The dumbest/worst argument in the history of MMORPGS.

[Saulot]

Granted the argument is stupid but what's really dumb is the fact that you didn't read the part that says you can decide NOT to use the aspects' nerf bat effect.......so who cares honestly? If you want it to be harder, play it that way.

[Jeffyjimbob]

Optional 5% nerf =/= giving things away.

I'm pretty sure before the next major patch comes, we still wont break 10% of active raiders 8/8'ing HMs. I think I read only 4% of raiders cleared 100% T11 and T12 when it was current content, WITH the nerfs. 96% STILL didn't clear every boss, they're not giving things away. Far from it really.

[mistuhbull]

In bold for you. This argument has done more to destroy the culture of mmorpgs than any lack luster content patch ever has (IMO). Incredible, there is no faster way to kill a game than to give everything away. It's hard to believe the "I pay 15$ a month! I want to "see" everthing!" argument has officially won.

Why should someone not get full access to a game they have payed full price for?

[MrHappy]

awww does the special snowflake want to feel specail and laugh at all the "noobs" that are not 8/8hm? plz.....the worst argument is

"if blizz did this the game would be the best ever"

[starkey]

Hey everyone i pay 15 a month so i can sit in a pixel city showing off my new mount, "HEY HANG ON A SECOND" i see other people with the same mount OMG i thought i was the only one, fuck u blizzard.

[Hexotic]

what makes me laugh is this
10 man raid, 1 guy complaining, "i pay $15 a month, my argument matters."
9 other people $135 a month - your argument is invalid.

just something funny I read on my guild forums, it kind of fits with this topic.

[Skytotem]

I think you're missing the point somewhat, even if the OP isn't very clear. People were happy to play for hours on end, even if they weren't top tier people because the thought of reaching the top is always there. The way they've channelled everything into making it incredibly easy to reach the goal of raiding kind of defeats the idea of a subscription model, you can get away with seeing maybe 10% of wow's content before killing DW, in vanilla you would have seen closer to 80% before killing rag.

An average wow player could start a character and kill DW within a month now even with a fulltime job, which is fine and dandy but they're going to hemmorage subs once they realise the people who pay regular subs are the people who play for the journey rather than the end goal, and there is fuck all journey left to be had any more.

The turn of the buff?

[mistuhbull]

I think you're missing the point somewhat, even if the OP isn't very clear. People were happy to play for hours on end, even if they weren't top tier people because the thought of reaching the top is always there. The way they've channelled everything into making it incredibly easy to reach the goal of raiding kind of defeats the idea of a subscription model, you can get away with seeing maybe 10% of wow's content before killing DW, in vanilla you would have seen closer to 80% before killing rag.

An average wow player could start a character and kill DW within a month now even with a fulltime job, which is fine and dandy but they're going to hemmorage subs once they realise the people who pay regular subs are the people who play for the journey rather than the end goal, and there is fuck all journey left to be had any more.

Considering leveling was about 75% of the content in classic, that isn't really saying much

[Murderdoll]

Schedule preventing them from normal raiding times, off the top of my head.

So you are entitled to complete heroic modes because you paid your 15 dollars?

Raiding Normal Modes requires sweet fuck all time. Every raid this expac could be completed easily in one night with a 3 hour sitting. If you cant put that much time in, I dont know why youre subbing...

Its really about time Blizzard just sent us in game mail every time we paid your fee filled with epics.

[dimitri2007]

Democracy is something that caters to all the people someway. When it only caters to a majority over the minority which is deprived of everything, it's called tyranny of majority.

while i dont care to participate in this argument for the most part, i have to correct this individual, Democracy is majority rules, not everyone wins, even if 49% of the people come out feeling screwed its still democracy.


Also, i feel like i should say that while i am only 7/8 normal i do not support these nerfs, i know im not hard core quality, i mess up and so what right do i have to say "i pay 15$ so i should be able to kill everything". i know the people 8/8 HC are fing awesome, and i respect that. i have a full time job and a gf to spend time with, but i still make time to raid 9 hours a week, that's my prerogative, if you dont want to set the time aside to raid, YOU DONT HAVE ANY RIGHT TO SAY I STILL WANNA KILL IT!!! make the time or play something else and stop complaining.

[Hexotic]

Someone said it takes a month to get to kill dw? because new players start off with boa gear right? try leveling from 1-85 with no boa, and do it in a month while working a full time job, good luck sir.

[dimitri2007]

mmos are all about how much time you can commit to them, if you cant commit i dont see why you claim the right to all these things. yes that sucks for people with a "life" but life cant be all roses and peaches

[Epiphanes]

I agree with OP.

What Blizz /should/ do, to fit in with Lore and to make it a proper MMO, is after the World First kills a boss - that boss is dead. At that point no-one else can fight/kill/loot that boss. Stop catering to all these casuals.

EDIT: Let trash respawn - that way people can still farm RFC for xp.

Nerd Preaching Against Casuals:
Blizzard designs a business model to comply with the wishes of 5,000 people (hard-core e-dragon slayers) who will continue to subscribe indefinitely while 9,995,000 cancel their subscriptions due to lack of growth of the casual player base. World of Warcraft fails. The end.

Reality:
Blizzard designs a business model that allows every player, whether they be a hard-core nerd or an adult who casually wishes to "kill" pixels for 2 hours every other day, to access content. Blizzard keeps 10,000,000 active subscriptions and continues to prosper.

You, sir, just got logic'd. This topic is far beyond having any real sense of discussion. People who think they're baws-hog clearing 7/7 H or 7/8 H think they're entitled to being the only ones doing so through means of pressing buttons better. Logically and realistically, $15 is $15 and one persons $15 is entitled to the same thing as another persons $15. It's a game. It's not real life nor will it ever be. If you want true recognition for being good at something, go play a sport and send us a link to a live stream of you winning the Gold at the next World Olympics. Until then, shut the fuck up.

[Drilnos]

I lol'ed when I read that, simply because Blizzard has opposed that argument since like... forever. Oh Blizzard... you remind me of fanboys, only that this is for your own game.



The whole ''this is Blizzard's game, they can do with it what they want'' argument is as dumb as the one in the OP. Sure, they can, but that doesn't mean that we have to like it, if we were blind followers, well hell would know where Blizzard could take this. It is a fact that more and more people decline WoW, especially with MoP upcoming and the giant Dragon Soul flop. Yes, it's Blizzard's game, not ours, but without us they'd be nothing, a think they should learn sooner or later.

"Us". "Ours". "We". These are all terms which presumably encapsulate both myself and you, so they don't apply in this case. Without "us", the Grand Us, that includes everyone, yes, Blizzard would be nothing. Without you, they can manage, somehow.

[kckttk]

Dumb argument for me are the fallowing.
"Omg nerf, just feed items to the casuals"

People demanding harder modes is fine for me yeah i understand people want more challenges but im sure the people who whine about the game being too
easy would also be the first ones to whine when they cant down a boss for like 3 months if the game was harder " omg so hard, omg its bugged, impossible to do this"

Blizzard makes the game for everyone not just the elitists and casuals.
The elitists rush through hardmodes like there is no tomorrow and whine about it when they finish it within the week it came out.
Take it easy maybe? To me some people take it way too serious and want to be special with their kills in raids.

If the pvers are complaning about having to farm the same hm's over and over again should maybe also focus on the pvp aspect of this game?

just my 2cents

[Creeper]

Yes, it's Blizzard's game, not ours, but without us they'd be nothing, a think they should learn sooner or later.

Which is exactly why they're catering towards the majority here. They're much better off losing the few people who are like "But why should the CASUALS get to see MY content?" rather than losing the bunches of 'casuals' who got bored with the game because they couldn't raid.

[gneugen]

I'm just curious what guild thinks they're still competitive at this point. The buff is a choice. If you want the server first and that's what's most important to you, take the buff. If not, ignore it, and continue your progress as normal. People care way to much how they measure up to everyone else. The bottom line is that it's a game, to be enjoyed however you please. Blizzard are giving you more options to pursue your in game goals however you please, yet you complain? How is having more in game freedom a problem? Are you really that obsessed with how you appear to have performed in a video game? The race was over when Heroic Deathwing died. You want Blizzard to cater to you while you race for 1001th place while those who can't stop wiping are looking to clear the rest of the dungeon before MoP? Seriously?

[Tydrane]

The dumbest argument in the history of MMORPGs is the same as the one for all the internets; any argument that invokes Godwin's Law.

[marthsk]

The whole ''this is Blizzard's game, they can do with it what they want'' argument is as dumb as the one in the OP.

Only, it is not an argument; it is fact. You only deem it dumb because, well... there is no rebuttal available to that, and that doesn't suit you well. It is their game, and your choice is to either put up with it, or leave without making a parade as if you were somebody important or relevant.

[tacoloco]

How is it not? It may not be the way you want it to be addressed, but it is a solution. A small gradually increasing nerf is better in my opinion than significant individual boss nerfs.

In -your opinion- it's better. In mine, it's not.

PoTAYto - PoTAHto.

Preserves some of the ego value that some people put into progression.

I don't think the ego value is preserved in any case. There will always be people who who will complain if Blizzard does anything that (GASP!) might mean someone doesn't have to do as much work as they did.

I seems to me if Blizzard mostly didn't touch HC, then all of the whiners wouldn't have a leg to stand on for their complaints. I realize whiners have to whine, but at least there's an argument against their complaints

FWIW, the kind of buff Blizzard is doing is a good solution. The people who really want the challenge should man up and turn it off. If they're not willing to do so and still complain, they're just useless hypocrites.