Moderator of Heroes of the Storm, come say hi!
I found this interesting: http://kotaku.com/5894542/mass-effec...ag=mass-effect
Looks like everything is really starting to catch up to Bioware.
"We are aware that there are concerns about a recent post from this account regarding the ending of the game. In this post it was stated that at this time we do not have plans to change the ending.
We would like to clarify that we are actively and seriously taking all player feedback into consideration and have ruled nothing out. At this time we are still collecting and considering your feedback and have not made a decision regarding requests to change the ending.
Your feedback and opinions are of the utmost importance to us. We apologize for any confusion this has caused. Our top priority regarding this discussion is to keep communication with you, our loyal fans, open and productive."
BioWare and especially Mass Effect-side has been really active over on Twitter. They really want to show that they're listening to the fans and all kinds of feedback they're getting of ME3, whether it's positive or negative. It has boosted my hope to say the least, at least people won't feel like they're completely ignored.
Buuuut yeah. BioWare is starting to realise that the ending and negativity is starting to catch up on them. Putting the game on sale this shortly after release is telling something already. And the panel on 6th of April is still quite a bit away. Still, hoping for positive news!
Synthesis was fine ending. I dont know what you all fuss about. Mediocre sequel had somewhat satisfactory ending in that.
just finished the game..........i am pisssseeeeeeeeddddddd, and also quite sad.
Just look at ME2 ending, almost every decision you made mattered.
Remember remember the fifth of November
Gunpowder, treason and plot.
I see no reason why gunpowder, treason
Should ever be forgot...
Not to be a downer, but before all you guys celebrate about that latest twitter post, I'd suggest you read this: [Specifically the lower parts of the first post]
What they're saying there makes much more sense, imo, than all that Indoctrination theory speculation, even though it may sound unpleasant.
So far, all things point to a simple blunder/miscalculation by the people in lead, rather than an intricate scheme to surprise people.
The main reason for this is economically seated: Would it make sense to "troll" people with the ending? Sure, you get people to talk about it more, which does count as free marketing. In exchange, however, you are in danger of alienating most of your most loyal userbase; not so much the casuals, though.
Now the question is: Is the free publicity worth more than those originally loyal customers?
In a case as severe as this, there is a simple answer to that question: No. The people they annoyed most are usually the ones who pay for most of the additional content. Casuals will buy the game and maybe a DLC, if it's available with the game. That's it. The bigger fans usually buy premium editions, all DLC, extra fan material, maybe soundtracks or something similar. They are also the ones who you are in danger of turning away from the company, thus lowering your possible future sales.
And all that just to have a chance at winning them back with a big surprise?
Not to mention that these people are also the ones who provide you free advertising on message boards, conventions and the like. Getting people to talk about your product, not to mention that most of the talk is negative, like this would be a horrible decision considering what Bioware/EA stand to lose. And if we know one thing, it's that EA is all about the money.
So, based on that, we can rather safely assume that Bioware probably just screwed up with the ending and did not have an overarching plan prepared.
Which is why we should probably follow the guidelines they mention: Stay civil, keep holding the line, while taking breaks to relax from time to time and, one of the most important things, do not waver from the initial demands. They offer 3 new companions? DOESN'T MATTER. They offer 2 new vehicular missions? WHO CARES!
Keep fighting for an alternate ending and don't back down.
Also, remember that we're not fighting the people at Bioware or EA. We're fighting their decision to leave "that" as the only ending.
It's astonishing how confused people get when a sentence does not end as they potato.
"Yes of course I'm taking your problem seriously. I can assure you that any and all feedback you provide here will instantly go to our top levels and willbe incorporated in our future products."
On me the stalling worked. I shouldn't have been so brought up to begin with. Hell, if it hadn't been Mass Effect I would've simply schrugged at the ending and went on to the next game, as it has happened countless times before.
Just before I start, I'll say that I loved most of Mass Effect 3. I wasn't expecting much from the action side, it was a limited number of the same enemies, doing what they do and me trying to find new combinations of powers to kill them with. The story, for the most part was excellent, bar some iffy writing in places to suit the needs of the game's progression and the story *they* wanted to tell.
However, as with many others, the ending annoyed me quite a lot. I chose the Synthesis ending, because it seemed like the only way that anyone would have any hope of rebuilding the various galactic empires and such, with the help of the Geth and the like, who can do things that would take hundreds of years in just years. Now, onto my various issues with the endings...
To start, I'll briefly touch on the subject of the indoctrination theory; If that turns out to be the answer for these endings, it would be the sloppiest written ending to the series physically possible. It's basically a 'but then he woke up and realised it was all just a dream.' ending, which is literally the most childishly over used method of ending something, ever. So, I'm going to disregard that as a possibiltiy, but if it turns out to be their choice for 'continuation DLC', then I'm not touching anything they release to do with the games ever again, as it will just sully the experience further.
Now, as to the endings that we are presented with, I believe that they should only have applied to the 'Destroy' choice. It would basically have been the Renegade's choice de jour, allowing them to save the galaxy in the most assholish way possible, removing the reapers and damning everyone else to mere survival, thousands upon thousands trapped in the Sol system.
The 'Control' ending should've shown Shepard becoming one with the Reaper's conciousness/hivemind and taking them away from Sol and out into the vast darkness of space, leaving everyone else behind, sacrificing himself to protect the rest of the universe. This would then culminate in a genuine reason for the old man to refer to him as 'The Shepard'. There was no necessity for the Mass Relays to be destroyed in this ending, it was simply bad writing.
The 'Synthesis' ending should have been the most ambiguous and perhaps most questionable. As pointed out, the whole reason that we could defeat the Reapers or even have a chance at it is because we had such a diverse range of peoples and species working together. For them to all become one, new race, is very Budda-like. It's the whole idea that in the end, we are all originally created from the same beginning, we are all part of the same universe and are inherently intertwined as such.
It would be used to emphasise what had started and ended with the Geth and the Quarians, learning to live together, that they do not all have to destroy each other, much as the other races learn to do across the course of the games. The synthesis ending would be the closest thing possible to a galactic scale enlightenment possible.
Now, the reason why the endings make everything we've ever done such a waste:
It's actually more humane to do as little as possible, get the bare minimum requirements to complete the game and as little help from the other races as possible. By not helping them, by not requesting their assistance, by not resolving centuries old conflicts, you actually save more people than you do by gathering all of the known universe's races to the Sol system. If you'd left all the people that came with you, all the fleets that followed you where they came from, they'd have more chance of surviving the annihilation of the relays than they do by coming with you.
Every person and race that you befriended and brought with you for the final fight, you personally damn forever. As noted, Earth cannot sustain its own population in an effective manner after all of this is over. Don't forget that all synthetics, regardless of relation or links to the reapers will either be destroyed, removed from the system or cross-bred into a new race. There's;
A: Not enough space in our system or enough habitable planets for all the races gathered there.
B: No knowing how people would react to the 'synthesis' choice. Or the fact that you essentially have to Destroy/remove all of the Geth and also things like EDI from existence.
C: The fact that a lot of the races were in desparate need of aid or assistance with rebuilding, that they'll probably never receive now.
D: The fact that countless colonies and Space Stations, etc, that are never going to be reached ever again (within a number of Asari life spans).
E: Not enough resources in the Sol System to even attempt to create a new Mass Relay, even if the combined efforts of all the races went into this, there would be no Relays anywhere else to target it with.
You know what annoys me most though? The fact that I could've shot Wrex in the face in Mass Effect 1, lost the help of his people and I would have saved more people than I do in the current endings.
Last edited by Shinzai; 2012-03-19 at 11:20 PM. Reason: /spoiler
The synthesis ending is physically impossible, or was at least explained very poorly. How does an energy pulse change every being in the galaxy? Think about it. For organics, it would require hundreds of trillions of synthetic components to be made out of thin air, and shot around the galaxy at millions of times light speed, and then somehow surgically implant themselves into people with extreme precision. One, how does that even work, and two how does it not kill everyone? It'd be like shooting a microchip at someone's head out of a giant gun. It's not going to turn them into a smart computer, it's gonna slice their brain in half.
Next. The ending has plot holes everywhere. Starting after Harbinger's beam hits Shepard and knocks him out. Why does Shepard wake up? Harbinger is right there, like RIGHT THERE. I'm pretty sure Reapers don't see with physical eyes, I'd bet the farm they use short range sensors. I highly doubt Harbinger didn't know that Shepard is actually alive instead of just unconscious, so why didn't he shoot him again? There were no other forces in the area, so what could have possibly stopped Harbinger?
After Shepard makes it up to the Citadel, Anderson indicates that he made it up after you, but is in a different place. You can clearly see there's only one pathway to the console, yet somehow you don't see Anderson until you ascend the stairs. even though the conversation with him indicates that he's only a few feet ahead of you? How the hell does that work?
Then we have the Illusive Man. How the fuck did he even get here? Last I checked, he's still on the the shit lists of both the Alliance and the Reapers. He has no armor, and a pistol. How did he get past all of Sword and Hammer, and Reaper ground forces? He just appears out of freaking nowhere with no explanation. Oh fun fact, one of the resolutions for the conversation with TIM is killing him with a pistol shot to the chest. His file in Lair of the Shadow broker mentions that his suit is specifically designed to resist close range weapons fire.
Space God. Why does The Catalyst take the form of the child from Earth? Is he scanning Shepard's brain? And even if he did, why choose the kid? It's like, here Shepard, imma troll you by picking something just familiar enough to you that you'll recognize it, but just mysterious enough that it'll freak you out. Also, his logic, it's terrible. The entire purpose of the Reapers is based of extremely common logical fallacies. The most advanced anything ever should be smart enough to not use circular logic and argument to tradition. Logical fallacies like that would not even pass a high school level debate. During this scene, I would like to point out that Shepard is breathing in space without a helmet. Shepard is also out of character here. Why doesn't he even question The Catalyst? He just accepts what it says as fact. It's a fucking Reaper, it admits it like 5 times in that conversation. Yet Shepard takes what it says as absolute truth?
Then we have the destroy ending. You know if you have over 4000/5000 EMS Shepard lives in the destroy ending? How the fuck does he survive the Citadel blowing up, orbital reentry, and a terminal velocity impact with the ground? Btw, there's more I'm not getting into here, because I'm just lazy. I may edit this post later with more stuff.
If Goku's power level increases at the same rate till the end of DBGT as it does till the end of the Frieza saga, as a SS4 Goku would have a PL of roughly 939 Quinoctogintillion. For reference that is a 260 digit number. A PL of 14,600 is required to destroy an earth sized planet. There are about 2 nonillion earths worth of mass in the universe. That means SS4 Goku can destroy the universe about 32 Octosexagintillion times over. There's a reason they made Goku a god at the end of GT.
@Laurcus I don't understand your arguments. I didn't care for the ending that much but I want to examine your points
You are trying to apply real life science to a science fiction universe. You have AI that suddenly becomes self away, people who can manifest small black holes, magic gates that can warp your around the galaxy in second, giant robots that are able to survive cosmic radiation outside the Milky Way for thousands of years and turn organic life into machine and you are questioning how its possible in the ME universe how organic and synthetic life can become one? Its what the Reapers had been doing for millions of years. Whether Harbinger could detect whether Shepard was alive or not isn't an issue. If Harbinger was alive, Harbinger would've probably been relieved because now he would get to harvest Shepard. Harvest Shepard would've been very high up on his list.
Shepard corrected Anderson and said he was in a different part. I believe Anderson then concluded that the areas must be pretty identical. It seems to me that they were Anderson then commented that the walls shifted which would explain why we didn't see another path. The only path that would be visible is whichever one the wall is pointing to.
TIM was already there...We find that out when we attack Cerberus. He jumped ship before the Alliance closed in, which is why he isn't in his office. I am more concerned about what happened to the people on the Citadel? There was no kind of struggle, if I remember correctly, the only way any knows that the Citadel was taken was because it was sitting over Earth, I could be mistaken though.
The kid did kind of piss me off. It makes me want to invest in the Indoctrination Theory but that theory is full of holes. The only reason why I can fathom why the kid was in that forum was because it appeal to Shepard. It was short of implied that the Catalyst was able to read Shepards emotions. If Javik could do it and the Protheans had been harvested then it would of have been "childs play" to the Catalyst. His logic was that of the synthetics in the universe and of other cycles. I don't know if you have the DLC but the way of thinking in the human cycle is at least very different than the Prothean cycle. The Protheans strongly believed in a sort galatic dicatorship and heavily favored survival of the fittest, they were pretty much the Sith if you know your Star Wars lore. The Geth shared the same logic as the Catalyst, EDI struggled with it. Its the most basic idea of self preservation with a small hint of mercy towards organics. The didn't have anything against organics and were fascinated by them, but organics threatened their existence which meant they would have to kill the organics before the organics killed them. The Catalyst with the Reapers chose not to eliminate organics but knew that organics would always seek technological advances which would lead to self aware AI which would lead to the AI killing the organics once the organics were perceived as a threat (we witnessed this with the Quarians vs the Geth and with EDI). What the Catalyst didn't acknowledge (through ignorance or self preservation but Javik also struggled with it) was that Shepard broke the organic vs synthetic cycle when he allied the Quarians and the Geth so it was clearly time for a new solution even if Shepard hadn't forced one upon the Catalyst because they problem that was solved by the Reapers no longer existed, at least in the Human cycle.
Why did Shepard agree to the Catalyst? Shepard was all but dead at that point and only alive through extreme determination and hatred towards the Reapers. In my eyes he died three times that day. When the beam hit him, with Anderson, and when he made his choice. When he survived the beam his body was cooked, the way he got up was if he simply refused to die. When he was next to Anderson he was done, he sort of incoherently answers his comlink and fumbles with the console based on pure Shepard instinct to get the job done, then he flatlines again. The Catalyst spares him because of how far he had come but fight has pretty much left Shepard, he is running on vapors. There were no other options for him, he couldn't fight if he wanted to. At this point, he just wanted the whole thing to be over so he could RIP, when he picks his choice he just pours he soul into whichever choice he makes.
My actual theory is that the whole sequence was a "dream" (based on imagine shown if your Shepard "lives" and the words of the old man at the end". Shepard had been knocked out by the laser. In his knocked out state he imagined himself defeating the Reapers and saving the galaxy (because the conclusions after he decision doesn't make sense and seems like a projection of his will). A) The most noble way to die in Shepards mind would've been to sacrifice himself. B) He would dream that Relays were gone so there wouldn't be any reason for him to have to save the galaxy because without the Relays it would impossible for him to do anything outside of the Sol system. C) Because of his love and attachment of his crew he dreams that Joker was able to escape with his squad unscathed. But in "real time" Shepard either died due the laser or was stuck in rubble somewhere near the beam in the position we see him if he "lives". The battle is still going on, the Citadel is still orbiting the Earth, the Crucible hasn't been deployed. We are actually waiting for the final conclusion, not a continuation of what we already saw.
My 2 cents
I like these spoiler tags, its like we are reading some highly classified document.