U.S. Presidential race - Republican Discussion

[Laize]

No one should be spoon fed, but as a society there are basic living conditions that we should all be responsible for. I still find it amazing that so many people in the United States are against Public Healthcare. In Australia our system (While it has its own problems) ensures that no one will die just because they can't afford it.

America's system ensures the same thing.

No one will die in America because they can't afford it. Hospitals are required to provide care regardless of ability to pay.

[obdigore]

America's system ensures the same thing.

No one will die in America because they can't afford it. Hospitals are required to provide care regardless of ability to pay.

No, Emergency Rooms are required to provide care regardless of ability to pay if the persons life is in danger. A hospital is not required to give you something like a course of chemo over 6 months to try and save your life, if you have no insurance and no way to pay for it.

[Laize]

No, Emergency Rooms are required to provide care regardless of ability to pay if the persons life is in danger. A hospital is not required to give you something like a course of chemo over 6 months to try and save your life, if you have no insurance and no way to pay for it.

As someone who's gone through it I can tell you the following.

HOSPITALS WILL ABSOLUTELY, UNEQUIVOCALLY AND INARGUABLY PROVIDE YOU WITH THE LIFESAVING CARE YOU NEED IF YOU COME DOWN WITH A CATASTROPHIC ILLNESS. WHAT'S MORE, THEY WILL PROVIDE CHARITY CARE AND ASSIST YOU WITH GETTING GOVERNMENT ASSISTANCE IF YOU CANNOT PAY ON YOUR OWN. DO NOT EVEN ATTEMPT TO ARGUE OTHERWISE.

Thank you.

[obdigore]

As someone who's gone through it I can tell you the following.

HOSPITALS WILL ABSOLUTELY, UNEQUIVOCALLY AND INARGUABLY PROVIDE YOU WITH THE LIFESAVING CARE YOU NEED IF YOU COME DOWN WITH A CATASTROPHIC ILLNESS. WHAT'S MORE, THEY WILL PROVIDE CHARITY CARE AND ASSIST YOU WITH GETTING GOVERNMENT ASSISTANCE IF YOU CANNOT PAY ON YOUR OWN. DO NOT EVEN ATTEMPT TO ARGUE OTHERWISE.

Thank you.

Well gosh its funny that I'm dealing with a family member right now who does not and cannot get insurance and the hospital will not give her Chemo until she proves she can pay.

But hey, I guess your experience trumps mine because you used bold, right?

[Laize]

Well gosh its funny that I'm dealing with a family member right now who does not and cannot get insurance and the hospital will not give her Chemo until she proves she can pay.

But hey, I guess your experience trumps mine because you used bold, right?

Every hospital I've ever dealt with has had a charity care department. Usually under the guise of "financial coordinator" offices. Then there's medicaid.

And if you don't believe I'm telling the truth I have the disc with my scans and doctors' notes on it in my desk drawer. I don't give a shit I'll upload it all.

[Lellybaby]

Oh you might save them but then come with the $30,000+ bill later which most people don't anywhere near that much money to pay for.

From a tourist perspective to get travel insurance to go to the US is so much higher than anywhere else that it is almost crazy. (It's all related to the chance of you having to use the American Healthcare system where the cost of everything is enormous).

[Laize]

Oh you might save them but then come with the $30,000+ bill later which most people don't anywhere near that much money to pay for.

From a tourist perspective to get travel insurance to go to the US is so much higher than anywhere else that it is almost crazy. (It's all related to the chance of you having to use the American Healthcare system where the cost of everything is enormous).

Well yeah you'll wind up with a huge bill. You'll still be alive though.

[obdigore]

Every hospital I've ever dealt with has had a charity care department. Usually under the guise of "financial coordinator" offices. Then there's medicaid.

And if you don't believe I'm telling the truth I have the disc with my scans and doctors' notes on it in my desk drawer. I don't give a shit I'll upload it all.

I believe that you got charity care. I'm saying someone close to me is in a case where she cant get that charity care and they wont put in the port or schedule her Chemo treatments until she can show she either has insurance that will cover it or money that will cover it.

[Laize]

I believe that you got charity care. I'm saying someone close to me is in a case where she cant get that charity care and they wont put in the port or schedule her Chemo treatments until she can show she either has insurance that will cover it or money that will cover it.

Then she has assets that they see as needing to be liquidated before she is seen as indigent enough to warrant such care.

I'm guessing she's a homeowner?

[Wells]

Every hospital I've ever dealt with has had a charity care department. Usually under the guise of "financial coordinator" offices. Then there's medicaid.

And if you don't believe I'm telling the truth I have the disc with my scans and doctors' notes on it in my desk drawer. I don't give a shit I'll upload it all.

The gulf between being poor enough to get on medicaid and being wealthy enough to get health insurance is measured in AUs.

And if you really think that charity care departments are enough to treat all the uninsured people with cancer....

---------- Post added 2012-06-14 at 05:23 AM ----------

Then she has assets that they see as needing to be liquidated before she is seen as indigent enough to warrant such care.

I'm guessing she's a homeowner?

Any system that will put people in total bankruptcy just to stay alive is a broken system.

[Laize]

The gulf between being poor enough to get on medicaid and being wealthy enough to get health insurance is measured in AUs.

And if you really think that charity care departments are enough to treat all the uninsured people with cancer....

---------- Post added 2012-06-14 at 05:23 AM ----------



Any system that will put people in total bankruptcy just to stay alive is a broken system.

A) The whole point of charity is to allocate donated resources to those who need it the most. Someone who owns a house does not need it as much as someone who has NO assets. Don't fault them for not throwing money at everyone who walks in the door.

B) Depends on where you live. There are some states where insurers aren't required to offer insurance to every swinging dick who applies. In those states insurance is pretty damn cheap. The elderly and infirm get their insurance through high risk pools where their premiums are limited to (generally) 150% of a healthy person of similar demographic's premiums.

If you live in a state like New Jersey, insurers are required to extend insurance to everyone. In New Jersey individual premiums are astronomical even for healthy 25 year old males.

[Tastic]

Ron Paul 2012. Rule 38 still applies.

[saffi]

Im sorry, i had to only argue on this point i qouted from you. This election is not abot civil rights. Its about the economy i.e. job growth, government spending, entitlments, and some foreign policy. Republicans actually give a shit it about more important issues then this civil rights crap. We are in the 21st century people, everyone is equal, lets get past this crap, be adults, and talk about real issues, like getting people back to work and having some stability in this country.

Hm, same-sex marriage is still not allowed. Women don't have the same rights as men when it comes to serving on the frontlines. Oral contraceptives for women (which a lot of the time is used for medical conditions i.e growths, menstrual pain) is not covered by employers who don't feel like it, while men have viagra covered.

Clearly, this is equality.

[KingHorse]

Was not my argument, so, point?

If it's not your argument, then I suppose my point is that you shouldn't make the argument.

[Spectral]

As someone who's gone through it I can tell you the following.

HOSPITALS WILL ABSOLUTELY, UNEQUIVOCALLY AND INARGUABLY PROVIDE YOU WITH THE LIFESAVING CARE YOU NEED IF YOU COME DOWN WITH A CATASTROPHIC ILLNESS. WHAT'S MORE, THEY WILL PROVIDE CHARITY CARE AND ASSIST YOU WITH GETTING GOVERNMENT ASSISTANCE IF YOU CANNOT PAY ON YOUR OWN. DO NOT EVEN ATTEMPT TO ARGUE OTHERWISE.

Thank you.

Are you telling me that I will be completely unable to find an example of someone dying in the United States because of a hospital turning them away for lack of funds?

[saffi]

Are you telling me that I will be completely unable to find an example of someone dying in the United States because of a hospital turning them away for lack of funds?

He wrote it in bold caps. It must therefore be true.

[Laize]

He wrote it in bold caps. It must therefore be true.

Find me an example that is unequivocally someone dying because they were denied care and I'll believe it,

[Felya]

Find me an example that is unequivocally someone dying because they were denied care and I'll believe it,

That's technically not possible, because the cause of death is never going to be lack of care, instead of the calamity. But, I found the following:

http://www.commonwealthfund.org/Publ...ed-Adults.aspx

[Felya]

He wrote it in bold caps. It must therefore be true.

It's worse if it was true, because US healthcare devolves into being a creepy old man and us being Blanch DuBois... "I've always depended on the kindness of strangers."...

---------- Post added 2012-06-14 at 03:08 PM ----------

You probably can. What's important is that with EMTALA, emergency rooms can't turn patients away based on money, if the care is deemed to be life-threatening. If you go into the ER with a cold, I believe they can turn you away. Of course that cold could lead to pneumonia and you end up dying, but you went in for the cold, not the pneumonia.

And the tax payer ends up covering a portion of the cost the uninsured accrue in ER, with another portion being covered by the hospital in the increasing cost to the insured.

[Lenonis]

Clearly, this is equality.

It is when you are a straight white male.