U.S. Presidential race - Democrat Discussion

[Naxere]

By "loopholes" I meant anything that can be used by someone to avoid paying a higher amount of taxes than what they should.

[belfpala]

By "loopholes" I meant anything that can be used by someone to avoid paying a higher amount of taxes than what they should.

Which is why I want specifics.

If I write off a percentage of my cell phone bill because I use it for business, is that a loophole? Or if I write off some gasoline and wear/tear on my car for driving to business meetings?

I can accept if you say yes, they are loopholes. I just want to know.

[Chrysia]

Which is why I want specifics.

If I write off a percentage of my cell phone bill because I use it for business, is that a loophole? Or if I write off some gasoline and wear/tear on my car for driving to business meetings?

I can accept if you say yes, they are loopholes. I just want to know.

I'm thinking more along the lines of municipal bonds, tax-free mutual funds, inheritance, and "gifts" that aren't really gifts, just payments couched in gift terms to be used as a tax-dodge.

[obdigore]

I'm thinking more along the lines of municipal bonds, tax-free mutual funds, inheritance, and "gifts" that aren't really gifts, just payments couched in gift terms to be used as a tax-dodge.

Inheritance is taxed. 'Gifts' over a certain amount are taxed as well. The biggest 'loophole' in the US is property taxes being waved on religious property.

[Chrysia]

Inheritance is taxed. 'Gifts' over a certain amount are taxed as well. The biggest 'loophole' in the US is property taxes being waved on religious property.

Gifts over $13,000 are only taxed to the person giving.

The inheritance tax can be vastly reduced by breaking the inheritance up. The smaller the inheritance, the smaller the tax, and it's taxed based on what the person is receiving, not the net worth of the inheritance.

I actually support truly religious property being tax-free. That one does get abused, however.

[Mnevis]

Colin Powell endorses Barack Obama for a second term.

[Spectral]

I actually support truly religious property being tax-free.

Why? Personally, I don't see any reason they shouldn't just be held to the same standard as other non-profit organizations. As long as they're legitimate non-profits (and most churches are), I'm fine with them being tax-free. If they're effectively a for profit corporation, I don't see any reason that being of a religious nature should exempt them from paying taxes; in fact, it seems like a government endorsement of religion to allow them to do so.

[oblivionx]

Why? Personally, I don't see any reason they shouldn't just be held to the same standard as other non-profit organizations. As long as they're legitimate non-profits (and most churches are), I'm fine with them being tax-free. If they're effectively a for profit corporation, I don't see any reason that being of a religious nature should exempt them from paying taxes; in fact, it seems like a government endorsement of religion to allow them to do so.

The reason the supreme court gave was that it's the only way to maintain a separation of church and state.

[Spectral]

The reason the supreme court gave was that it's the only way to maintain a separation of church and state.

Which, of course, is absolute nonsense. The best legal test for this is the Lemon test, and property taxes pretty clearly do pass. Providing special rules for religious organizations, on the other hand, does not.

[oblivionx]

Which, of course, is absolute nonsense. The best legal test for this is the Lemon test, and property taxes pretty clearly do pass. Providing special rules for religious organizations, on the other hand, does not.

When this issue came up before I linked the actual decision, that was their decision basically.

And as such, it won't be reversed unless challenged at the Supreme court AND reversed.

[Deleted]

Civil Liberties by ACLU:

[conscript]

Civil Liberties by ACLU:

Pretty comical. Goes to show, the GOP doesn't support big government in words only. They love big government if they can use it to suppress the freedoms and rights of the American citizens through discrimination and oppression.

[Pilobolus]

What metric were they using for racial profiling? I honestly can't think of anything Obama has/hasn't done that has been associated with racial profiling.

[Lenonis]

how much of a profit do you think is too much?

You don't understand. It isn't about quantity. It's about what they do with that money.

If a company gets a huge profit while treating customers and employees well and reinvests that profit into better products or whatnot, that's fantastic.

But if a company gets a huge profit and then donates it all to the KKK that's a problem.

Or if a company gets a huge profit while paying piss poor wages with no benefits, and spends the money on lavish executive bonuses and funding groups to lobby government to dismantle regulation solely so they can make more money at the expense of the health and well being of their customers...that's a problem.

Look at it this way. The Koch brothers get a lot of heat because they spend a lot of their money trying to manipulate the system so they can make even more money at the expense of the intent of the political process. Bill gates gets a lot of praise because he spends a lot of his money in foundations and charitable work.

You aren't going to get me to sit here and say we should regulate how much profit companies can make. But I have every right to criticize what companies do with that profit, and if they are getting government tax breaks or subsidies then that should stop if they don't actually need it.

---------- Post added 2012-10-25 at 09:48 AM ----------

Civil Liberties by ACLU

Pretty graph, but meaningless without information behind it. Plus those are pretty selective civil liberties. almost like someone picked a subset that Johnson is particularly good at perhaps?

[Masark]

What metric were they using for racial profiling? I honestly can't think of anything Obama has/hasn't done that has been associated with racial profiling.

Quoting from the site:

§ Signed Fair Sentencing Act taking first positive steps toward correcting guidelines that led to significant racial disparities in sentencing;
§ Has consistently challenged state laws that invite racial profiling by requiring law enforcement officers to check the immigration status if they suspect illegal entry;
§ Failed to remedy civil rights problems with the immigration enforcement program "Secure Communities.”;
§ Failed to reform Guidance Regarding the Use of Race in Federal Law Enforcement, which allows racial profiling in national security and border integrity investigation and opened the door to the FBI's racial and ethnic mapping program.

[Pilobolus]

Quoting from the site:

Thanks! Went to the main ACLU site and managed to not find my way to the graph to get a closer look. Though, I'm still at work so it very well could have been right in front of me >_<

[Lenonis]

Oy...how did I miss that it was by the ACLU. I find it hard to take them seriously -- they are way too extreme for my tastes.

[Dakia]

Oy...how did I miss that it was by the ACLU. I find it hard to take them seriously -- they are way too extreme for my tastes.

Yeah, I'm not saying that their data is wrong, but the ACLU is out there with PETA for me in terms of credibility and clout anymore.

[Lenonis]

Yeah, I'm not saying that their data is wrong, but the ACLU is out there with PETA for me in terms of credibility and clout anymore.

yeah -- kind of in the "good intentions gone awry" bucket.

[Deleted]

In what way is ACLU extreme? I know it's essentially a left-wing organization with libertarian tendencies, but... what else?