Resto Mastery Uptime Advice Needed (and WG glyph ?)

[Beasty]

non glyph is 6sec cd and with glyph is 8 sec cd so in 40 secs its 6,6 wgs without and 5 with the glyph.. so in terms of this i am right .

I stopped reading here... I would just go back to basics first, because a bit like if you learn a musical piece wrong, you might have a lot of other mistakes as muscle memory now...

[apostoloss]

ok ok i had a mind block thinking its 6sec no need for irony... thought it was 6 sec cd and 8 sec cd with glyph.. // it happens..has nothing to do with knowing the basic and no excuse for irony !

As for the glyphs i only said and repeat myself having a glyph equipped is better than leaving it empty or use a glyph that works with a talent not selected (e.g. healing touch glyph without nature swiftness) thats all .. PEACE PLZ AND FORGIVENESS
(if you notice someone in this topic is using innervate on another even if as i said is highely unlikely to see it happening)

1xxxx2xxxx3xxxx4xxxx5xxxx6
1xxxxx2xxxxx3xxxxx4xxxxx5

x=rejuvs used until next wg . (2sec each )

without glyph : 20 rejuvs and 6 wg in 40 secs hitting 50 people
with glyph :20 rejuvs and 5 wg in 40 secs hitting 50 people

sorry if i sound retarded but the difference i see is that without the glyph is more costly in mana .

p.s. since i dont want to create another topic do you reckon (everyone) perseverance worth the points for last bosses in heroic?

[Shelendil]

Without the glyph in 40 sec, it's 5 wg on 25 people.
With the glyph in 40 sec, it's 4 wg on 24 people and one additional free gcd. If you don't use this gcd to cast additional healing, it's better to unglyph it.

[emni]

1xxxx2xxxx3xxxx4xxxx5xxxx6
1xxxxx2xxxxx3xxxxx4xxxxx5

x=rejuvs used until next wg . (2sec each )

without glyph : 20 rejuvs and 6 wg in 40 secs hitting 50 people
with glyph :20 rejuvs and 5 wg in 40 secs hitting 50 people

sorry if i sound retarded but the difference i see is that without the glyph is more costly in mana .

p.s. since i dont want to create another topic do you reckon (everyone) perseverance worth the points for last bosses in heroic?

Your model is inaccurate since it assumes 2 seconds for each Rejuv.

Even if we do assume 2 seconds for each Rejuv (say due to the fact that you have to also cast other spells in the meantime), your model doesn't account for one more Rejuv after the last glyphed WG. So the more accurate thing would be something like this:

1xxxx2xxxx3xxxx4xxxx5xxxx6
1xxxxx2xxxxx3xxxxx4xxxxx5x

without glyph : 20 rejuvs and 30 WG ticks in 40 secs
with glyph: 21 rejuvs and 30 WG ticks in 40 secs

However, fights don't last 40 seconds. So on a 3 minute fight (120 seconds), this cycle repeats 3 times, which is already 3 extra Rejuvs for the same amount of WG ticks.

1xxxx2xxxx3xxxx4xxxx5xxxx6xxxx1xxxx2xxxx3xxxx4xxxx5xxxx6xxxx1xxxx2xxxx3xxxx4xxxx5xxxx6
1xxxxx2xxxxx3xxxxx4xxxxx5xxxxx1xxxxx2xxxxx3xxxxx4xxxxx5xxxxx1xxxxx2xxxxx3xxxxx4xxxxx5x

without glyph : 68 rejuvs and 90 WG ticks in 120 secs
with glyph: 71 rejuvs and 90 WG ticks in 120 secs

You've just shown yourself that with the glyph you get the same amount of WG ticks while getting more Rejuvs for less mana. And the longer the fight, the better the glyph is.


EDIT: I also just noticed that you claim that the glyph makes you spend more mana. This is untrue because while Rejuv costs 20% of base mana, WG costs 27%. If we apply this to your model, this means that every 40 second cycle you save 7% mana (one less WG but one more Rejuv).

[Myrrar]

You lose ~3% healing from Wild Growth if you glyph it, but you spend 25% less mana and 25% less cast time, so it is easily made up for by giving you more time to cast more heals.

Check my spreadsheet - you can see that using GoWG is a nett gain for both sustainable and burst models. Total healing done by WG is reduced, but more than made up for elsewhere.

Listen to this, and use the spreadsheet.


Assuming based on what you see when you raid is a really bad way to give people advice and/or set your own character up if you want to min/max.

Also, with mastery, if you SM on CD you only have a 5 second gap in harmony. Between CC and refreshing LB with nourish(esp in 10m), you should pretty much auto have a lot of uptime. Most people see a uptime drop when they forget/save SM. If you know you are going to be saving SM for whatever reason, track how much time is left on harmony and just make sure you direct heal(RG/nourish probably) in between.
It's never going to be perfect because there are too many things to worry about to sit and watch harmony, just get as close as you can.

[Druover]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone, this has been a good discussion to my OP. It sounds like I can better manage harmony uptime by better planning my refreshing of LB via nourish or rg. I'll give this a shot. Thanks again for the tips.

As far as the glyph, I'm still torn. I definitely default to tangedyn's tc'ing and spreadsheet. But the two options seem very close, so in 10 man, it seems like that 6th target would go on an undesired target (pet) enough that it would make up that difference. Just my thoughts, but again, I trust the real tc'ers here over my thoughts.

Does anyone have any practical experience on 10 man with the glyph? Like ran a night with it, and then same raid without, and compared? I know it would be impossible to emulate exact same situations, but just curious of any "real wow world" experiences people might have seen with the glyph, as opposed to theorycrafting/spreadsheets. Thanks!

[ergonomic]

Make sure you are using a timer for your PowerAura to track how long you have left on Harmony in order to better time your casts.

[Meejum]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone, this has been a good discussion to my OP. It sounds like I can better manage harmony uptime by better planning my refreshing of LB via nourish or rg. I'll give this a shot. Thanks again for the tips.

As far as the glyph, I'm still torn. I definitely default to tangedyn's tc'ing and spreadsheet. But the two options seem very close, so in 10 man, it seems like that 6th target would go on an undesired target (pet) enough that it would make up that difference. Just my thoughts, but again, I trust the real tc'ers here over my thoughts.

Does anyone have any practical experience on 10 man with the glyph? Like ran a night with it, and then same raid without, and compared? I know it would be impossible to emulate exact same situations, but just curious of any "real wow world" experiences people might have seen with the glyph, as opposed to theorycrafting/spreadsheets. Thanks!

For all normal fights in 10man, based on my own experiences, I would keep the glyph for the entire raid. You could argue not taking it for a few fights, but every fight has points where the raid is stacked, and some fights are largely stand-close-together style. I considered not using it for Zonozz, cause it makes healing ping pong phase easier, but black phase is much tougher to heal overall, so I kept it for that. Warmaster is so spread during P2 that it may not get fully utilized, but P1 with the stacking for soaks it does. Those are really the only two fights where it is merited to possibly drop it, from what I have seen.

The only fight I'm aware of that you absolutely don't want to use the glyph in 10man is Heroic Morchok. Again, with heroic Zonozz and Warmaster you may want to unglyph, since there aren't a whole lot of times where 6+ people will be stood together.

[vinituu]

Would like to add my 5 cents to this thread.

1. Try to heal with only 2 healers. Later in HC modes it will be a must. One more dpser will dramatically increase your chance. And actually it is not so hard.

2. I have been in last months in tree different 10m groups. With totally diferent setup and raidleaders. Not always healers are guilty for low hps - there are mant reasons - mostly: people stays in siht and don't stack when asked. Anyone will agree - that heals will be maxed if raid stacks - DS all fights allows stacking - except maybe some figts (like Hagara). Of course, like shipfight becomes hard, if dps is low or they dont target drakes for example. Fight mechanic is very important.

3. Learn boss fight mechanics - follow up when high dmg comes in and how to use your cd. For example - Yor'sahj the Unsleeping, when blue oazes comes in, all mana will be drained - druids have two very nice cd there - Tranquility and Innervate. For mana regen cast some Lifebloom on tank or on whatever you want, and very soon you will have enought mana to cast Tranquility (normal modes). Innervate - no comments.
Ultraxion - red crystal is more for resto druids then other classes.

4. Remember - spirit isnt so important in gear as bigger mana pool for mana regen. Druids gets mana from: spirit, mana replenishment (lifebloom), revitalize (rejunivation) and innervate. Last three - depends on your mana pool. Mana pool can be increased with Int, talent (spirit), raidbuffs, flask and food. Thats a reason why Int is so important (its inc mana regen, healing done (spell power), crit %)

Rest you can read in forum - lot lot of info

[tangedyn]

Yor'sahj the Unsleeping, when blue oazes comes in, all mana will be drained - druids have two very nice cd there - Tranquility and Innervate.

3 out of 4 times when there is a Mana Void, Deep Corruption will be up, so....

[vinituu]

3 out of 4 times when there is a Mana Void, Deep Corruption will be up, so....

... yes, agree, thatfore i wrote in squares (normal mode) Tranquility in hc with purple oze at Yashir ~ instant wipe

[Gertrude]

@tange - I do look at your work and have done for ages, so ty.

[Demez]

sorry my guild does not do WoL

well, you could always do it yourself.