demand it!

c) You are staying within guard radius of the tank or else you will not get the threat reduction

d) You are healing in your Healing stance

If all of those criteria are met then there are two choices. Healer threat is too high OR player error. If you have a mob beating on you for the duration of a fight then to be quite honest it's going to be player error as the tank isn't taunting off you.

I play a Sith Warrior tank and I honestly can say I have never experienced any healer out-threating me on any occasion since getting my tank stance.

[A dot Ham]

How about this post then?

His point is perfectly fine, TOR at this point isn't retard-friendly, you are in danger if you're not at least a little bit careful, and as a healer, you'll be generating threat from everything around you before the tank has aoe abilities or you have threat reduction. The whole 'issue' lasts for maybe 4-6 levels. If the tank as much as hits every mob that hasn't been cc'd with an attack before starting to focus on one, you'll have no problem at all. It does come down to player error.

I disagreed and gave my reasoning for it...

Not refusing to accept it, I'm disagreeing there is a difference. The post in question and its poster... never returned.

He popped in to give a one liner asshole troll response with no discussion, testimony, or evidence to the contrary, and popped out... end of story.

This was hardly testimony.


---------- Post added 2011-12-22 at 06:48 AM ----------

I presume

a) You are not trying to blame threat issues under level 17ish when tank classes have much better threat, a taunt and a guard spell..

b) You are always the focus of the Guard spell from the tank? If not... Ask for... Ney.. Demand it!

c) You are staying within guard radius of the tank or else you will not get the threat reduction

d) You are healing in your Healing stance

If all of those criteria are met then there are two choices. Healer threat is too high OR player error. If you have a mob beating on you for the duration of a fight then to be quite honest it's going to be player error as the tank isn't taunting off you.

I play a Sith Warrior tank and I honestly can say I have never experienced any healer out-threating me on any occasion since getting my tank stance.

At the risk of eternal flaming and a deflated ego... Healing Stance?

[shadet]

It could be my deflated ego and eternal flaming... But.. My only knowledge of "playing" healing classes is by using companions as healers. Both of my companions that can heal have a specific stance that increases healing done and reduces threat. I presumed it would be the same on a healing specced player.

[A dot Ham]

It could be my deflated ego and eternal flaming... But.. My only knowledge of "playing" healing classes is by using companions as healers. Both of my companions that can heal have a specific stance that increases healing done and reduces threat. I presumed it would be the same on a healing specced player.

Oh...

ya I don't think so... I'm looking at my abilities right now I don't see one.

[Lathais]

I don't think healers have stances the way tanks do, I could be wrong though as I have not played a healer yet. I will ask my healer tonight.

If you are having problems, I suggest you find different people to play with. By now, if you have been grouping up you should have started to notice some people over and over. People leveling at the same speed as you. I know I have. There are several people that I see all the time as I am out questing. I talk to these people and become their friend, if they are good. If they are bad, I tell them what they are doing wrong, if they listen, or at least have decent responses, I'll friend them. If they are asshats and refuse to listen I ignore them. I also have a guild with people, most of which are leveling at my speed. Having done this, I end up not grouping with baddies too often, and when I do, I am able to recognize it because I play with good people most of the time.

Maybe it's a social problem and not a player problem? You come here and complain, and when people try to tell you that you are wrong you argue, then more people come along and agree with the people that say you are wrong and you argue further instead of stepping back, looking at yourself and going, well, maybe I'm doing it wrong, maybe i could talk to my tank and work out what's wrong, you just say, nope, I'm doing it right, must be the games fault. I am leaning towards social problem.

[Deleted]

No healing stance so far at least, but yeah, companions do have a healing stance.

[Dundebuns]

I would blame your second point on player error. Did an heroic quest in Nar'Shadda last night (Jedi Freedom Fighters) and the group I was with had one guy who would constantly AoE everything. We were setting up CC on some groups because having 4 people wailing on me (I was the tank) was too much for our healer too handle. When i explained to him that we needed CC, he told me that his AoE was doing too much damage not to use, so when I told him that using his Aoe made the mobs do too much damage for me to survive, he got hissy and left.

that said, tanking is a lot harder, and most people are still in WoW mode so they go and nuke their own targets. It is pretty impossible to tank 2 targets being full nuked by people.

[dakalro]

Dunno about the bugs/crashes, but the whole, transitioning to get all members in the same phase is pretty simple to fix. Communicate more. Say to people, 'let's all go to Coruscant 1' or whatever. I don't class this as a Bioware issue. Communicate more and learn to deal with this technology and it shouldn't be an issue.



Probably a combination of all 3. Most players are still learning how to play, and according to reports Tanking is nowhere near as easy as it is in WoW. That said, there also appears to be less of a need to have a specific Tank: melee can off tank the non-elites, that sort of thing.

Well, when I tried consular shadow tanking I found that at times everything was on cooldown and the base abilities just aren't enough if your group is randomly targeting things. Threat on multiple ranged was the most annoying considering the cooldown of your 1 aoe ability (well, there were 2 but the 2nd one is a knockback ... lololol).

Once I start playing on live I plan on leveling a shadow first and with better keybinds I could possibly try to get my group to assist, then it shouldn't be too hard. Never had the issues of healer keeping aggro, there's always taunt.

[Deleted]

Very simple title. I love the game (probably because I love star wars) so I feel it gives me the right to be overly critical.


Next tanking/healing and aggro(threat)

This could be a player issue, could be a tanking issue, could be a healing issue. In the times that I have successfully (finally) been able to complete a group quest I have run into some major issues. I always pull aggro as a healer and not only do I pull it, but I keep it until the target dies. Now either healing threat is too great, tanking threat is too poor, or the people I am playing with just suck. I tend to think that is actually all 3 for a couple reasons. (1) Even the dps while going balls to the wall, don't pull the target off me (so this is a healing threat issue), (2) a tank while focusing a target should be able to pull aggro off a target regardless (both tank threat issue and tard threat issue).

Threat is really, I mean really weird in swtor, and it requires 140 % attention.

A heal creates 50% less threat than a dps ability.

1 damaging attack in Swtor is equal to 1 threat i.e 100%

1 healing spell is equal to 0.5 i.e 50% ..

All threat modifiers add 50% to your current threat.

Meaning that a tooltipped ability, like Hilt strike | Back Hand creates 200% threat when i Soresu Form, while all other abilites does 150%

This would also mean that your first prio regarding guard, should not be the healer, but a melee or close by ranged dps.

Getting overaggored by a healer, is a pure l2p issue.

That being said, if you are a melee based tank, like jedi, and you do not get a attack off on the ranged mobs, the healer will be able to overaggro you eventually, meaning that you should alsways keep some sort of dmg on all mobs.

It takes +1.3 hate (130%) to overaggro a ranged mob, meaning that if the AI turnover happens, you will need to switch kill target, since you wont win it back with anything but taunt, that being said, as soon as you come into melee range, the AI turnover happens at +1.1 hate (110%), which is still a fair amount if you donot have taunt.

That means if the healer has 5 hate, you will need 5 normal damaging abilities, while in tank stance, or 3 normal and one ability with a threat modifier, with no one else doing damage before the AI turnover will happen.

[Lathais]

Well, when I tried consular shadow tanking I found that at times everything was on cooldown and the base abilities just aren't enough if your group is randomly targeting things. Threat on multiple ranged was the most annoying considering the cooldown of your 1 aoe ability (well, there were 2 but the 2nd one is a knockback ... lololol).

Once I start playing on live I plan on leveling a shadow first and with better keybinds I could possibly try to get my group to assist, then it shouldn't be too hard. Never had the issues of healer keeping aggro, there's always taunt.

As for one of the AoEs being a knockback, use this to your advantage!!! When I have a ranged out away from everything, I run in, hit each thing once with my Force Lightning, Shock or a couple melee hits, then I run to the side of one ranged, position myself so that when I hit my AoE knockback it will punt it near the other ranged then run up and hit my other AoE. Either this, or if the mob is weak/strong, I ignore it and tell the DPS to kill it first.

[Rebirth1108]

Actually there have only be 3 'testimonies'...

Smokii - who wrote it gets better at lvls 14+ (i'm 21 and still experiencing issues with it)
Jvbastel - who said if tank is good shouldn't be an issue (what if tank is mediocre)

Then yours regarding higher level and threat reduction talents and aoe threat abilities on tanks.

General consensus is... it get better at higher levels. (Point Received)

But I haven't addressed (or refused to accept) those testimonies until this post...

---------- Post added 2011-12-22 at 06:39 AM ----------



LOL @ age.

You consider my post to be childish and yet feel the need to respond... really shows your maturity, LOL!

Thanks for putting me in my place Daddy!

Point and game, thanks for playing!