1. #1

    Healing heroic YorSahj as holy-- advice

    Just wondering how you guys handle purple phase as holy in 25 mans i have heard that renew only gives 1 stack on application and no stacks for ticks if this is true does that mean popping into serenity chucking a renew on and greater healing will keep my group up?

    Im going with the fact that stacks do drop off once during the phase so in total i can build 8 stacks on people in my group during each purple phase.

    As holy is it worth popping bubbles on the ppl in my group or should i conserve my mana here ?

    We have spent a few nights on this and purple we still seem to be loosing ppl

    Any tips or tricks would be fantastic thanks

  2. #2
    You're correct in that Renew ticks nor refreshes do not trigger Deep Corruption, but the Greater Heal itself does. Mana throughout the fight isn't really an issue after you break the first void, because you're continually leeching off of your casters (gg mages ), but your question about "is it worth popping bubbles"... if you're meaning should you shield people? That also causes debuffs and isn't really worth it - especially as Holy.

    In 25 man, unless you're doing a green-up phase with Purple, you'd probably get more bang for your buck using Holy Word: Sanctuary just before the phase starts. The stronger Renew here is your friend, and the stronger Mending is almost ridiculous. The "free" refresh from Serenity is nice, but on any set up that doesn't have a green up, I probably wouldn't worry about it.
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  3. #3
    I spread renews on my group as ooze is getting close, pop hw:sanc as it collides, chakra and then I'm in Serenity with my first GHeal. There's a 50-second period where casting another sanc is a no-no, and I spend so much time hardcasting FH and GHeal during purple that I can't justify staying in ch:sanc. IF your group allows free healing, you can probably get better mileage out of Renew than GHeal, but we had several cases where instants stacked up on the same raidmember causing explosions. Now we do assigned healing - 1 healer assigned to self + 1 group. I find rolling renews to be very potent with group assignments.

    Of course that's 6 targets for renew, and you can't possibly keep 6 renews going with a red/purple/black because you'll be stuck healing reactively. Spread those 6 renews, but don't expect them all to make it to the end. Rely on DP to catch yourself up in an emergency. Using flash and bind isn't really as bad as it seems, since you have 25 seconds per deep corruption reset. That's 19 GCDs split among 6 people, plus a couple for whatever Binds you cast, minus a few more because GHeal should still be more of your activity time. Basically, if you Bind or FH a couple times you should still be safe with debuffs <=4 before the debuff resets. Don't get stuck in the mentality that GHeal is your only meaningful spell.

    If you feel the need to re-apply renews, the best time to do that is right after the 4th void bolt goes out. That signals the time when there are 7 seconds remaining until the deep corruption reset. Make sure you're mending the tank on CD, it goes without saying but your tank healer needs as much support as you can possibly give. Save GS to recover from a tank healing error, and make sure your tank healer knows to call for it if he's gonna be cutting it close on the reset.

    Kelesti's suggestion is good, don't get me wrong. I just couldn't make it work. As illustrated by Spine, Sanc+Renew is extremely good where renew won't overheal much. But, you might have execution difficulties if you let your healers heal freely, so it might not work. Only our paladins free heal (for beacon), and everyone else has rigid assignments. It prevents unpleasent surprises.
    Last edited by zakaluka; 2012-01-23 at 04:31 AM.

  4. #4
    only did it on 10man but i assume its similar:

    1. remember that PoM does not add a stack (on any jump) so make sure that you overuse it on purple phase

    2. if you have a discipline priest in your raid and you play as holy - please - dont bubble people >.< i dont know about holy as i play discipline, so i wont much into spells you should use (especially that above posters already went through it)

    3. be careful with cross-healing on purple phase - the worst thing that can happen on purple phase is overhealing.
    we usually assign groups. for example you are assigned to keep group 2 up. you heal only group 2 (usually with pom on tank on cd). then you wont have situation that both you and 3 other healers spammed something on the same person, resulting in high overhealing and stacks and explosion.

    yes i have frames showing incoming heals but they dont really show me wanting to shield and paladin wanting to holy shock same time, so we rather sticked to assigning of course when theres no debuff we can do cross-healing, and after some kills you stop relying that much on those purple assignments anyway, but it seemed to work well for us when we were progressing on this boss.

    another tip for learning this fight would be dk tank - one that actually knows how and when to heal himself, its never a must but omg it makes fight so much easier!

  5. #5
    We flat out use no ground based healing before the purple phase starts (no sanc/HR) because people moving in/out of them will give them stacks. Not that they should be moving...but we play it safe. I have my group + myself and mostly stick to Gheal spam with binding/flash during at the start when things can be a little hectic (especially if you've just had blue and needed to use hymn of hope). Usually if starting with a blue+ cobo, I'll precast renews/shields simply because i can spare the mana, and it buys me a little time whilst using mana Hymn. Prayer of Mending is mostly used on CD to make the most of the glyph. I'll always be in Serenity chakra but only roll renews on the classes taking the most damage (usually hunters since they have to stand a little outside the group for attack range). Even if not rolling renew on everyone, the increased crit chance is a plus, usually on about 30-35% crit single target without a serenity buff. If I'm desperately behind and have enough stacks spare on a target, I'll serenity+GHeal combo for a high chance of a crit.

    I run high mastery reforge on this fight and more often than not, echo is my top or second for healing done. Sitting on about 34% extra healing through mastery, but I use Foul Gift of the Demon Lord trinket also since it has decent uptime and I value mastery high on this fight.

    If you have a druid, efflorescense (spelling?) is the only ground based heal with zero impact on the deep corruption stacks, but the initial swiftmend WILL give a stack to the target. Our druid uses it on a pet if no one in his group needs the heal, for example.

    We have zero cross healing during purple phases. Paladins beacon healing the tanks (no dk tank is annoying). Without self healing tanks, we make use of ardent defender and guardian spirits to keep them alive beyond 4stacks (they add no additional stack). Desperate prayer is saved for purple phases since it also adds no stacks.

    I've seen disc priests do this fight and swear by their spec...so most things work. This is comfortable for me after a few weeks of experimentation and works fine.

  6. #6
    When you say that ground AoE only gives a single stack upon entering the AoE, does this include if you already are standing in it when the purple debuff triggers? From what I saw last week that's what it looked like in our 10H. Healing Rain and Sanctuary gave everyone automatically 2 stacks and we deemed this as terrible, especially for the MT. We don't have a holy pally to cheese heals on our tank, so we can't only use 3 heals on ours.


    Also, is it considered ok to trigger a 5 stack explosion on the raid assuming they're over ~75% health near the end of a purple (and top them off after)?
    We're trying out the 1 tank method, and it's a bit hairy whether he survives the phase or not.

  7. #7
    themos, healing effects that you have already gained when Deep Corruption applies, give you no stacks. Sanc and Healing Rain are safe as long as they were precast.

    Link me a log, I'll show you where your mystery stacks are coming from. First guess? an LoD or a Holy Radiance.

    In 25 no explosions are allowed. pulsing spiky dmg + a big blanket AoE at the same time will always cause deaths, no matter what. I don't know how the 1 tank method works, but I'm figuring it's rather difficult to avoid exploding the tank.
    Last edited by zakaluka; 2012-01-24 at 12:00 AM.

  8. #8
    Assuming you have 1 group to heal go into Serenity chakra and throw a renew on everyone before the debuff hits. Refreshing renew through serenity doesn't add stacks. I then just flash > flash > greater heal the people taking damage to by honest. No need to exclusively use greater heal as the stacks should reset in time any way. Don't bother bubbling and don't worry about mana, you'll have plenty from mana voids.

    Remember that prayer of mending and lightwell don't add any stacks. I like to throw a 15 stack lightwell down that the tank can spam click and then use mending on him on CD. You can also use mending on people in your group if they are stuck on 4 stacks.

    Really though there's no need to over complicate it, just heal the people that get hit and don't push them to 5 stacks. The only scary purple phase is the one with Purple + Red together. We like to use 1 raid cooldown here (barrier) to make sure we get through it easily.

  9. #9
    I was under the impression lightwell did give you stacks when you clicked on it if it doesnt that will change things in our raids alot if anyone could confirm or deny this that would be fantastic please.

    And thankyou for all the tips i have been reading them and taking notes on everything

  10. #10
    Blademaster mily's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frooty View Post
    I was under the impression lightwell did give you stacks when you clicked on it
    Same here, can anyone CONFIRM this?

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by mily View Post
    Same here, can anyone CONFIRM this?
    I can confirm this.
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  12. #12
    Lightwell adds stacks when you click it. Holy would be so OP for this fight if it didn't.

    So does the heal you cast to refresh your renew in Serenity, IIRC.

    Our first kill (last week wednesday, in fact, seems like so long ago!) of this boss on 10 man came with me (as Holy) and a Holy Paladin. We switched out our Disc Priest for his Hunter (more because he was having trouble with purple phases than because of the spec). For normal phases, the Holy Paladin concentrated on healing the tank (and the raid, GG holy radiance) and I concentrated more on healing the raid. When purple came up, I'd switch to Serenity, and we'd each take one group, and I'd actually focus on the tank - GS is nice for the second round of purple stacks when the tank is starting to get high stacks of the original boss debuff.

    Pre-hotting the raid before purple goes out, using POM as a ghetto flash heal, and overall just using spells that will give you the most bang for your stack (generally Renew and Greater Heal if you're in Serenity). Sometimes, I'll actually just blow up the tank - better to spread damage out over the whole raid (assuming the raid's topped off enough to handle it) than to have a dead tank.

    Also, Binding Heal and Desperate Prayer, combined with Blessed Resilience, means never having to say you're sorry...or maybe that you just never need to worry about getting stacks while healing yourself during purple phase.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post
    Also, is it considered ok to trigger a 5 stack explosion on the raid assuming they're over ~75% health near the end of a purple (and top them off after)?
    We're trying out the 1 tank method, and it's a bit hairy whether he survives the phase or not.
    we explode the tank on normal basis (if we see that he may have issues surviving and no cd is available at the very moment), but ofc only when we know that explosion (and perhaps random hit just after explosion) wont kill anyone.

    i must say that i abuse shields on this part, feels so much safer to trigger the explosion when half+ raid is not only on full hp but also shielded (shield even if glyphed adds only 1 stack).


    zakaluka - i heard that you dont get stacks from pre-casted healing rain as long as ppl stand in it before they get purple debuff. if they step out and back in the circle, while having purple debuff on them, they will get the stack.
    Last edited by babylon; 2012-01-24 at 09:54 AM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by babylon View Post
    zakaluka - i heard that you dont get stacks from pre-casted healing rain as long as ppl stand in it before they get purple debuff. if they step out and back in the circle, while having purple debuff on them, they will get the stack.
    This is the reason we just flat out don't use them. Some classes have range issues, melee positional movement or cone aoe attacks and it's just an unnecessary risk to ensure they all stay within a precasted aoe.

  15. #15
    Healing Rain is stack fodder, especially if it comes from DPS Shaman, and you're sitting there, staring at a dead bars in your raid frame of choice, wondering WHO BLEW UP THE RAID ARRGHHHH.

    Friends don't let friends try to use Healing Rain during a purple phase. Murphy's law...

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by babylon View Post
    zakaluka - i heard that you dont get stacks from pre-casted healing rain as long as ppl stand in it before they get purple debuff. if they step out and back in the circle, while having purple debuff on them, they will get the stack.
    This is consistent with my experience. If you get purple/red/black (the challenging purple combo) everyone should be stacked on a dime in the middle of the boss' hitbox and immobile, even hunters. If anyone gains stacks because they've got happy feet, well I'd call that a personal mistake and not an issue with the healing strategy. A precast Sanc is about 400k raw healing in 25 man, with no stacks. It'd be silly for me to pass that up.

    People keep saying hunters have ranging issues but I think they're just taking their hunters' word for it. Yor has a 0-range hitbox (what do you call this?) where there's no minimum range for hunters to attack. If you're stacking tight the spawns should also bunch up in the same spot. All your hunter has to do for a good AoE cone is strafe one step away and keep yor targeted as a center point for MS. It's enough for AoE, your hunter can be literally ONE step away from the stack. I have personal experience, you can get full-on AoE from right under yor's nose. There's only a range issue if you try to target adds.
    Last edited by zakaluka; 2012-01-24 at 04:08 PM.

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