Holy - How much spirit should I aim for?

[Lucetia]

I'm rolling with 3.2k unbuffed spirit and around 4.3k when fully buffed (Have 2 spirit trinkets since nothing else of worth has dropped yet) and never oom unless we're talking about Yor'sahj HC, where it can get quite annoying with the blue debuff.

I know Zaroua of Premonition has build a full spirit set and is walking around with 4.2k spirit unbuffed. It's ridiculously high and fully buffed he'll probably reach over 5k. However he does have haste cap (slightly above even) and while others may think his build is weird, he does have 6/8 HC progress and I will actually follow his build.

Fun fact, he also tried a full mastery build and it seemed amazing for tank healing but other than that it was really not worth giving up haste.

After reading your post I looked him up to see what he was doing with his gear. I swapped to Holy this week due to our comp changing and we needed another healer. How viable is it to change all the Intellect gems to Spirit/combo gems? I would think more intellect would be better due to higher spell power/mana pool, but I could be wrong. Also, what haste cap are you referring to that he has? Every where I looked for 4.3 only mentions a 777 haste cap and anything after that doesn't provide an extra tick. (EJ Holy Radiance info is pre-4.3 sadly).

If it helps any right now we are doing Normal DS 10 with a Resto Shaman healer who mainly heals the raid while I was healing raid / healing tank if they took a lot out of nowhere. Been trying to play with numbers on haste -> Mastery -> crit and feel Haste is better for me but even juggling all my cooldowns I can run to about 15% mana on most fights. Though on Warmaster (did attempts this week since we had missing members) and was oom by the time he landed. One of the issues I know is the lack of replenishment sadly.

[Xami]

Does your raid have replenishment? Sometimes if you don't have the right classes you may not have replenishment, which will result in a noticeable dent in your mana.

I run with about 3.2k unbuffed + LFR spi trinket, and the only fight on DS10 normal that I have to actively manage my mana is spine and madness (we also 3 heal which is a bit of an overkill). Almost all the encounters have some light damage phases where you can activate Divine Plea, so you should get used to using it as often as possible. For example on Madness you can always activate it during platform jump.

Same thing with CD's - paladins have a lot of them, and most are on relatively short cooldown which allows you to use 2-3 times per combat. Once you get used to them, you can plan when to use these cooldowns ahead of time. Also, almost all classes/specs have self-defense cooldowns so if they're not using them at appropriate timings, tell them to start using them to save healer mana.

[Deleted]

We 2 healed madness since the first week it was released, doing 30k each. It's just a matter of maximizing the use of cooldowns, including all the ones that many guilds forget to use such as spriest hymns and feral tranquility (you can use 2 of each on madness). I'd say it's quite doable with any 2 healers that have 390 or higher iLevel.

The only thing i find strange in this is that you mention ilvl, healing ussauly isnt the same as dps where ilvl>everything (witch isnt the case in all dps items but most) so going after ilvl and base what you can and cant heal after that is stupid.

[Xami]

The only thing i find strange in this is that you mention ilvl, healing ussauly isnt the same as dps where ilvl>everything (witch isnt the case in all dps items but most) so going after ilvl and base what you can and cant heal after that is stupid.

In theory, higher ilvl healer will output more healing per encounter, should the damage require it. Certain encounters require at least certain amount of healing/HPS, and if you don't have the ilvl to push out that value, then you'll wipe. In the case of Madness the number seems to be around 60k HPS divided among 2-3 healers. For example 2x healers at 380 ilvl will most likely won't be able to pull it off.

[Deleted]

The only thing i find strange in this is that you mention ilvl, healing ussauly isnt the same as dps where ilvl>everything (witch isnt the case in all dps items but most) so going after ilvl and base what you can and cant heal after that is stupid.

I didn't say iLevel > everything, I was just trying to give an indication of what gear I was discussing. Gear absolutely makes a difference for healing, especially fights like Madness where damage intake is mostly predictable and unavoidable. For fights like that there's only so much that a healer can do in terms of skill, at some point is simply becomes a matter of numbers. So when I said that madness can be easily 2 healed I wanted to specify I wasn't talking about healers in full 378s.

I didn't say for people under 390 to NEVER 2 heal it and for people over 390 to ALWAYS 2 heal it. I was just giving an approximation of where I think you can comfortably 2 heal the fight.

On a side note for most healers iLvl is actually a pretty good determining factor for choosing upgrades. Kind of the same as DPS, the only times I can think of where I would equip a lower level item is for a set bonus, trinket or weapon with special effects (like mace off DW).

[Tutorial]

If you can 2 heal Yor'sahj HC's Black, Red, Yellow, you can do it all :P

Seriously, i've done it with a Disc priest and that was fun. 30k on madness is quite easy to get, as is 40k+ on Yorsahj HC.
That does include Maw Proc.

[Deleted]

If you can 2 heal Yor'sahj HC's Black, Red, Yellow, you can do it all :P

Seriously, i've done it with a Disc priest and that was fun. 30k on madness is quite easy to get, as is 40k+ on Yorsahj HC.
That does include Maw Proc.

Black red yellow isnt really that hard and its for a very shot amount of time and you will more or less always have a raid cd up.

[DjTwEaK91]

If you're still low on mana with that much spirit, you should probably reconsider your throughput cd usage so you don't have to continuously spam huge heals in high damage situations. Either that or your groups could just be taking a lot of stupid damage.

[Deleted]

I myself probably suck at playing holy paladin, no problems heal the areas I play heroics lfr and 2 bosses in 10 man normal.
I do heal ALL the time, but still i only pull 10-13 k heal. I have 378ilvl and think i should be able to pull out much more, i notice same ilvl paladins pull like 18k..
The only thing after reading the posts is that i use CD vary seldom(waiting for harder times) could that make that big difference in number of K healed?

I am feeling like an idiot when doing so low healing while similar geared people pull like 30% more.
Best regards
Thomas

[Ayreon]

Depends entirely on whether you are doing 10 or 25, normal or heroic and what classes (in case of the 10 man) are the other healer(s).

[Taygete]

Are people confusing spirit with combat regen or something? 3600 spirit unbuffed? Are you stacking spirit gems?? Goodness.

As to the OP's question... you have plenty. I'm right around the same spot you are, a little over 3k unbuffed/4.2ish with my trinkets stacked. More is always better, I wouldn't reforge spirit into haste... that's what crit and mastery are for.

[Theholypally]

Are people confusing spirit with combat regen or something? 3600 spirit unbuffed? Are you stacking spirit gems?? Goodness.

As to the OP's question... you have plenty. I'm right around the same spot you are, a little over 3k unbuffed/4.2ish with my trinkets stacked. More is always better, I wouldn't reforge spirit into haste... that's what crit and mastery are for.

Generally no, 20 int / 20 spirit is what most put in blue, 40/50 int in red, 20 int / 20 haste in yellow. DS gear has a TON of spirit on it, im currently at 3435 unbuffed.

[Taygete]

Generally no, 20 int / 20 spirit is what most put in blue, 40/50 int in red, 20 int / 20 haste in yellow. DS gear has a TON of spirit on it, im currently at 3435 unbuffed.

I know how gemming works. :P

At the moment, I have ZERO blue sockets in my gear. 3400 I can see if you happen to have good gear and some blue sockets... but I still think 3600 unbuffed spirit is either an exaggeration, a mistaking of combat regen for spirit, or stacking spirit somewhere else.

[Motoma]

3600 is entirely possible, I'm on 3352 without any blue sockets. I also have one ring, gloves, helm, shield, boots left to upgrade.

[Deleted]

In my opinion its a matter of preference + your healing setup. As someone pointed out here already, DS has a lot of regen phases, however those phases get better with more spirit. I often find myself not having to heal for a periods of time (Yor'sah, Spine, Madness) meaning I can melee and regen. I often go from 10% mana to about 90% in those phases and then I'm ready again to put out some healing.

I'm running with 3670 Spirit unbuffed, with Heart of Unliving (10stacks) 4550 unbuffed spirit. Running with a Resto Shaman, 2 healing most bosses (solohealing Ultraxion) 7/8.

[silverhatred]

I recently reforged all my spirit away and am loving the huge numbers. I play more conservatively but my hps actually increased and I have just as much if not more mana.