1. #1

    25m Tank healing best stat?

    hey i need some of your opinions would be awesome.

    ive done some testing between me and some friends on different server and guilds ive made over my 7 years of playing. After reading MANY MANY guides and theorycrafting sites im at a loss, as everyone is conflicting.

    Haste VS Mastery VS Critical Strike

    Priest Discipline

    25man Heroic/Normal DS fights(mostly heroic progression now), with the role of purely tank healer, what is better? most guides say Haste while others say Mastery and almost non of them say Critical Strike.

    BUT after myself and a few tank healing disc priest friends reforge to Critical Strike and everyone has noticed and agreed that there is a better stability and increase in HPS in going crit. also ive found a TINY TINY TINY bit more mana efficenticy but nothing to noticable could just be my playstyle.

    ive also heard from only 1 or 2 people that Disc can really be played with any stat but it depends on your playstyle

    anyone else have these findings or opinions on the topic? remember im talking about purely tank healing. for some reason in these raid teams Holy Pallys have been absent in most.

  2. #2
    I believe simcraft is able to model very basic healing.
    I saw one a while ago (somewhere in t12) that had a rotation such as gheal spam with penance and PoM on CD.

    I can't find the link and I can't recall the results but aside from 'do whatever feels more comfortable' or 'any stat will work it depends on your playstyle'; I think playing around with simcraft is probably going to be your best call for determining what will give the most raw throughput.

  3. #3
    well I wouldn't go for mastery, because that will only benefit PWS when tankhealing. and you will mostly be using PWS for optimal manareturn from Rapture.

    I would recommend crit > haste > mas
    crit is a great HPS stat, and thanks to DA its never completly wasted. Even when reforging out of mastery, you will likely have about 40% DA, so a crit gives you 280% heal. GH can crit up to 100k, thats a bomb :-)

  4. #4
    I don't have much experience with healing 25 mans but if we focus on just tank healing I personally prefer a heavier crit build with haste or mastery to what ever you like really. My reasoning is that with a decent amount of crit ( in or around 18 to 23% unbuffed ) critting with single target spells is actually quite reliable and adding DA into the mix Greater heals will often proc bubbles that are around the same size as a PW:shield ( 30 to 40k DA on a 60 to 70k heal ) that's nothing to scoff at when compared to a non crit build their Gheals equal around 30 to 40k flat healing.

    So a non crit build needs to cast at least 3 greater heals with no crits to equal a single crit Gheal, no amount of haste can beat that when it comes to healing up and protecting a tank.

    In regards to a heavy mastery build with the focus on more PW:shield casts, I can't say its bad because its not but I personally find that focusing on absorbing damage with weaker healing means your relying more on other healers to keep the tank up after they take damage, going on the assumption that a heavy mastery build priest doesn't crit much then their hps is roughly the same as the above example of a non crit haste build.

    For the examples below of the three builds use these rules: low crit builds assume no crits for easy math high crit build assumes a single crit + DA, the rotation is PW:shield + 3x Greater heals to remove weakened soul and repeat.
    -------

    Haste build low crit: 3x greater heals plus PW:shield = 120k @ 30k per Gheal + 30k shield, cast time per Gheal is slightly faster but over all healing for the rotation it's self doesn't change from haste alone, ignore hps for these examples.

    Mastery build low crit: 3x greater heals plus PW:shield = 140k @ 30k per Gheal + 50k shield.

    Crit build: 3x greater heals plus PW:shield = 170k @ 2x 30k 1x 60k Gheal + DA 20k + 30k shield.

    All numbers above are guesstimates but they aren't far off either, I often Crit in streaks 4 or 5 in a row with just under 30% crit buffed so even if a mastery builds PW:shields are bigger I doubt they beat 3x Greater heal crits in terms of healing per rotation.
    Last edited by CoolNitro; 2012-01-29 at 12:12 AM.

  5. #5
    @CoolNitro: very vague assumptions and calculations...
    because of itemisation (not many items with different secondstats for the same slot) and reforge limits, you will probably only be shifting about 10% crit to 10 mas maximally.
    and the mastery guy has abaout 30% crit baseline (buffed of course) aswell, you cant just reckon that the crit guy will crit one in three casts while the mastery guy never does, thats just inventing statistics and displaying them the way you want to. (and tell me as soon as you really have 50k PWS, and tell me how much mastery you have, I guess 25-30? have fun trying to reach that^^)

    oh, and even when you go full crit, you never assume (or expect) a cast to crit. Because you cant, its mathematically wrong. (as long as your under 100%)
    It just happens more often, that you crit, and manage to bomb up the tanks HP with 2 casts, and save the day, when you have more crit :-)
    You should just remember to heal appropriatly when you have high crit! leave room for your critical heals to heal (don't GH when tank is at 85% HP etc)

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTrueM4gg0t View Post
    @CoolNitro: very vague assumptions and calculations...
    because of itemisation (not many items with different secondstats for the same slot) and reforge limits, you will probably only be shifting about 10% crit to 10 mas maximally.
    and the mastery guy has abaout 30% crit baseline (buffed of course) aswell, you cant just reckon that the crit guy will crit one in three casts while the mastery guy never does, thats just inventing statistics and displaying them the way you want to. (and tell me as soon as you really have 50k PWS, and tell me how much mastery you have, I guess 25-30? have fun trying to reach that^^)

    oh, and even when you go full crit, you never assume (or expect) a cast to crit. Because you cant, its mathematically wrong. (as long as your under 100%)
    It just happens more often, that you crit, and manage to bomb up the tanks HP with 2 casts, and save the day, when you have more crit :-)
    You should just remember to heal appropriatly when you have high crit! leave room for your critical heals to heal (don't GH when tank is at 85% HP etc)

    In regards to the 50k PWS I would have thought it was possible for someone with 20% or higher mastery at the moment I have 13% mastery with PWS at 30k though I do have a lot of spell power to back it up. Okay so 50k PWS are kind of unrealistic 40k at most with a proc or two but that just makes a mastery build that crits less even less healing then a high crit build.

    As for crit, no I don't assume I will crit every time or that those who stack haste or mastery don't crit, the idea behind the list was to show the large difference between no crits and a single crit in a simplistic way using a simple rotation that most tank healers would use in situations where the tank is getting eaten.

    As for gearing yea a lot of gear sucks this tier but I still manage to get buffed stats of 29% crit, 18% haste, 13 mastery up to 19% with foul gift every 25 seconds, though I choose some non spirit items and reforged some spirit to get those stats which may not be an option for a 25 man healer.

    You should just remember to heal appropriatly when you have high crit! leave room for your critical heals to heal (don't GH when tank is at 85% HP etc)
    I do agree completely with this but if you ignore triage healing and work with a hypothetical situation where the tank is getting hammered and every heal counts ( take single tanking the two adds in P2 on deathwing without cooldowns ) then large crit Greater heals have more value over slightly larger PWS or slightly faster cast speed.

    Well to a point as with all stats the value of crit is lost beyond a point as it's simply not possible to reach 100% or even plus 50% without inner focus, at one point in FL I had 50% + renewed hope buffed ( wol showed 50% ish give or take 5% on full clear logs ) so it is possible but if you were to stack it that high it would have detrimental effects on mastery, haste, and spirit numbers.

    A good balance of stats is best but if you can find the crit rating that allows you to crit enough while also having decent haste and mastery then your golden as far as single target healing goes well imo anyways.
    Last edited by CoolNitro; 2012-01-29 at 02:15 AM.

  7. #7
    High Overlord Zolvolt's Avatar
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    mastery and haste imo. PW:S yeaaahhh.

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