U.S. Presidential race - Democrat Discussion

**Spectral** · 2012-10-09, 01:27 AM

Originally Posted by belfpala

Maybe... Bachmann?

Perhaps. I left myself open by making him the singular worst. Bachmann, King, Hank Johnson, and there's probably a couple others in the same territory. Surely he's among the worst though. There doesn't really seem to be any correlation between credibility and experience, that I can see.

---------- Post added 2012-10-08 at 09:28 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Wells

How does one objectively measure political credibility? Honest question. I mean we know when someone has it, or at least has less of it. It seems like a measurement that's impossible to separate from personal bias.

I don't know. I'm not trying to measure it objectively in this line of posting, as I think we're all on more or less the same page. I probably wouldn't even be interested in chatting with someone that thought Bachmann or Inhofe were actually paragons of virtue.

**Dakia** · 2012-10-09, 01:28 AM

Originally Posted by Wells

The McCain campaign put her out front and center and in everyone's view. You're wondering why she got more attention then than the guy the Obama campaign keeps largely quiet?

All I was ever saying is that there is a damn good reason for that. Frankly, I'm amazed he made it on to the ticket again.

**Spectral** · 2012-10-09, 01:30 AM

I can't wrap my head around the idea of President Biden if anything happened to Obama. That just seems weird. Not Palin level bad or anything, just weird.

**Wells** · 2012-10-09, 01:31 AM

Originally Posted by Dakia

All I was ever saying is that there is a damn good reason for that. Frankly, I'm amazed he made it on to the ticket again.

Frankly I think your personal opinion here is too strong to get past. Biden says some dumb stuff. He's one of those people who just says the first thing that pops into his head, we all know someone like that. But that has nothing to do with this ability to perform his job, which is generally respected by his peers and backed up with a long and effective career.

**Dakia** · 2012-10-09, 01:35 AM

Originally Posted by Wells

Frankly I think your personal opinion here is too strong to get past. Biden says some dumb stuff. He's one of those people who just says the first thing that pops into his head, we all know someone like that. But that has nothing to do with this ability to perform his job, which is generally respected by his peers and backed up with a long and effective career.

In Congress, sure. There is no way in Hell I would want this man as a President.

**belfpala** · 2012-10-09, 01:36 AM

Originally Posted by Spectral

Perhaps. I left myself open by making him the singular worst.

I'd agree with among the worst.

**Wells** · 2012-10-09, 01:40 AM

Being a congressman and being a president are very different jobs. I want wonks in congress. Charisma is a lot more important if you want to be president.

**Dakia** · 2012-10-09, 01:41 AM

Originally Posted by Wells

Being a congressman and being a president are very different jobs. I want wonks in congress. Charisma is a lot more important if you want to be president.

Which is why I'm amazed Obama even lets him leave the WH

**Spectral** · 2012-10-09, 01:42 AM

Originally Posted by Wells

Being a congressman and being a president are very different jobs. I want wonks in congress. Charisma is a lot more important if you want to be president.

I agree with this.

**Wells** · 2012-10-09, 01:50 AM

Originally Posted by Dakia

Which is why I'm amazed Obama even lets him leave the WH

He's good if you want to get a partisan crowd going. I catch myself chuckling to some of his more....interesting lines even when I objectively know they're nonsense.

Scumbag brain and all.

**Dakia** · 2012-10-09, 01:58 AM

Originally Posted by Wells

He's good if you want to get a partisan crowd going. I catch myself chuckling to some of his more....interesting lines even when I objectively know they're nonsense.

Scumbag brain and all.

To be honest, I know it probably isn't anywhere near true, but here is my theory on Biden.

Obama has him come out and say something crazy, off the wall, provocative and generally laughable. The media has some fun and basically goes "Oh, well . . . . .that's just 'ol Joe Biden!" Then Obama can come out, not sound like a crazy person, and basically back up what he says.

This probably hasn't happened all the time, but I've seen it happen enough times that I actually think Obama a genius if he is employing that strategy. Biden can practically get away with murder because he simply doesn't have the credibility in the eyes of the public anymore. It just softens those talking points in the future.

**Wells** · 2012-10-09, 02:00 AM

I think its more that Obama manages to play the calm methodical guy in the room (and if embedded journalists are to be believed that's how he actually is) and that that helps him look good in the circus that is American politics.

**Grizzly Willy** · 2012-10-09, 02:17 AM

Originally Posted by Wells

He's good if you want to get a partisan crowd going. I catch myself chuckling to some of his more....interesting lines even when I objectively know they're nonsense.

Scumbag brain and all.

"Crazy Joe Biden" is endearing if misguided at best, confounding at worst. I can't speak to his record, but I can say that I don't have high hopes for him in the debate.

**belfpala** · 2012-10-09, 02:19 AM

Originally Posted by Grokan

"Crazy Joe Biden" is endearing if misguided at best, confounding at worst. I can't speak to his record, but I can say that I don't have high hopes for him in the debate.

Have you heard Paul Ryan talk? He's boring. He loses even me when he starts rattling off numbers.

**Wells** · 2012-10-09, 02:20 AM

Originally Posted by Grokan

"Crazy Joe Biden" is endearing if misguided at best, confounding at worst. I can't speak to his record, but I can say that I don't have high hopes for him in the debate.

I'm not going to lie, Biden benefits from social stereotypes to an extent. Society has a lot more tolerance and acceptance for goofy and stupid when its coming from a friendly old white guy.

**Spectral** · 2012-10-09, 02:23 AM

Originally Posted by belfpala

Have you heard Paul Ryan talk? He's boring. He loses even me when he starts rattling off numbers.

Despite my distaste for his policies, that's what I actually like about him. He might be wrong, but he actually gives a shit and is willing to back an argument with data. I don't know a polite way to say it, but my opinion is that most people are simply too stupid to comprehend arguments that can't be laid out without using numbers.

**belfpala** · 2012-10-09, 02:24 AM

Originally Posted by Spectral

... but my opinion is that most people are simply too stupid to comprehend arguments that can't be laid out without using numbers.

Fine, but it won't win a nationally televised debate.

**Grizzly Willy** · 2012-10-09, 02:26 AM

Originally Posted by belfpala

Have you heard Paul Ryan talk? He's boring. He loses even me when he starts rattling off numbers.

Were I a betting man, I would put money on Ryan being deemed the winner of the coming debate, in part due to the bump from the first debate. With boring versus unpredictable, I place my money on boring since it is less likely to stir controversy.

@Wells

I agree. I don't see him as dumb, or at least not bad dumb. He just says dumb stuff.

**Erenax** · 2012-10-09, 02:27 AM

Originally Posted by belfpala

Have you heard Paul Ryan talk? He's boring. He loses even me when he starts rattling off numbers.

**Spectral** · 2012-10-09, 02:28 AM

Originally Posted by belfpala

Fine, but it won't win a nationally televised debate.

Oh, absolutely not. This is why I have to try very hard to put myself in the shoes of others when I'm trying to figure out who "won" a debate. I thought Obama absolutely buried Romney for the first 15 minutes the other night. People that were insufficiently informed to recognize Romney's lies thought he was great.

Thread: U.S. Presidential race - Democrat Discussion

Thread Tools

Posting Permissions