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  1. #21
    the one bit that bugged me with the story was Quinn..... fecker was 9k affection id done all the story bits with him and hed served me faithfully right through the story. then all of a sudden he turns round and betrays me 'because'... i mean WHAT THE FECK... i wanted an execute option i really did after all i did for him all that time he tries to kill me even though baras tried to bury us on quesh....
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    Plus they have magic and sharp objects.

  2. #22
    Herald of the Titans Beavis's Avatar
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    I guess I'm the only one who wasn't really bothered by the Quinn thing. Firstly, I dropped him like a bad habit when I got Jaesa, so I didn't have the annoying experience of having the guy who betrayed me following me around all the time. But also, I played my guy less as a marauding psychopath than a crusading knight or a samurai. Loves the Empire, loves killing people in combat. So, I choked the shit out of him and said the whole "the only reason you're alive is because you're still useful to me" business. In some ways, that actually felt more Sith-y to me anyway. You feed off his fear and he knows that his life depends entirely on his usefulness. The day he stops being useful is the day he meets the business end of Pierce's assault cannon. (If he had one )

    ---------- Post added 2012-01-30 at 10:26 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Sengura View Post
    I agree with the Quinn betrayal. If it was any other NPC, my SW would have slaughtered him on the spot for betraying me. But Quinn gets special treatment just because he's your companion and you can't kill/get rid of companions. It was a pointless and very dumb plot moment.

    As for the end, I enjoyed it. Getting to kill Baras was very satisfying after spending 10+ levels chasing him down.

    ---------- Post added 2012-01-30 at 09:03 AM ----------



    In the IA story, a Dark Council member fakes his death and attacks and kills thousands of Empire citizens and at the end, he just gets to go to trial, he may even be re-instated... I found that to be weird.
    Thanks for the spoilers on the IA storyline, asshat. At least use the fucking spoiler tags.
    Last edited by Beavis; 2012-01-30 at 10:26 PM.

  3. #23
    None of what you cited could be defined as a plot hole. Disappointing maybe, but certainly not a plot hole.

    A plot hole is when something that occurs in the story goes unexplained. If a character from a book didn't have a magic talking panda last chapter but in the next chapter they do, that's a plot hole.
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  4. #24
    Stood in the Fire viciouss's Avatar
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    Beavis made a point I really agree with, choking the shit out of him and saying you are only alive because you are still useful is alot more sith like then just killing him outright.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Justpassing View Post
    As I saw from the replies, I'm going to elaborate when I said that SI story had set in stone that when you kill a Dark Council member, you replace them: After defeating Thanaton in the Council chambers, you get an epic fucking cutscene in which you completely anhhillate him, and when he's scurrying away on the floor, one of the Darths break his neck with the Force. After that, they do a "Ah well, that's done" speech and one of them points to Thanaton's place and says "Your seat, my lord." To that, I chose "I'm honored, but I just wanted to kill Thanaton" and the guy says "Don't be silly. When you best one of the Council members, you take their place."

    But the point is waaay over your head when you say "but you need friends in high places lol", beacuse you OBVIOUSLY need friends in high places to even be able to get a legit jump on a Council member without getting nuked from the orbit - which you get to do thanks to Baras, but my point was that after you're dealt with Vengean, there is no one stopping you from killing Darth Baras aswell and assuming his spot and his entire power base. You might argue that he might have a plan for that, but really, common sense would argue that you'd be able to foil any of that hack's plans after you are promoted to be the one of the most powerful Sith in the galaxy. It's not like Baras' servants will oppose you when you tell them that you're the boss now. Would they dare to oppose a Dark Council member out of petty spite?
    After being hailed the freaking hero of Corellia and then the anti-climatic killing Baras, I have to wonder if there isn't something really big in store for the warriors. I mean seriously the story was a major let down at the end. Oh, hey yeah I guess you're the Wrath after all. Great, lets go to the space station for some more killing see ya around.

  6. #26
    [QUOTE=As for Quinn, thats a personal opinion, but BioWare did that so you wouldnt lose your only healing companion, and honestly, your only chance to solo Baras on the final fight.[/QUOTE]

    what ?? i just killed him with vette on lvl 49. but maybe they made it a bit easier dunno didnt played earlier

  7. #27
    Elemental Lord Baar's Avatar
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    I always just assumed a few things to be true for sith.

    The master is always stronger than the apprentice. No matter what, this is why sith go for the strong apprentices (even though one day they will betray them)
    (side-note: I'm not saying they truly are stronger they are just regarded as stronger.)

    Another things was the master will always get credit for the apprentices work. The master being the one the taught you, brought you into power. If it wasn't for him you wouldn't be there either.


    This seems to have cleared up the plot holes to me.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by slozon View Post
    I always just assumed a few things to be true for sith.

    The master is always stronger than the apprentice. No matter what, this is why sith go for the strong apprentices (even though one day they will betray them)
    (side-note: I'm not saying they truly are stronger they are just regarded as stronger.)

    Another things was the master will always get credit for the apprentices work. The master being the one the taught you, brought you into power. If it wasn't for him you wouldn't be there either.


    This seems to have cleared up the plot holes to me.
    The "true" way of the darkside does betray any Sith Lord which does not try to make their apprentice stronger than themselve because if the apprentice is not strong enough, he will find other ways to do it. See Palpatine for example. Confronting you Master is the final test for any Sith apprentice which ends either in glory or death. Baras has used his apprentrices up too long, manipulated to many and is meeting someone (you) which has not only more potential but can prove over and over again that you are stronger than him by the time he betrays you. Baras could have been a Dark Council member with your help. He could have sugarcoated you a little longer but instead he made a mistake which will cost him everything he has worked on for so long.

  9. #29
    They shoulda let you kill Quinn but then let you pick up a new healer companion, with companion customization, all they would need to do is set a new face as the default and change the name in text and chat, I mean hell you could even have them use the same VA.

  10. #30
    Pandaren Monk WarpedAcorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frogger237 View Post
    They shoulda let you kill Quinn but then let you pick up a new healer companion, with companion customization, all they would need to do is set a new face as the default and change the name in text and chat, I mean hell you could even have them use the same VA.
    It could be a Quinn clone or his twin brother...exactly the same as Quinn, but with a goatee. =)

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by shadowkras View Post
    but BioWare did that so you wouldnt lose your only healing companion, and honestly, your only chance to solo Baras on the final fight.
    Only chance? Lol, what? I soloed Baras with Vette, Quinn isn't necessary for that fight..

  12. #32
    What bugs me about the Sith Warrior story is the fact that story-wise your clearly more powerful then most of the higher ranking Sith, you literately take over entire planets (or make them stable) for higher ranking Sith yet end of the day your path to promotion is ludicrously slow.

    Another thing that kind of bugs me is how incompetent Baras himself is. He isn't particularly strong in the force (he failed in his missions to many times as proof of his stolen lightsaber), his only strong point is that he knows how to pick winners (all of his spies and you as a student) who do all of the work.

    It kind of surprised me that he even survived his training without losing a arm or 2.

  13. #33
    Pandaren Monk WarpedAcorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ati87 View Post
    What bugs me about the Sith Warrior story is the fact that story-wise your clearly more powerful then most of the higher ranking Sith, you literately take over entire planets (or make them stable) for higher ranking Sith yet end of the day your path to promotion is ludicrously slow.

    Another thing that kind of bugs me is how incompetent Baras himself is. He isn't particularly strong in the force (he failed in his missions to many times as proof of his stolen lightsaber), his only strong point is that he knows how to pick winners (all of his spies and you as a student) who do all of the work.

    It kind of surprised me that he even survived his training without losing a arm or 2.
    I had always assumed that Baras was very strong in the Force. I also viewed him more akin to Darth Plagerous (sp?), who was so much more interested in the Force and studying it that he found Lightsaber combat to be a tedius waste of time. While Baras doesn't seem to delve into the mysteries of the Force or Sith Sorcery, he does invest all of his resources and abilities into political endeavors. He used connections and other people as pawns, weapons, and tools to accomplish his goals. Was he a powerful Sith? Yes. Was he the most powerful Sith? No. He just happened to be really cunning and devious.

    In all, his story reminds me of Conan's "riddle of steel". Unfortunately for him, his steel (the Sith Warrior) was more powerful than the hand that wielded it (himself).

  14. #34
    I am Murloc! SirRobin's Avatar
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    The Sith Warrior story was by far my favorite in the game. Then again, I'm biased since I've been a Sith fan since I first saw Vader walk on the screen in '77.

  15. #35
    Pandaren Monk WarpedAcorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirRobin View Post
    The Sith Warrior story was by far my favorite in the game. Then again, I'm biased since I've been a Sith fan since I first saw Vader walk on the screen in '77.
    I recently have started watching The Clone Wars CG-Animated series and have really enjoyed they way they portrayed Anakin. They are making his transition from Jedi to Sith very slow and deliberate, which is very exciting to watch. I watched an episode last night from Season 2 where Anakin's Padawan was in danger, and the Jedi couldn't get a Geanoshin to talk. So Anakin slipped into the cell, threw him against the wall, and started to force choke him. As he started choking the old Vader theme started playing very softly in the background, like the dark side creeping in. Man, I got goose bumps. It was awesome. =)

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by WarpedAcorn View Post
    I had always assumed that Baras was very strong in the Force. I also viewed him more akin to Darth Plagerous (sp?), who was so much more interested in the Force and studying it that he found Lightsaber combat to be a tedius waste of time. While Baras doesn't seem to delve into the mysteries of the Force or Sith Sorcery, he does invest all of his resources and abilities into political endeavors. He used connections and other people as pawns, weapons, and tools to accomplish his goals. Was he a powerful Sith? Yes. Was he the most powerful Sith? No. He just happened to be really cunning and devious.

    In all, his story reminds me of Conan's "riddle of steel". Unfortunately for him, his steel (the Sith Warrior) was more powerful than the hand that wielded it (himself).
    I totally agree with you. It's not so that apprentices where truthful loyal to their masters. It's sometimes the master was true strong for the apprentices to take him on. Vader was hating the Emperor and was trying to scheme against him. (If you have played the SW Unleashed Vader has his own apprentice to overthrow the Emperor and when Palpatine finds about Starkiller, Vader doesn't hesitate to kill his apprentice (even though he's faking it) . It's not that SW is loyal to Baras than he's not strong enough to take him down. SW is a brute that is getting amazing strong in real short time more on lightsaber combat than on force knowledge and cunning. Maybe he's stronger on combat than some Sith Masters and Darths but still, he's not a better Sith. It had a strange taste on my mouth playing the brute but this how it is. Baras was trully strong, but not strong enough to be on the Counsil. His schemes and his cunning gave him a shot but even if he could have made it, his fall was certain for me.

    As far as the Belsavis part, where the assassins take SW place, it's not unheard for henchmen to switch sides. It's not that they have a Force power to understand the truth behind someone's words but rather, they "sensed" the SW was trully powerfull and also supported by someone behind the shadows. Don't forget that without the Hands and the Voice, SW would have died and Baras would have been victorious.
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  17. #37
    Pandaren Monk WarpedAcorn's Avatar
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    Well technically for Force Unleashed, Vader's apprentice was a plot schemed by the Emperor to lure out potential Rebel sympathizers. Now, when Vader first found the child he might have had the intention of overthrowing the Emperor, but it is obvious from the plot dialogue that the Emperor is the one who had Vader train and deceive Starkiller. This includes pushing Starkiller to form the Rebel alliance out of desire more than allegiance I believe.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by WarpedAcorn View Post
    I had always assumed that Baras was very strong in the Force. I also viewed him more akin to Darth Plagerous (sp?), who was so much more interested in the Force and studying it that he found Lightsaber combat to be a tedius waste of time. While Baras doesn't seem to delve into the mysteries of the Force or Sith Sorcery, he does invest all of his resources and abilities into political endeavors. He used connections and other people as pawns, weapons, and tools to accomplish his goals. Was he a powerful Sith? Yes. Was he the most powerful Sith? No. He just happened to be really cunning and devious.

    In all, his story reminds me of Conan's "riddle of steel". Unfortunately for him, his steel (the Sith Warrior) was more powerful than the hand that wielded it (himself).

    Scheming and being cunning is fine but Baras that was only thing Baras was good at.

    I kind of doubt that Baras could have even found jaesa willsaam or defeat her Jedi master.
    I also kind of doubt that baras could defeat his former master

    What I'm wondering is how the hell did he even get his Darth titel. Scheming and building up a spy network is fine but I assume that their was a point where he had to be on the field and do things for his master.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by ati87 View Post
    What I'm wondering is how the hell did he even get his Darth title. Scheming and building up a spy network is fine but I assume that their was a point where he had to be on the field and do things for his master.
    Maybe he was gd before he got fat.

    I see the point though. Its one of the reasons why I felt baras was more of a inquisitor than a warrior

  20. #40
    Wasn't Baras the mastermind on the sacking of Coruscant? Maybe that was Angral. Baras was instrumental in the Treaty of Coruscant though. He also tried to convert Satele Shan to the dark side. He seems to have big ambitions but never quite realizes them.

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