Madness 25HC Ret - Spellweave -

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

Progressing on Madness 25HC and got in roughly 40 tries so far and we've gotten to a 2% wipe on the 4th "wing" / "platform".

After raids I compare my own logs with older logs that has retribution paladins in it, mainly Butosai, Ceveraja and Ravengaar and noticing they have way more damage from spellweave than I have.
Is there any trick to it?
spreading seal of truth?
DS like mad?

I've checked some of the buffs/damage done meters of named players and Butosai uses Heroic Creche (as am I) and Ceveraja is using Heroic BLF, I don't have BLF myself but does it make spellweave go off?

My own guild is very tight on parasite damage so I'm "scared" to use divine storm and cleave instead of nuking a bit harder single target. I'm not aiming for a top 50 or a top 100 parse, we're progressing and ranks should come with better gear in the whole raid.

Looking at Ceveraja's best parse he did 205 Divine Storms at kill, that's with all the adds at last phase where I've not been myself.
My best or longest parse was 12 minutes and I did 23 Divine storms (I'm also on Elementium Bolt if that matters), I know it's really, REALLY low.

My logs, feel free to browse: http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-g0...=13282&e=14002

So my question, should I trust that our dps is high enough on parasite itself and just go on a "cleave rotation" and is that the main reason for my relative lack of dps compared to the top 20 parses from ret paladins?


Only been progressing this for a day so haven't had the chance to make adjustments in my own play based on logs yet, I'll most likely try a more DS heavy build but it feels "wrong" when we're so close on parasite.

[NaaBcAke]

Here's the advice , at least what i do, to go for high ranks while progressing content - i test various stuffs during first part of progress, aka while we are still testing overall tactics and geting to know fight. Afterwards when we are close to kill, i go team mode, ignore my personal damage, and work with rest to get boss kill asap.
After that, next week, you can start using all data that you pick up while progresing, to start working on WOL hunting.

TLDR ignore it first week, play for the team, once boss is dead , push stuffs to get there. Even i, and trust me im big dmg whore, dont care about that when progress is at stake, especialy as in this case last boss of curent content.
After that if you see your guild is good with dmg, sit on DS with BLF all day long if thats what you want.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

I do what you do Lumendal, I ignore how my meters or parses look during progress. But like I said this was my first night of progressing on it and while I'm fairly high on damage to everything but blobs I was wondering if it's considered better to go aoe rotation when the situation calls for it, not for my own logs but for the sake of progression.

Gonna progress again on sunday and try to cleave the fuck out of the blobs, if it works out for the raid then awesome. If it doesn't... well FLM.

[rinleezwins]

The more spellweave damage you get, the worse you are doing. Spellweave damage should be really low except for aoe bloods.

As to high wol rankings, don't look at them while progressing. In our case, on heroic spine pre-nerf, 2 guys who were supposed to dps bloods were using BLF and those trinkets are not controllable, which sometimes ended in few ads getting killed at the same time in really bad situations.

It's just like healing for logs. Right now I am a holy paladin and if I wanted the logs I'd have to ginore the tanks an just spam 100% radiance/lod. This way tanks would always die in last phase of heroic madness.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

searching through my logs on our 2% wipe at last platform i did a laughable 4.6m damage to bloods, our feral was top at 19m. Not that we wiped from bloods or anything but still makes me wonder how much others might be inflating their meters or I'm just doing it horribly wrong.

[rinleezwins]

searching through my logs on our 2% wipe at last platform i did a laughable 4.6m damage to bloods, our feral was top at 19m. Not that we wiped from bloods or anything but still makes me wonder how much others might be inflating their meters or I'm just doing it horribly wrong.

Talking of aoe, you need as much ticks as possible. A single holy wrath from a holy paladin procs to 200-300k damage. So, seal of righteousness, conse, divien storm and holy wrath for insane spellweave damage(if you aint doing that already).

You did 110k damage with seal of truth + command talent.

Our retri did 300 with seal of righteousnes and 150 with talent. And that also gives a lot more spellweave procs.

I don't know if BLF procs spellweave but I wouldn't use it. Single target dps is really neeed on this fight as you can see yourself (2% tentacle wipe). I'd go with a trinket setup similar to heroic spine. Not random proccing one.

[Butosai]

Hi Huntingbear

First off refer to my heroic madness PoV video in the paladin PoV thread. That was our first kill and I didnt meter cheese at all ,switched to everything, and got rank 11 using EoU, creche, and experimental specimen slicer. This week I did slightly better 80k dps with letting ranged kill the bolts and parasites on the first two platforms. I was on pace for 88-90k before my raid leader decided to have me jump over to blue at the start and get it to 91%, which destroys our dps. ( I got a heroic gurthalak though! )

BLF does make spellweave go off and is by far the best trinket for this encounter, trying to parse or not. I unfortunately just dont have one, or id use it.

You should aoe on the parasites with seal of righteous, just maintain the parasite as your main target. The reason the bloods are brought onto the parasite is for the spellweave damage onto the parasite along with killing the bloods at the same time. You are only helping your raid and doing more damage to the parasite by aoeing in this situation.

As for getting the most spellweave as you can you need to know what procs it. Basically prioritize divine storm > holy wrath > normal rotation when aoeing. consecration doesnt proc spellweave but divine storm and holy wrath do.

[Donkeywing]

hai bear ~~

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

Thanks Butosai, giving me a chubby like allways... I knew what was proccing spellweave and I'll go into a aoe rotation sunday and try to work from there, if it turns out our damage elsewhere get's fucked then I'll swap back. Thanks for the tips, looks like I'll go LFR this week and pray that I win BLF and try it out.

---------- Post added 2012-02-10 at 01:50 AM ----------

hai bear ~~

Hia Donkey, niners <3

[NaaBcAke]

As for getting the most spellweave as you can you need to know what procs it. Basically prioritize divine storm > holy wrath > normal rotation when aoeing. consecration doesnt proc spellweave but divine storm and holy wrath do.

This
(le 10 chars)

[Selgar]

Thanks Butosai, giving me a chubby like allways... I knew what was proccing spellweave and I'll go into a aoe rotation sunday and try to work from there, if it turns out our damage elsewhere get's fucked then I'll swap back. Thanks for the tips, looks like I'll go LFR this week and pray that I win BLF and try it out.

Unfortunately BLF doesn't drop in LFR

[Deleted]

Unfortunately BLF doesn't drop in LFR

It does. (See here, over 1k seen) It's just rather rare.

Or were you being sarcastic?

[Benefits]

Spellweave is the key to huge damage numbers. The common strat used in most 25 man guilds, and the same one I personally killed it with, is having the tanks hold 1 blood through the whole fight. Have a Holy Paladin or somebody with a taunt mechanic taunt out 1 blood from each AOE pack and keep it. After the AOE, the tanks will swap it back and forth or manage it somehow to reset the stacks it gives. It's a very easy and simple concept. You keep dots and cleaves on the blood while you're dpsing the Corruptions, Arm Tentacles, and even the Parasites. Spellweave should always be your number 1 attack for most classes BY FAR. If it isn't you're doing something wrong most likely.

Overall the idea is to have that 1 single Blood be within 6 yards of anything the raid is DPSing. Any dot class should always keep it dotted up, but be careful that it does not die. Even on the last platform dpsing Deathwings head, you keep a Blood from the previous platform alive as long as you can. Then when it dies, you do the same thing with one of the Elementium Terrors and drag it into the Congealing Bloods to help proc Spellweave for massive AOE damage.

...and if someone already said this, or you're already doing it, I must of missed it being said. Hope this helps!

Edit: There is a video of this strat being used on my YouTube channel...link is in my sig.

[Ellesarr]

Spellweave is the key to huge damage numbers. The common strat used in most 25 man guilds, and the same one I personally killed it with, is having the tanks hold 1 blood through the whole fight. Have a Holy Paladin or somebody with a taunt mechanic taunt out 1 blood from each AOE pack and keep it. After the AOE, the tanks will swap it back and forth or manage it somehow to reset the stacks it gives. It's a very easy and simple concept. You keep dots and cleaves on the blood while you're dpsing the Corruptions, Arm Tentacles, and even the Parasites. Spellweave should always be your number 1 attack for most classes BY FAR. If it isn't you're doing something wrong most likely.

Overall the idea is to have that 1 single Blood be within 6 yards of anything the raid is DPSing. Any dot class should always keep it dotted up, but be careful that it does not die. Even on the last platform dpsing Deathwings head, you keep a Blood from the previous platform alive as long as you can. Then when it dies, you do the same thing with one of the Elementium Terrors and drag it into the Congealing Bloods to help proc Spellweave for massive AOE damage.

...and if someone already said this, or you're already doing it, I must of missed it being said. Hope this helps!

its actualy a dps lost to keep 1 blood with dots on it

[Benefits]

its actualy a dps lost to keep 1 blood with dots on it

I won't disagree with you, but in my guilds experience is was a huge gain. We tried both with and without keeping a blood, and keeping one was a massive increase for us.

[Butosai]

its mostly for rogues, but its a dps gain

[Selgar]

It does. (See here, over 1k seen) It's just rather rare.

Or were you being sarcastic?

See now I'm just pissed. I thought it didn't drop (like the weapons), now I have to admit its just my crap ass luck....