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  1. #21
    Lucas knows how to make movies he doesnt know how to lead actors, even then I think Harrison Ford and Ewan McGregor did great jobs, Hayden Christensen was horrible thou that guy doesnt know how to act

  2. #22

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Jervaise View Post
    I wrote about it the other day again,

    5-6-7 are terrible movies considering acting and script.

    there are some of the worst acting I have ever seen in my entire life in those movies. I first watched them in the mid 90's.

    1-2-3 are better in acting and CGI of course but they aren't any good either in general.

    I like the SW story and the franchise a lot, It's just the acting that disgusts me.

    Personal opinion, do not flame.
    Nice troll, if not then you should dine in dumpster as that where your taste belongs.

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    Last edited by Culadin; 2012-02-07 at 02:47 AM.

  4. #24
    If you don't know what a Saturday afternoon serial is, you're not allowed to comment on the quality of any of the Star Wars movies. It's as simple as that.
    My apologies in advance, but prepare for a soapbox rant.

    You can decry the "poor acting" in any of the films as much as you want, but it simply illustrates your ignorance. The fact is, they were designed in a very specific style that, at the time of the original trilogy's release would have a) resonated with the adults of the audience in recalling the entertainment of their childhood and b) been a spectacle of wonder for the younger viewers with stunning effects not for the sake of effects, but to create an otherworldly realism. Lucas worked very hard to pry the Star Wars films away from being perceived in the "effects films" genre that was (believe it or not) much drubbed at the time of their creation.

    The greatest misconception about the Star Wars films is its classification as a "science fiction film" as we might perceive the term today. I find Lucas' own term for his films a much more apt description: space opera. Just mull that over for a little while. Now before you call me an idiot, mull it over some more. Now before you still decide to call me an idiot, mull it over again. Do you get it now? Good.

    If you don't, I urge you to watch the DVDs/Blurays (OMG they look amazing) with the commentary track on. You will gain a much, much greater appreciation for all of the films. Then watch some old serials, especially Flash Gordon, and you will gain an even greater appreciation for the films, but more so ANH, Empire, and Jedi.

    I would especially urge this for people like Zik3l. The original trilogy is fantastic. If any of the films need to be remade, it's all three of the prequel trilogy films, and they all need to be remade in the image of the original trilogy, and stripped of a vast quantity of their computer-generated graphics. That scene in the belly of the space slug that you so disliked is an example of your lack of understanding. Quite simply, the films do not need to be remade to fit modern tastes, but rather, modern tastes need to be educated to appreciate the context of different, older styles.

    I'm 24. I saw the original Star Wars trilogy when I was 8 on a cold winter's day when I was home sick with the flu. Even some of the digital drop-ins from 1997's Special Editions of the original trilogy are distasteful to me. Both of the digital Jabbas (yes, there are two different ones) dropped into ANH are awful. I wonder if some of the posters here have even seen the true original trilogy. I prize my VHS box sets of the original trilogy and the Special Editions. The best special feature of all that has sadly been missing from every disc release of the trilogy to date are the commentaries from the Special Edition tapes describing the content and form of the changes made from original to SE.

    Now, as to address the topic of this thread:
    As the OP observes, no, you don't see very much weapons contact in the original films. Why? Because you didn't see very much weapons contact in the 1930s and 40s. The original trilogy was true-to-form. This has absolutely nothing to do with the 70s and 80s. However, in an effort to appeal to an audience that wouldn't understand this, the prequel trilogy followed modern convention and you saw all sort of weapon contact and insane acrobatics. Because that's what we like now. CG acrobatics and lots of colors flashing all over the screen.
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chiaroscuro View Post
    I wonder if some of the posters here have even seen the true original trilogy.
    saw all 3 in the theater in their initial release. of course I was only 1 year old in 1977...

  6. #26
    There is no 4,5 and 6. There's Star Wars, The Empire Strikes Back, that mediocre one with Ewoks, and then 3 new movies that basically consist of George Lucas taking a dump in your eyeballs.

    If you're trying to match up SWTOR to the movies well, it's not really going to work. Healing makes no sense for a start. And let's see:

    1) Jedi vs. Bounty Hunters: well the canonical example of this would be Mace Windu casually decapitating Jango Fett like he's nothing. Because... he's a Jedi... and a Bounty Hunter is just some dude with a blaster and a rocket pack... hell Han accidentally killed Boba Fett without even looking (for the sake of a burp joke no less), and he's just a Smuggler. [Caveat: Episode II is a silly movie and Boba Fett's death in RotJ was also silly. Shrug]

    2) Jedi vs. Troopers: Stormtroopers, Clone Troopers, Republic Troopers, whatever. They're just mooks... lightsabres just easily deflect blaster bolts making them completely outmatched.

    3) Jedi vs. Smugglers: Well your canon example here would be Han trying to shoot Vader when they're captured in Cloud City. Vader is all like "lol... j/k force pull". He deflects the blaster shots with his HAND (albeit a mechanical one). A smuggler is helpless against someone with Force powers.


    And so on. But if it was true to the movies it'd be a pretty boring game wouldn't it?

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    2) Jedi vs. Troopers: Stormtroopers, Clone Troopers, Republic Troopers, whatever. They're just mooks... lightsabres just easily deflect blaster bolts making them completely outmatched.
    Execute Order 66

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Koalachan View Post
    Execute Order 66
    Yeah I've never had a problem with the idea of Jedi deflecting blaster bolts, but deflecting hundreds of them at a time is a bit meh.

    Also to the point of there being too many light sabers in 1-3: There wasn't much of a point in using one in 4-6. Not only was there just a handful light sabers users left, but when you have the Imperial army at your disposal you don't exactly have to chase someone down and cut them in half.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellfury View Post
    Lucas knows how to make movies he doesnt know how to lead actors, even then I think Harrison Ford and Ewan McGregor did great jobs, Hayden Christensen was horrible thou that guy doesnt know how to act
    You try delivering those lines. Seriously. Try it.

    Get another person to stand in for pandamay or w/e and try saying anikins lines.

    You will never make them sound right.

    Why?

    Because they were jotted down on a notepad that lucas keeps next to his toilet.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dddaZhaAxBY
    ^ piss poor vid but go to 1:17 for an example of "dialog"


    pandamay - X
    Anakin - No I X.

    ^ reoccurring script mechanic. And a bad one.
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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    1) Jedi vs. Bounty Hunters: well the canonical example of this would be Mace Windu casually decapitating Jango Fett like he's nothing. Because... he's a Jedi... and a Bounty Hunter is just some dude with a blaster and a rocket pack... hell Han accidentally killed Boba Fett without even looking (for the sake of a burp joke no less), and he's just a Smuggler. [Caveat: Episode II is a silly movie and Boba Fett's death in RotJ was also silly. Shrug]
    Man, I had forgotten how much that scene grinds my gears. For the movies take into account the fact that Jedi are all main characters, so they hero affect the shit out of it.
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  11. #31
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    I really wish netflix wasn't such a ripoff. i'd go stream me some SW right now but its not available for instant queue, like 90% of all good movies... instead, i'm expected to load a frickin DVD into a machine. wtf is this, 1998?

    i'll be happy when my HTPC parts get here so i can finally get it built and rip all my stuff onto 10 terabytes of HDs...

  12. #32
    Not surprising of the comments in here, especially with age gaps and my take is simply opinion of course.

    I'm 41, saw the first in 77' at 6 years old and stood in a long ass line in 84' for RotJ while my dad ran and got us McDonald's LOL.

    The original trilogy was made in a different era of movies and was cutting edge for it's time in terms of special effects and being different. For me of those three, as a kid, I hated Empire Strikes Back. It felt slow, wasn't a happy film to me and kids like happy (I was 9 when I saw it). I didn't get it back then. RotJ at the time was much better to me. It was a feel good story and the good guys win.

    Years go by and the everlasting memory is that of when you were a child and saw them. Then comes the prequel trilogy. Of course all sorts of excitement of SW with the tech they have now to make movies and after seeing The Phantom Menace, I was left with a WTF feeling. Episode 2 was more of the same and to me didn't flow to what I had know as SW. I mean, it didn't flow well with Episode 1. I think that was because of the time gap illustrated between the films, 10 years I think is depicted. So we have the EP1 introducing Anikan as a child. The EP2 comes along and he is introduced as a late teen character. It was like learning a whole new character all over and well...it was. EP3 was the best for me in the prequels but still, the drastic change between Anikan between 2 and 3 was vast so yet again it was like learning a whole new character yet again! So to me, the first 3 flow much better then the prequels.

    Today, things have changed for me in what I personally think is the best film. Now, the film I liked to least is my favorite, ESB! Why, well, for me, it's everything. Same B rate actors at the time but to me it's their best performances. This has everything to do with the fact that ESB is the only film out of the 6 Lucas did not direct. Ivan Kershner gave the film the drama it was meant to depict. As a kid, who the hell cares about that? I didn't! In terms of story flow and such, ESB delivers is particular story the best, for me.

    Now overall on all the films. I am one that wishes GL didn't write and direct all of them with the exception of directing ESB. The story is great but GL doesn't exactly have talent in terms of writing dialogue. In defense of him, when he made the first 3, he didn't know what they would become, such as how popular Boba Fett really was. Also, making the first three without the initial intentions of making a prequel series, that is a tall order to get them to flow, especially when his target audience for the prequels is both children and adults from the originals. I personally feel he overestimated and reached to far into the child base and went to 'family' with the EP1, scaled it back in EP2 and finally got it right with EP3 in terms of what people want to see and I feel that is why the first 3 don't flow like the originals.

    Now the game I love it. I like what the developers have done with it and make it feel like SW. I hope, really hope it opens the door for more movies. It had opened up an avenue to create more movies that are not associated with the current GL series but still capture the SW feel but, I think in order for that to really work, GL needs to take a back seat, just own it and let the creative minds of today's generation make it.

  13. #33
    Honestly comparing the movies to the game really pisses me off. The game was supposed to have taken place like 2k years before the movies, right? Can you honestly explain to me why NOTHING in any culture has changed aesthetically in that much time? If you don't think that's ridiculous look at a picture of New York City just 30 years ago, then look at a current one. Even the starship styles are the same ffs.

    ---------- Post added 2012-02-07 at 12:40 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by greysaber View Post
    I really wish netflix wasn't such a ripoff. i'd go stream me some SW right now but its not available for instant queue, like 90% of all good movies... instead, i'm expected to load a frickin DVD into a machine. wtf is this, 1998?

    i'll be happy when my HTPC parts get here so i can finally get it built and rip all my stuff onto 10 terabytes of HDs...
    That's no fault of NETFLIX dude, you think they don't want all the good movies on stream? Blame big media for being greedy shits.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Chiaroscuro View Post
    If you don't know what a Saturday afternoon serial is, you're not allowed to comment on the quality of any of the Star Wars movies. It's as simple as that.
    My apologies in advance, but prepare for a soapbox rant.

    You can decry the "poor acting" in any of the films as much as you want, but it simply illustrates your ignorance. The fact is, they were designed in a very specific style that, at the time of the original trilogy's release would have a) resonated with the adults of the audience in recalling the entertainment of their childhood and b) been a spectacle of wonder for the younger viewers with stunning effects not for the sake of effects, but to create an otherworldly realism. Lucas worked very hard to pry the Star Wars films away from being perceived in the "effects films" genre that was (believe it or not) much drubbed at the time of their creation.

    The greatest misconception about the Star Wars films is its classification as a "science fiction film" as we might perceive the term today. I find Lucas' own term for his films a much more apt description: space opera. Just mull that over for a little while. Now before you call me an idiot, mull it over some more. Now before you still decide to call me an idiot, mull it over again. Do you get it now? Good.

    If you don't, I urge you to watch the DVDs/Blurays (OMG they look amazing) with the commentary track on. You will gain a much, much greater appreciation for all of the films. Then watch some old serials, especially Flash Gordon, and you will gain an even greater appreciation for the films, but more so ANH, Empire, and Jedi.

    I would especially urge this for people like Zik3l. The original trilogy is fantastic. If any of the films need to be remade, it's all three of the prequel trilogy films, and they all need to be remade in the image of the original trilogy, and stripped of a vast quantity of their computer-generated graphics. That scene in the belly of the space slug that you so disliked is an example of your lack of understanding. Quite simply, the films do not need to be remade to fit modern tastes, but rather, modern tastes need to be educated to appreciate the context of different, older styles.

    I'm 24. I saw the original Star Wars trilogy when I was 8 on a cold winter's day when I was home sick with the flu. Even some of the digital drop-ins from 1997's Special Editions of the original trilogy are distasteful to me. Both of the digital Jabbas (yes, there are two different ones) dropped into ANH are awful. I wonder if some of the posters here have even seen the true original trilogy. I prize my VHS box sets of the original trilogy and the Special Editions. The best special feature of all that has sadly been missing from every disc release of the trilogy to date are the commentaries from the Special Edition tapes describing the content and form of the changes made from original to SE.

    Now, as to address the topic of this thread:
    As the OP observes, no, you don't see very much weapons contact in the original films. Why? Because you didn't see very much weapons contact in the 1930s and 40s. The original trilogy was true-to-form. This has absolutely nothing to do with the 70s and 80s. However, in an effort to appeal to an audience that wouldn't understand this, the prequel trilogy followed modern convention and you saw all sort of weapon contact and insane acrobatics. Because that's what we like now. CG acrobatics and lots of colors flashing all over the screen.
    Like I said, there are many people who do not feel as I do. However crying ignorance is rather out of line. I understand for their day they were amazing films. When I watch a film, I want to be engrossed in it. Seeing Yoda's mouth have an open and shut puppet like action does not appeal to me.

    "the films do not need to be remade to fit modern tastes, but rather, modern tastes need to be educated to appreciate the context of different, older styles" - Do you adapt to the future, or do you stay stubborn and claim that the basic methods were much better? Do you think that if the original movies were developed with today's technology back when they were first released people would have cried "We want to see puppets! It looks too real!" No. Their eyes would of orgasm'd and they would have exclaimed that this was the most insane thing since perforated toilet roll.

    The story line is awesome the universe they made was fantastic. Maybe I just prefer the story line of grandeur, when the Jedi's were a based civilization. However watching the Older films, I couldn't help but think; "How does this make any sense to the audience without the first 3 films?" Maybe that's the point, the surprise rather than the suspense of when it's going to be broken to the characters.

    TL;DR - Each to their own, I am not knocking fans of the old movies, I can see why there are so many, however I just think so much more could have been done. Too many people seem to fear change, embrace it.
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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Koalachan View Post
    Execute Order 66
    Far be it from me to justify the silly plot of the prequel movies, but didn't it take an army of Republic troopers to execute the Jedi, who were all spread out across the galaxy, isolated and caught unawares?

    Hell, even in the "Alderaan" trailer for SWTOR the worst the Trooper can do to the Sith is give them a nasty tan with a grenade. They would've been wiped out if the Jedi hadn't turned up and dropped a mountain on him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zik3l View Post
    However watching the Older films, I couldn't help but think; "How does this make any sense to the audience without the first 3 films?"
    If anything the prequels messed up the original plot so that it makes less sense than it used to.
    Last edited by Mormolyce; 2012-02-07 at 06:37 AM.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    hell Han accidentally killed Boba Fett without even looking (for the sake of a burp joke no less)?
    Boba Fett didn't die. He actually escaped the Sarlacc by tricking it (Solo made him fall into a Sarlacc Pit AGAIN which he also once again escaped) and actually ended up befriending Han Solo and ended up helping train his daughter.
    Last edited by Mech; 2012-02-07 at 07:15 AM.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Mech View Post
    Boba Fett didn't die. He actually escaped the Sarlacc by tricking it (Solo made him fall into a Sarlacc Pit AGAIN which he also once again escaped) and actually ended up befriending Han Solo and ended up helping train his daughter.
    That's all EU stuff though...

    Personally it disheartens me how people actually like 1-3 more than 4-6. Granted, I'm not old enough to have seen 4-6 in theaters originally in the late 70s/early 80s, but I do own the original VHS (non-edited, original theatrical), saw the first tweaked 4-6 in theaters in the late 90s, and of course 1-3. In all honesty I don't think I could choose between 1-3 as to which're better, as to me all 3 are classics; if anything to me 4 was just a tad weaker than 5-6, but he probably didn't have the lore all fleshed out by then, which is more apparent in 5-6. And don't get me started on how badly George Lucas has been corrupting every release of 4-6 since with more and more unnecessary tweaks...

    From there though, I'd go 1>3>2; 2 to me was just horrible crap, they chose a horrible actor to play teen Anakin (let alone how the fuck his hair went from sandy blond to brown), and he just came off as a whiny prick. About the only decent part in 2 was the end battle/duels, but even then that was a bit overly heavy with the CGI (of which I'm part convinced corrupted George Lucas somehow, he seems to have forgot a good story and acting = better movie than in-your-face-every-second CGI). 1 I liked in general sans Jar Jar, to me it captured the feel of the original 3 the best. 3 was better than 2, but not as good as 1 to me, mainly due to some idiot that played Anakin again...that just ruined it for me. And don't get me started on how C3PO, R2, and Chewbacca somehow made appearances...C3PO being built by the young Vader had to be one of the dumbest moments to me.

    I could go on, but it'd mostly be more ranting aimed at 1-3 for the most part. I mean overall there's worse movies obviously, and 1-3 do help to build the lore some, but they're also a good case study on how prequel films aren't always that good; you can't capture magic just like that again, and with the overburden of CGI and subpar acting and such, they just look out of place when you're then expected to believe 4-6 happened later and makes you wonder if the galaxy went back into the stone age during the 20 years inbetween 3-4.

  18. #38
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    Most troopers in the original trilogy were recruits or conscripts, IIRC. The republic troopers in the prequels were clones of Jango Fett, programmed to serve Palpatine. So it depends on your view of whether clones are individuals or just tools.
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  19. #39
    The real disconnect between the two trilogies and what saved the original trilogy is that Lucas wasn't allowed to have full creative control over the original three. Back in the 70's and 80's Lucas had everyone telling him when he was doing something wrong, so much so that he didn't even direct and write the Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi.

    Lucas has always wanted over the top extravagance (which the kids dig I guess) and the veteran film makers that he worked with knew when to say enough was enough but with Episodes 1-3 there was no one that could stop him from ditching quality storytelling for excessive visual effects.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by empy View Post
    he real disconnect between the two trilogies and what saved the original trilogy is that Lucas wasn't allowed to have full creative control over the original three. Back in the 70's and 80's Lucas had everyone telling him when he was doing something wrong, so much so that he didn't even direct and write the Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi.
    He wrote them. In fact, originally he wrote two movies, and they made him pick one. He picked the second. When that proved to be too long of a movie they had him break it up into the three parts we now know. It also wasn't so much that he "had people telling him what to do" but more he asked for advice and didn't claim to know everything like he does now. Now a days he basically shuts down anyone who tries to stand up to him, because he claims he 'knows what they fans want.'

    ---------- Post added 2012-02-07 at 12:48 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    Far be it from me to justify the silly plot of the prequel movies, but didn't it take an army of Republic troopers to execute the Jedi, who were all spread out across the galaxy, isolated and caught unawares?

    Hell, even in the "Alderaan" trailer for SWTOR the worst the Trooper can do to the Sith is give them a nasty tan with a grenade. They would've been wiped out if the Jedi hadn't turned up and dropped a mountain on him.
    Yoda was isolated and caught unawares. He lived. Thanks to the butchering by GL of "he helped hunt them down and kill them all" they weren't even isolated. They were just there, surrounded by their troops, doing their thing. Hells, in the movie you can even see in most of their eyes that they know its coming (Ki Adi Mundi especially).

    As for the Alderaan video, its a bunch of troops that are outnumbered and outgunned. Ol' boy leader of Havoc squad went toe to toe with Darth Malgus himself, and I mean come on, you don't exactly fight him solo in the game. But the troops themselves still managed to take out some regular sith. You see the bodies all over the ground.

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