Why did pvp go this way?

[Giggsy]

Hey guys this is my first post on MMO I've heard alot of good things about the community here so I wanted to see what your guys thoughts are.

Why is it people rather run past people than stop and attack. This to me shows that people only care about killing the boss in AV or being the person to cap the node in AB. I remember when AV's took hours to finish now they take 10-15 mins. Yes a couple hours for one AV is to long but the amount of pvp in those are what made it fun. Now people just want to run straight to the boss and down him for the win with little to no pvp involved. Are you one of those people who run past someone in AV to get to the boss or in another BG to cap a node? Or are you the kind of person to dismount and attack?

And why do you think pvp has gone with way?

[sarahfireworks]

Well I usually run past people myself. Really though I'm usually healing, which means me dismounting to attack wouldn't work so well. Now if someone else stop I'm sometimes obliged to help, especially if I can turn the tide in a positive manner by casting a couple of spells.

Really though, I have a bit of a fear of someone calling me out for 'fighting on the road' no matter how good my intentions were. :3

[Lysiander]

Battlegrounds are mission based. Killing players is not the goal but one of the means to achive the objectives of the mission. In AV, the mission is to kill the enemy general. To dismount for a single kill jeopardizes that mission. A group of players dismounting to slow down the enemy force however, is in line with the mission objectives, but rarely happens because it requires coordination that is rarely found in BGs these days.

The majority of people in BGs are there to farm honor for pvp gear so they can do arenas. Fullfilling the BGs mission objective as quickly as possible and moving on to the next BG is much more efficient than farming honorable kills.

So in short, pvp has gone this way because it is unbalanced and next to pointless without everyone having an equal footing in terms of resilience. BGs are the normal instances of the pvp world and arenas the heroic ones. In BGs people just gear up for the heroics basically.

[Prostyle]

Because the people who ignore the BG objectives and just kill/run around in BGs are annoying as fuck, and do not contribute to your team's victory.

[Flaks]

Because the people who ignore the BG objectives and just kill/run around in BGs are annoying as fuck, and do not contribute to your team's victory.

I'm not 100% on what you're trying to say but I'll just point out that in the case of AV the objective entails capping and HOLDING the towers. When that doesn't happen, you lose.

Apparently that doesn't get through most peoples' thick skulls. But that said, if that happens it USUALLY ends up in a turtle that could still turn into a win and turns out to be aa 45 minute match with an easy 700+ honor from it. Nothing more for fun than that.

[Ironmonster]

I think he's asking why isn't everyone a road warrior

The answer is road warriors lose you bgs and who likes losing

When I see 5 people dismount till kill 1 guy in eots I rage internally for a second and accept the loss

[Deleted]

Uhm, people. You do realise that all the BGs has got certain objectives that needs to be completed in order to win, right?

[Illana]

didn't pvp used to mean you had to get a certain amount of HKs before you could buy certain gear?

If so then pvp used to be about killing the other team as much as possible and AV would be the perfect place since it's 40 enemies which you could farm over and over without having to queue for another bg.

Nowadays pvp is about winning/losing as fast as possible to get the most amount of honour per hour as possible. Because there are no gear requirements, just honour costs.

[Brutes]

I prefer the current AV.

[kharsis]

I prefer the current AV.

I prefer the classic AV with summoning of reinforcements, the Elemental Lords, etc. It felt more like a large scale battle than the current nerfed version.

[Stanton Biston]

I prefer the classic AV that I could reliably win in 4-5 minutes. These 10-15 minute matches are ridiculous.

[PizzaSHARK]

Hey guys this is my first post on MMO I've heard alot of good things about the community here so I wanted to see what your guys thoughts are.

Why is it people rather run past people than stop and attack. This to me shows that people only care about killing the boss in AV or being the person to cap the node in AB. I remember when AV's took hours to finish now they take 10-15 mins. Yes a couple hours for one AV is to long but the amount of pvp in those are what made it fun. Now people just want to run straight to the boss and down him for the win with little to no pvp involved. Are you one of those people who run past someone in AV to get to the boss or in another BG to cap a node? Or are you the kind of person to dismount and attack?

And why do you think pvp has gone with way?

Because BGs are about more than just killing other players. There are objectives in each BG that you have to accomplish in order to win. PvP happens in every single BG.

You run past people in midfield in CTF, but you're fighting them on the way back with the flag, or trying to stop them from taking your flag.

You run past people in conquest, but you're still fighting them at each flag node.

You run past people in AV, but you're still fighting them when you're retaking towers or graveyards or mines.

You run past people in SotA and IOC, but you're still fighting them when you're defending vehicles or chasing vehicles.

I don't see where the problem lies. There's no lack of PvP in BGs, if that's what you're getting after. If you're saying there needs to be some kind of rule that people can't ride by each other... well, that's a really dumb idea.

[Cweam]

people would rather get it over with and get their honor

[Spunkk]

You have to work with what you got

[Kaleredar]

Because, as has been said, the point of battlegrounds is mission-based, not "kill all enemy horde" or what have you.

People that break down to fighting right off the bat in, lets say WSG, are being detrimental to that mission. Odds are they won't actually end up slowing down or attacking the flag carrier while they're en route to your flag, and, again, odds are they'll have either all died and left their team members running the flag that much less prepared or continue tunnel visioning the enemies in front of them and allow the enemy flag carrier to just run right on by. Rarely does any good come of it. And that is why it is discouraged,

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

If you are fighting on the road or the middle of the bridge then no amount of help I can provide will make up for your mental retardation. I'm sorry for your condition and it isn't anyone's fault. Battlegrounds are objective based. If you aren't willing to work as part of the team and fight at capture points where it makes a difference then you are not a team player and are in effect a team leech.

If you miss the feel of epic battles then ask blizzard to change the format. Since there are no set objectives or leaders in these things you have to refer to the order of operations and least common denominator.

Everyone is here for gear, finishing a battleground quickly and effectively ensures that the victor gets their reward and the loser doesn't waste their time and can learn from their mistake. If you have something to prove in a 1v1 or 2v2 then there is a special place made just for you...

Specifically I will refer to AV, I understand it has lost the epicness it once garnered. I agree that it used to be better. But winning is better than any of that nostalgia crap.

Capping and defending towers means sticking together and fighting on flags, not chasing after the gnome who popped sprint and will vanish after he leads you into the woods away from the group.

Back capping towers means that that horde of bots and newbs sitting in front of the enemies base wont have to wait long to mash 1 and 2 and can be used most effectively. Sitting in their base does nothing, if you have the wherewithal to complete objectives then group up and go.

Realize when you are beat. Why did you attack that Frost Mage? You are a warrior, if I am also a warrior I'm not going to stop and 'help' you I'm just going to waste time that I could have spent at the next capture point. Time that could be spent sticking to a healer and harassing them. Don't charge into an enemy node when you are alone and they outnumber you, wait 5 seconds for your mates to run up the road and attack as a group.


So enough ranting, all you solo jockeys who think you can change the outcome by watching meters and counting kills do nothing but stroke your own pathetic ego. Want to win? Want to be a real team player? Complete objectives, don't cause us to lose BG because you were busy frapsing for your latest Dubstep-ridden-siezure-inducing-PVP-video.

[Serurian]

As many have said already, noone stops for a random fight because we want to win the match. The mentality of destroying every red name tagged player you see never helps you win, is the same as the person that in WSG is bragging about being top of the damage totals. All they have done all match is zerg fight in the middle when the EFC ran by them over and over, they don't help win. If your one of those people that attacks any red name tagged player you see and I queued on my healer I will ride past maybe /wave at you.

[Saffa]

Because the people who ignore the BG objectives and just kill/run around in BGs are annoying as fuck, and do not contribute to your team's victory.

I have seen them referred to as 'Nappy Brats' - kiddie-mentalities who have no idea what BGs are about and confuse them with arenas, where the only objective is to kill the opposition. If people with this mentality raided they would be kicked the first time they charged off by themselves to attack a mob just because he was there. Unfortunately you cannot kick them in BGs

[Woebegone]

didn't pvp used to mean you had to get a certain amount of HKs before you could buy certain gear?

I don't think there's ever been a HK requirement for gear. The first system had a rank requirement, but gaining honor and rank was fastest by farming short battlegrounds where you win fast, in other words the opposite of AV. Arathi Basin was the most popular choice, because back then it was the only battleground with a victory condition that guaranteed the battleground ended in a timely manner, while AV's and WSG's could potentially go on forever.

As for the original topic - yes, it all boils down to honor/hour rate. People playing just for fun will always be a minority compared to the people who are trying to gear up for arenas or rated BG's.


EDIT: Also, this is a direct result of having several objectives on AV that reward a lot of honor even if you lose. After you've taken out Balinda and bunkers, any extra honor you gain by dealying the game further is simply not worth the time and effort.

[Gandrake]

sometimes objectives are more important than shitting on some random kid

you know you feel like a pro when you pop ER and SW after killing a glaive and being able to hold out just long enough get off a charge and kill the other one