[Megathread] Mass Effect 3

[rhorle]

I really don´t know who wrote ME3 but not only Renegade Shepard seems completely crazy also Cerberus went from the shadowy but somehow "good" Organization that tried to defeat the Reapers at all costs to a full blown Sith-empire that had Husk troopers and lures refugees to death camps (Sanctuary) in ME3.

They were never somehow good. Even in ME1 you would find the results or the sites of their experiments into creating super soldiers including ones that referenced the study and/or creation of husks. Cerberus has remained true to what their organization has always been portrayed as. And that is one that will do whatever it takes to ensure humanity is the leaders of the galaxy.

[Adam Jensen]

They were never somehow good. Even in ME1 you would find the results or the sites of their experiments into creating super soldiers including ones that referenced the study and/or creation of husks. Cerberus has remained true to what their organization has always been portrayed as. And that is one that will do whatever it takes to ensure humanity is the leaders of the galaxy.

Right, people think Cerberus was good because Shepard was forced to work with them on a mission that actually was good, even if it served an ulterior motive for TIM. Remember, Shepard even mentions that people were placed around her so she would not see what Cerberus really was, which in turn gives the player a warped view of Cerberus.

But Cerberus was always evil. Even Shepard knew that, that's why she was reluctant to work with them.

First, there's the side missions in ME1 where Cerberus transforms colonists into husks, the other one where they've murdered Kahoku at a lab where they're studying husks, creepers and rachni. There's the way they mistreat Veetor if you hand him to them and there's everything they did on Pragia, even if they don't directly take responsibility.

They've always been a sick and twisted organization.

[Kaelwryn]

"The greatest evil is the one that believes it is doing good." I probably butchered that quote but that sums up Cereberus to me.

And while I definitely think Renegade Shep is willing to push things to the extreme to get results I don't think Shep would necessarily go as far as Cereberus. But alas, all of my sheps have been mostly paragon with a touch of ren. when appropriate.

[Statix]

Well . . . it makes more sense

But yes, it is much improved after the extended cut. And Leviathan helps it make sense.

I recently completed Mass Effect 3 with the Extended Cut DLC installed. I find the EC endings to be extremely unsatisfying and sad. I can't even imagine how I must have felt if I hadn't done a bit of research into the endings before actually reaching and not to have installed the EC DLC. I wanna experience the the From Ashes, Leviathan and Omega DLCs, but the problem is, knowing the ending, how can I really enjoy those DLC's... Should have bought, installed and played them before completing ME3.

I'm sincerely hoping for some DLC that will show us the true ending. Here's hoping that 'all hands on deck' DLC is going to be just that. All those things the IT points to, it's just too big not to be true. One thing I found very interesting was Shepard's eyes being that of an indoctrinated person in the Blue Control and Green Sythesis endings. Why would that happen in those endings, but not in the Red Destroy ending? Is that just an oversight? I think it's too big to be just a mistake.

But regardless of the IT being true, I just want a happy ending. One that does not involve Shepard dying or Shepard surviving but destroying EDI, the get and all other synthetics in the process. An ending where everyone lives and the Reapers are destroyed. The Blue Control option actually comes close to achieving that.. Shepard technically survives. This would have been my choice if she simply contacted her squad and crew after it happening. Shouldn't be too difficult. But alas, she doesn't. Fact that the Reapers aren't destroyed doesn't way nearly as heavy as Shepard surviving and reuniting with her squad, crew and love interest. So, Red Destroy for me, because above all else, I want my Shepard to survive. She deserves that.

The most annoying thing about the Red Destroy ending is that you see Shepard alive in that 'breathing scene.' Why give us that, if you aren't going to show us more? Too many things point to something more.

Might aswell have spoilered my entire post... Anyway, I've actually written my own ending for the game and although it's not official, I'm going to think about that ending so much that I will eventually accept it as being the actual ending. It's quite the amazing ending, if I do say so myself. Might require some improvement and more explanation here and there, but I'm very satisfied with it and it's precisly how I would have wanted ME3 to end.

[CrossNgen]

I recently completed Mass Effect 3 with the Extended Cut DLC installed. I find the EC endings to be extremely unsatisfying and sad. I can't even imagine how I must have felt if I hadn't done a bit of research into the endings before actually reaching and not to have installed the EC DLC. I wanna experience the the From Ashes, Leviathan and Omega DLCs, but the problem is, knowing the ending, how can I really enjoy those DLC's... Should have bought, installed and played them before completing ME3.

I'm sincerely hoping for some DLC that will show us the true ending. Here's hoping that 'all hands on deck' DLC is going to be just that. All those things the IT points to, it's just too big not to be true. One thing I found very interesting was Shepard's eyes being that of an indoctrinated person in the Blue Control and Green Sythesis endings. Why would that happen in those endings, but not in the Red Destroy ending? Is that just an oversight? I think it's too big to be just a mistake.

But regardless of the IT being true, I just want a happy ending. One that does not involve Shepard dying or Shepard surviving but destroying EDI, the get and all other synthetics in the process. An ending where everyone lives and the Reapers are destroyed. The Blue Control option actually comes close to achieving that.. Shepard technically survives. This would have been my choice if she simply contacted her squad and crew after it happening. Shouldn't be too difficult. But alas, she doesn't. Fact that the Reapers aren't destroyed doesn't way nearly as heavy as Shepard surviving and reuniting with her squad, crew and love interest. So, Red Destroy for me, because above all else, I want my Shepard to survive. She deserves that.

The most annoying thing about the Red Destroy ending is that you see Shepard alive in that 'breathing scene.' Why give us that, if you aren't going to show us more? Too many things point to something more.

Might aswell have spoilered my entire post... Anyway, I've actually written my own ending for the game and although it's not official, I'm going to think about that ending so much that I will eventually accept it as being the actual ending. It's quite the amazing ending, if I do say so myself. Might require some improvement and more explanation here and there, but I'm very satisfied with it and it's precisly how I would have wanted ME3 to end.

They didn't give you more because they want you to use your brain for just 5 minutes and think of how it'll go on from there. Did Shepard die? or did he survive? your choice, we're done in making your story, continue from here.

[Yakobro]

Hydra with a demo engy as leader...
NOOOOPE

[RoboA]

how did you people get the venom shotgun and is it avaliable for multiplayer?

[rhorle]

The most annoying thing about the Red Destroy ending is that you see Shepard alive in that 'breathing scene.' Why give us that, if you aren't going to show us more? Too many things point to something more.

Because Bioware wanted you to fill in the details of how the Universe moves on. There isn't supposed to be one ultimate ending where every works out for the best. They have stated that they left the short scene of Shepard in Destroy and the crew flying off specifically so you can fill in the blanks of you being reunited with your love interest. Or that Shepard makes the ultimate sacrifice, his life, to save the galaxy.

The indoctrination theory is also false and has been proven as such many many times. The problem is people keep coming up with new reasons for why it isn't disproved. But the Indoctrination Theory is a perfect example of what Bioware wanted to do with the endings. Present to you three hard choices that aren't perfect but open ended enough where you can create your own ending. The Beauty of Mass Effect has never been about Happy Endings but about being given choices to make that influence the story.

And as for the eyes, Shepard has cybernetic implants. You can see them change color at the end of Mass Effect 2 as well. Cybernetics aren't proof of being indoctrinated.



---------- Post added 2013-02-09 at 08:48 PM ----------

how did you people get the venom shotgun and is it avaliable for multiplayer?

It is only currently available for Single player, via one of the DLC weapon packs. Though it is rumored to be added to Multiplayer for the next DLC. Specifically the ground side resistance pack, which more info can be found at http://blog.bioware.com/2012/10/16/g...e-weapon-pack/

[Master Jakken]

I was very satisfied with Paragon Control in the EC. I honestly don't get why people herald it as the worst ending ever, it really isn't that bad.

[Cat1337]

Because Bioware wanted you to fill in the details of how the Universe moves on.

Pretty much this. In my head Shepard lives in the end and finally get his well earned sit down with his LI and live happily ever after blah blah. Even though the end wasn't definitive I felt like it was better that way because I ended up thinking about how it would have ended in my head and therefore just kept thinking the game for a while even after I had beaten it. It's a weird feeling, but I probably wouldn't have put nearly as much thought about the ending if it wasn't so open for interpretation.

[Myobi]

My ending was awesome... after blowing up EDI, the Geth and all the rest. My Shep crawled the way out of all that junk, grabbed his needle, built a modafuking shoutle, macgyver style, went back to Normandy, slapped Joker that was QQing about EDI and told him to get a real bitch, got laid with Liara and later next day went watch Blasto with her, Garrus and Tali ~

[Oerba Yun Fang]

My ending was awesome... after blowing up EDI, the Geth and all the rest. My Shep crawled the way out of all that junk, grabbed his needle, built a modafuking shoutle, macgyver style, went back to Normandy, slapped Joker that was QQing about EDI and told him to get a real bitch, got laid with Liara and later next day went watch Blasto with her, Garrus and Tali ~

Dafuq did I just read? lol

My ending (for Destruction) was more or less just Shepard eventually getting rescued, recovering, retiring and being reunited with Kaidan to live out their days.

[Cat1337]

later next day went watch Blasto with her, Garrus and Tali ~

We went to go watch Blasto twice, for you see, Blasto died valiently in my story, but not before taking down 3 Reapers singletentacledly because they didn't respond to his question of whether they considered themselves fortunate that his heatsink is over capacity...

[Adam Jensen]

And mine was Reaper-Shepard, after letting the galaxy achieve a new utopia, suddenly decides that the Cycles were a damn good idea and begins the harvests anew.

[Kaelwryn]

Mine was reuniting with Garrus for drinks at the bar.

[Yuanrang]

Mine was waking up and Shepard realizing he was the little boy at the start of ME3, having dreamt it all through-out the course of a night.

Well, not really, but the endings are so that they are open for any interpretation so why not?

[Nerraw]

Hurricane V.

[Statix]

And as for the eyes, Shepard has cybernetic implants. You can see them change color at the end of Mass Effect 2 as well. Cybernetics aren't proof of being indoctrinated.

Sure, but why then do you seen them in the Blue Control and Green Synthesis endings and not in the Red Destroy ending?

Looking at the choices:

- Controlling them is simply wrong. It might be a peaceful solution, but the Reapers survive and I don't trust the StarChild to keep his word and allow Shepard to control them. More over, to be handed such great power on a silver platter, I can't help but wonder where the catch is.

- Synthesis is a viable option, but it goes against everything all three games stand for; diversity. Simply because everyone thinks and acts differently, they were so succesful in the war against the Reapers. Shepard would have been far less succesful if her squad existed out of only humans. It's the same reason why letting the original Council die is wrong. Having only humans on the Council would give them a one-sided view of things. More importantly, you force this one the entire galaxy. By chosing this, you remove all free will and diversity from the galaxy.

- Refusal is of course a wrong choice. By refusing, you basically accept the StarChild's current solution; to prevent organic genocide in the future the Reapers must cause genocides of advanced organics and synthetics now.

- Destroying the Reapers is the only possible ending for me. EDI, the geth and all other synthetics are destroyed in the process, but as stated before; they can be rebuild. It's what you set out to do in the first place. Any other choice means the Reapers live and Shepard dying in the process. To me, that translates to failing. In any case, I am pretty sure that EDI and the geth wouldn't hessitate for a second to sacrifice themselves to destroy the Reapers. It's very sad ending, but I have to destroy the Reapers and Shepard has to live to have some sort of future, because she deserves it. Of course, because I believe in the IT, this breaks the indoctrination attempt of Harbinger and she will wake up. I've written my own ending from that point and it's very, very satisfying.

Anyway, if they want me to make up my own ending, it is that of the Indoctrination Theory. If they did not want me to do that, they not should have put so many hints in the game that point to it. Looking at it like that, I'm actually happy the endings are so vague. It leaves a lot of room for many interpretations and the IT is one of them.

[rhorle]

Sure, but why then do you seen them in the Blue Control and Green Synthesis endings and not in the Red Destroy ending?

Because the Red ending doesn't react with your cybernetic implants at all. In red you are only crushed under a bazillion tons of debris from the Citadel exploding (or being beamed back to earth and then having a bunch of stuff fall on you). Both green and blue interface with your cybernetic implants. Blue digitizes you and uploads your "soul" as the leader of the reapers. Green digitizes you and uses your "soul" as the basis for new life.

Both have your cybernetic half as parts of the process.

- Controlling them is simply wrong. It might be a peaceful solution, but the Reapers survive and I don't trust the StarChild to keep his word and allow Shepard to control them. More over, to be handed such great power on a silver platter, I can't help but wonder where the catch is.

The Catalyst doesn't have a free will. He is an AI but he is still bound by certain constraints and programing. It could be possible that the Leviathans gave him the ability to lie but it doesn't seem likely. And would be a silly gamble to bet the freedom of the Reapers on a 1/3rd chance. Reapers and the Catalysts are all just glorified machines (even if reapers are partially organic).

It is possible that eventually you might get some kinda of rebellion but it doesn't seem like it ever happened before Shepard so it is a slim chance of happening after Shepard. The catch was that you died and ceased to exist as you.

- Synthesis is a viable option, but it goes against everything all three games stand for; diversity. Simply because everyone thinks and acts differently, they were so succesful in the war against the Reapers. Shepard would have been far less succesful if her squad existed out of only humans. It's the same reason why letting the original Council die is wrong. Having only humans on the Council would give them a one-sided view of things. More importantly, you force this one the entire galaxy. By chosing this, you remove all free will and diversity from the galaxy.

You misunderstand the purpose of the green option. There is still diversity, and there is still free will. A krogan is still different from a Human, and a Salarian is still different from a Geth. The reason why it is peace between organics and synthetics isn't because free will is removed but because both don't fear each other through intolerance and ignorance because there is only one type of life since everything is now a cyborg.

Anyway, if they want me to make up my own ending, it is that of the Indoctrination Theory. If they did not want me to do that, they not should have put so many hints in the game that point to it. Looking at it like that, I'm actually happy the endings are so vague. It leaves a lot of room for many interpretations and the IT is one of them.

Except the Indoctrination theory isn't something that happens after the endings. You aren't filling in the blanks but ignoring the entire game so you can have your perfect ending. The indoctrination theory isn't just coloring outside of the lines, its coloring outside of the entire book. The thing with conspiracy theories is that to someone that wants to believe they sound like facts when they are nothing but speculation and random correlation.

Most of the things that prove or point to IT are explained by other things. Like the hum on the ship? You are under the freaking drive core. They want you not to make up your own ending but to make up your own epilogue. You are supposed to make hard choices, they aren't supposed to make perfect sense, and their isn't supposed to be one perfect choice to give you everything. Mass Effect 3 is all about loss and hard choices which is why Shepard has recurring nightmares and you can hear whispers of his hard choices during said nightmares.

[Statix]

Because the Red ending doesn't react with your cybernetic implants at all.

It most certainly does. As stated by the Catalyst, Shepard is partly synthetic and would therefore be destroyed aswell.

You misunderstand the purpose of the green option. There is still diversity, and there is still free will. A krogan is still different from a Human, and a Salarian is still different from a Geth. The reason why it is peace between organics and synthetics isn't because free will is removed but because both don't fear each other through intolerance and ignorance because there is only one type of life since everything is now a cyborg.

I perfectly understand the green option. I understand free will isn't affected, but Shepard making the choice does absolve all free will, in that you make the decision for everyone to become that new framework. But the diversity prior to this event happening is gone. Regardless, do you really think organics would accept synthetics now if they didn't before? The geth are still created, no matter them being equal now. And this might be going over the line, but both white and black people were born, yet white people enslaved black people. Being the same doesn't change sh*t. People always find a reason to cause problems. Synthetics might not destroy organics anymore, but this android/cyborg/organthetics/synthganic faction would have trouble with another faction and they would obliterate eachother.

Except the Indoctrination theory isn't something that happens after the endings. You aren't filling in the blanks but ignoring the entire game so you can have your perfect ending. The indoctrination theory isn't just coloring outside of the lines, its coloring outside of the entire book. The thing with conspiracy theories is that to someone that wants to believe they sound like facts when they are nothing but speculation and random correlation.

Most of the things that prove or point to IT are explained by other things. Like the hum on the ship? You are under the freaking drive core. They want you not to make up your own ending but to make up your own epilogue. You are supposed to make hard choices, they aren't supposed to make perfect sense, and their isn't supposed to be one perfect choice to give you everything. Mass Effect 3 is all about loss and hard choices which is why Shepard has recurring nightmares and you can hear whispers of his hard choices during said nightmares.

What really is the difference between an ending and an epilogue? An epilogue happens after the end. But where does the end end and the epilogue start? The IT doesn't start after the ending of the game, it starts before Shepard even reaches the Citadel; it is part of the ending of the game. It's just a way of interpreting it. Wether Bioware intended for that to happen or not, I couldn't care less. The IT gives me a more than acceptable ending and allows me to create my own perfect epilogue that I am extremely satisfied with. And again, if they did not want me to do that, they shouldn't have made those 'mistakes' and shouldn't have made the endings so vague.