1. #1

    Anything wrong with this picture? (logs included)

    We've been pushing heroic progression and have achieved 3/8 heroic and are really close to getting our fourth kill, but there have been a couple observations I've made within other raids that have been bothering me.

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ltres/advanced


    This is our Holy Paladin. Solid healer, but it feels like something is missing, or perhaps his approach to some of these encounters may need to be altered a bit. I'm not a paladin, I do not know. But I'm the raid leader and as such I feel that I should do what I can to procure any information that will help our raid succeed.

    I wish I could pick the logs apart myself, but I don't know the finer details of playing a Holy Paladin. I would assume that our Pally does, but everyone can stand some constructive criticism, so I come to you guys for help.

    He's been struggling with 1 healing his side on H Morchok. Here are a couple logs to show his healing strategy for the fight:

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-k1...e/?s=657&e=837 (attempt at 1 healing his side)

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-k1...?s=1003&e=1307 (kill while 2 healing his side with druid whilst disc priest solo'd other side)

    And just for good measure, here is a link to our H Yorsahj kill to give a better idea of his healing methods.

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-k1...?s=3517&e=4054

    ANY sort of information or tips as to where he could improve would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

  2. #2
    Am I seeing this correctly?
    The Disc Priest is able to solo heal Morchoks side, but he is unable to solo heal Kohcrom? The side that is a mile easier?

  3. #3
    I believe Kohcrom is weaker then Morchok, What we do is stack our better geared tank and better healer on morchok and then the weaker heals/tank on kohcrom. Also put a few people that have active mitigations on Morchok (Ie locks/spriests etc)
    I play many games. WoW, Rift, D3, PoE, SC2 I will not criticize your game choice if you don't mine.

  4. #4
    Ask him to logout in healing gear please. But from what I can see from the 3 minute log..:

    8 divine lights and ... 14 holy lights. This should be acceptable for a normal fight, but not for morchok where you have to burst heal an entire side. Example: The hpala in my guild solo healing his side didn't use a single holy light in our first kill.

    17 holy radiances. This is supposed to be an aoe spell. He healed 53 times and casted it 17. That's 3 people healed per holy radiance. I'm not an expert, but I don't think that's particularly useful.

    Considering he healed the same (close to 300k total) with divine light and holy radiance, but he casted divine light half the number of times, I think you can see a big problem here.

    My advices: less holy radiance, no holy light, more divine lights. and holy shock more on cooldown

  5. #5
    Yeah, your paladin must spam Divine light more, in 10 man, holy radiance is useless on this fight.
    www . worldoflogs . com/reports/4zjeq8y2hknb5835/sum/healingDone/?s=1372&e=1677
    For an idea.

    An usefull tric is to stack Illuminated Healing on the dps who take the double dammage.

    With my current gear, I can spam this fight with Divine Light without mana issue.

  6. #6
    Anything anyone see on yorsahj that should be adjusted by chance? I usually see paladins rape on that fight, and while he is doing more HPS than the priest, I was wondering if there is something he isn't doing to be pushing harder heals.

  7. #7
    On Yor'sajh, the hps depend on oozes (composition and your priority order)

  8. #8
    Anything with his character that should perhaps be adjusted? I'm kind of doing a run down of every member in my raid to figure out what needs to happen for us to get better results. I'm confident in all my raiders, but everyone has something to learn, including me. Any info I'm getting is helping me assess what items I need to loot to people and get a better understanding of where to put people.

  9. #9
    Regarding the hpala, correct me if I'm wrong, but the gloves tinker from engineering gives you 480 intelect for 10 secs every minute I believe? He seems not to be using it. I believe it's quite useful.

    Other than that, his gloves enchant is not the best I believe. 50 haste beats 28 spellpower in my oppinion.

    Regarding updated, if I were you, I'd get him the next healing trinket dropping from spine. I wouldn't give them hc hands, since hands are a hpala offset piece. I would give him a spi-haste ring if it dropped, since of how much of an upgrade it is for him. I would also pray that ultraxion drops the belt next time you go there, since of how good that belt is.

  10. #10
    28sp on gloves :'( it's bad to follow Mr.Robot sometimes !
    And like darknessice said, he don't use the engineering trinket (because he doesn't have it on his gloves !)

  11. #11
    morchok side takes a few extra stomps per fight.
    holy pally aoe healing is SHIT compared to other classes and he is required to do aoe healing due to shared stomp damg.

    a holy pally doing less healing on an aoe fight isn't news it's standard

  12. #12
    The Lightbringer Joyful's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viglante View Post
    morchok side takes a few extra stomps per fight.
    holy pally aoe healing is SHIT compared to other classes and he is required to do aoe healing due to shared stomp damg.

    a holy pally doing less healing on an aoe fight isn't news it's standard
    The thing is hpallys are #1 AoE healer if the group is bigger then 6 and stacked. But with morchok you need to spread quite far from the boss and there will be only a maximum of 5 players nearby at any time there are any damage to speak of.

  13. #13
    Hpally doesn't have the right class mechanics to easily 1-heal morchok side, you need a class with good synergy between spot-healing and AoE with a fair mix of smart. Druids and priests are good at this, but I don't believe paladins have the right tools. You have to put him on the kohcrom side or stack the dps/soaker on his side to take less damage from stomp and crystals.

    Perhaps go with a 3-healing approach, put your strongest healer on kohcrom's side solo and let the other 2 have morchok.

    --
    And on yor notice your disc priest is using 1-gcd casts a great deal more (PW:S) while hpaladin is using divine light mostly. Basically your disc is being a little more careless with stacks and your hpaladin is being significantly more conservative. He could only keep up with that behavior by using a bit more Flash. Which would not be a problem if you aren't already having problems with explosions.

    Healers win as long as you're passing. In fairness he's losing on the meter because he's conservative. Mana conservative healers shine in some really difficult situations, you just have to learn as a raidleader to interpret the logs so you know WHY.
    Last edited by zakaluka; 2012-02-01 at 02:03 PM.

  14. #14
    I solo healing Kohcrom's side as paladin, but I don't think I can solo Morchok side.
    But never do this fight with a rogue for soak the stomp. (Always do with an unholy dk).

  15. #15
    The Lightbringer Joyful's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thakah View Post
    I solo healing Kohcrom's side as paladin, but I don't think I can solo Morchok side.
    But never do this fight with a rogue for soak the stomp. (Always do with an unholy dk).
    Rogues are amazing for this fight to soak the stomp due to faint, witch makes them take 50% less AoE damage.

  16. #16
    Couple of things I noticed: Judgement uptime is terrible. It should be closer to 98% not 89% or less. Explains why he is being conservative, he is probably running out of mana. Never popped wings on your Morchok kill. Talk to him about making better use of his CD's.

    Also check out http://www.cannotbetamed.com/2012/01...-logs-updated/ Nice simple breakdown of how to find those fixable things in your healing logs.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Joyful View Post
    Rogues are amazing for this fight to soak the stomp due to faint, witch makes them take 50% less AoE damage.
    Yes I know, but we don't have any rogue in our roster :'(

  18. #18
    Field Marshal Lovin's Avatar
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    We raid 25 man, and probably for 10 man it's a little different but this is what we do: We have a warrior tank on Morchok's side and a prot paladin on Kohcrom's side. We usually tend to heal this with 7 healers because we can afford to have 7 healers and our dps to be great but it can definently be done with 6 healers 3 on each side.

    If we use 6 healers a holy paladin will always be on Morchok's side and a disc priest would be on Kohcrom's side. As the healer to heal Morchok's tank ... this is my rotation:

    Mana will be an issue at times but that's why there is down time for Divine Plea, Concentration Potions etc etc.

    On this fight a holy paladin CANNOT afford to spam Holy Light or else the tank will die. Beacon the tank - which then every Divine Light you will get a Holy Power ... then after 3 Divine Lights (not counting Holy Shock + Crusader Strike) you have a full bar of Holy Power which then Word of Glory can be used. This happens very fast and this is a great fight for Holy Power to stack fast and you dont' have to use Holy Radiance.

    Once the stomps happens make sure the tank uses a CD and then rotate Hand of Sac and bubble. Also, Wings are great for this fight because they only have a 2 minute CD and it can be use more than twice. If you want to AoE and your tank can afford it ... then use Light of Dawn since 50% transfer Beacon ... It's not much of a heal for a tank that is taking massive damage but it's better than nothing.

    Also, to make it easier on the 2 healers that are AoE healing use Aura Mastery when dps are going to take the crystal NOT WHEN THE TANK IS TAKING THE STOMP because AM doesn't do much for the tank on this fight.

    Holy Radiance shouldn't be used at all for this fight from a Holy Paladin who is concentration on tank healing. This is just my opinion!

    It's my belief that he is using too much HR and wasting his mana and not using "smart" CD rotation with his tank.

    He seems to have the idea of how to gear for a paladin it's just a matter of knowing how to use it.

    Hope it helps.

    p.s. this is our logs for last weeks kill: (This is Healing Done by spell):

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/f...?s=2227&e=2648

    As you can see the two holy paladins ... Holy Radiance for that fight doesn't really exist much. We probably did it maybe 2-3 times during the entire 7 minutes but nothing more than that.
    Last edited by Lovin; 2012-02-01 at 05:42 PM.

  19. #19
    Holy radiance being top healing on Morchok isn't really that great. In 25m its fine but 10m you really don't use holy radiance that much him. (unless you are doing a different strat then I do). especially if he is solo healing one side HR is not going to get everyone up fast enough you need to use DL and even some occasional FL. I also noticed he only use 3 WoG and barley used Light of Dawn which means he isn't spending his Holy power which is huge :/

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