Disc on HM Spine

[notdryad]

Was it ever fixed so that absorption effects work on Searing Plasma? I feel like Disc would be much better for Searing Plasma than Holy (not to say Holy can't get the job done).

[Sinn]

Your shield doesn't count as healing for the debuff (won't bring it down), but it will absorb damage as it should allowing you to save people from damage before/while healing through the debuff. Pretty useful indeed.

[Docta]

Holy has better raw output on the searing plasma targets, but disc brings loads of utility on spine via dispels/shielding people with grips/shielding searing plasma during rolls or amalg explosions, barrier, tank assist healing, etc.

[Daear]

You'll love the shields later on in the fight when people have -30% hp. I use a specialized spec for this with surge of light, it's an amazing amount of free healing on such a long fight.

[Phyxiusx]

I ended up going holy after the nerf, rolling renews and keeping them up with normal heals on the debuffed players, and ended up with a shitload of healing done to the debuffs. I was originally disc on the fight, but after the nerf, the fight is pretty faceroll so i ended up going holy for the extra raw output.

[Rfx]

If your not holy for this fight your doing it wrong.
Hymn>barrier
Throughput on searing plasma > bubbles
Body/soul for kiter also helpful

[Sinn]

No your not doing wrong if your disc on this fight. Especially in 10-man where you can smite a lot.

[Rfx]

What does smiting a lot have to do with holy smashing disc throughput? Shields mean nothing on this fight. Disc means nothing on this fight.

[Sinn]

Holy does more throughput than disc, of course (it also goes oom much quicker). But disc brings some very useful cooldowns. And seriously, you think that shields mean nothing on this fight? They do save lives when people affected by debuff take damage (during rolls, while amalgamation ticks, and at the end, when the OT takes occasional burst damage when kiting). Also, it felt on our kill that 2 healers were not enough and 3 too much. Disc dps is welcomed in that situation. Depends on your comp, obviouly.

[Sark]

What does smiting a lot have to do with holy smashing disc throughput? Shields mean nothing on this fight. Disc means nothing on this fight.

You are actually 100% totally and completely wrong about spine. Holy throughput, and divine hymn as a cooldown, are both negligible as compared to anything a shaman can do. While it is true that holy priests will bring greater throughput, a priest is not optimal in a throughput role on that fight, leave that to shaman or paladin. Disc priests are the preferred spec largely due to utility.

Once upon a time, before blizzard nerfed HM-spine to oblivion, dps was important, and disc's ability to smite off searing plasma while contributing DPS was meaningful. More importantly, however, is Barrier, as a raid cooldown. Barrier is, has, and always will be, the strongest raid cooldown. PW:S on grip targets on P3, as well as PW:S in general during the nuclear blast.

The fact of the matter is that looking at a lot of the early kills, and almost any of the pre-nerf kills, disc was actually the preferred spec to be. The information you are telling him is simply false.

But to answer your first question, no, absorbs do not reduce the value on searing plasma.

[Rfx]

We're not talking about pre-nerf spine. We're talking about spine how it is know, so most of that is irrelevant. AMZ is stronger then Barrier just saying.
When you're running with three shamans that can drop a SLT, with three warriors who can also roar for all amalg explosions/rolls I don't think the barrier is as useful as a Divine Hymn.

While shields can save lives when say, someone is stunned with the debuff at 20% hp. Sure, but if you we're holy theres a high change that searing plasma would already be gone.

[Sark]

AMZ is stronger then Barrier just saying.

What? Please tell me this is a joke. That statement is so far beyond ridiculous, it's unreal.

When you're running with three shamans that can drop a SLT, with three warriors who can also roar for all amalg explosions/rolls I don't think the barrier is as useful as a Divine Hymn.

While shields can save lives when say, someone is stunned with the debuff at 20% hp. Sure, but if you we're holy theres a high change that searing plasma would already be gone.

The rest of this post is simply untrue. It really is. I'd love to see any logs which show there being no searing plasma up during the third plate.

I know you're really excited to come on these forums and try to boast your kill, but you're simply feeding this man misinformation. I wouldn't have even bothered posting if you had simply said "i believe holy to have certain unique uses which discipline lacks," but you come in here spouting ridiculous inaccuracies such as

If your not holy for this fight your doing it wrong.

and

Shields mean nothing on this fight. Disc means nothing on this fight.

I took the liberty of looking at the logs of some of your more recent (post nerf, mind you, since you said my pre-nerf analogies were irrelevant, so i apologize for actually killing it when i did, as it apparently skews my knowledge of game concepts) logs, and have found quite a few scenarios where one of the first deaths was due to a grip with searing plasma or a tick of superheated nucleolus with searing plasma or the burst from the death of blood with a searing plasma debuff.

Those attempts can be found here:
http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-3q...=14319&e=14874 (both of the mage's deaths)
http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-3q...=13525&e=14103 (your death actually. lol. also the shamans. Notice how you took a tick of a holy divine hymn too, but it did not save you)
http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-3q...=12946&e=13308 (shaman dies to grasping tendrils with a searing plasma)

And those are just a few of your wipes this week. The reality is that it is unrealistic, even as holy, to have no searing plasma up, and in most of those situations, a PW:S would have made a tremendous difference.

[Rfx]

AMZ truly is the best raid CD the game has atm if used correctly. If you disagree with this statement then I suggest you research before insinuating i'm making a joke.

I diddn't come here to boat anything. I came here to shed insight on this class. You're arguing to support the spec that isn't as ideal as the other one that is available to you. I said bubbles are useless, I clearly exaggerated that too far to the point where you think it is necessary to explain how a priest works. You link my guilds logs which is cool, yet you know nothing about my healing roster. I can promise you, that a bubble wouldn't make the difference. I agree that bubbles can save lives, I played disc on this fight as well as holy. I understand what you are trying to say and you just to my hyperbole too far.

And there are significantly less debuffs on the third plate when I played holy compared to disc. I don't see how you can argue this point.

[Ayreon]

fyi holy priests can cast power word: shield too

anyway both specs are viable. I used holy prenerf cause the 30k hps + hymns after rolls made quite a difference

[Sark]

AMZ truly is the best raid CD the game has atm if used correctly. If you disagree with this statement then I suggest you research before insinuating i'm making a joke.

I diddn't come here to boat anything. I came here to shed insight on this class. You're arguing to support the spec that isn't as ideal as the other one that is available to you. I said bubbles are useless, I clearly exaggerated that too far to the point where you think it is necessary to explain how a priest works. You link my guilds logs which is cool, yet you know nothing about my healing roster. I can promise you, that a bubble wouldn't make the difference. I agree that bubbles can save lives, I played disc on this fight as well as holy. I understand what you are trying to say and you just to my hyperbole too far.

And there are significantly less debuffs on the third plate when I played holy compared to disc. I don't see how you can argue this point.

I refute your points with facts and log links, you refute my with anecdotal evidence. Your entire argument is predicated on anecdotal evidence.

If you are truly that closed-minded, then my words are wasted. Hopefully the OP has read my post and will take to heart some actual sound advice from an informed individual.

fyi holy priests can cast power word: shield too

anyway both specs are viable. I used holy prenerf cause the 30k hps + hymns after rolls made quite a difference

Yes, and disc priests can divine hymn too. This really doesn't have anything to do with the argument at hand.

An additional edit: perhaps it wasn't clear, as shown by a few of the posts below, but my argument is SPECIFICALLY with regards to the hardmode.

[CoolNitro]

The whole point those who are voting for Holy are trying to make is that holy is better then disc for removing the debuff quicker and as a main spec Disc priest I completely agree but at the same time Disc is also good for pure prevention of deaths if the debuff isn't removed quick enough. I've seen it many a time where a player is sitting on 1% health with the small oozes eating at their ankles and the debuff on their heads, a PW:shield at that moment along with some DA from Gheals can support the player long enough to remove the debuff and save them where as you wouldn't have gotten enough time with standard throughput.

So dependent on how your fight goes and how good your group is at removing the debuff both specs have their uses.

I would say if your group is only having minor issues with the encounter and the debuff it's self is not that big of an issues they Holy would be the best spec for you, that is to say the group as a whole is not making any mistakes and random people are not taking much random damage like the grasping tendrils getting cleared quickly.

On the other hand if you are having random damage issues and people with the debuff tend to lose a lot of health then Disc is the better option to support that group.

Tbh I kind of make that sound like Holy is for elite groups and Disc is for scrubs but imo it's not far off, Disc is only better on this fight if your group screws up and that's purely in a who lives who dies sense hps for Disc on this fight don't matter.

[Rfx]

I refute your points with facts and log links, you refute my with anecdotal evidence. Your entire argument is predicated on anecdotal evidence.

If you are truly that closed-minded, then my words are wasted. Hopefully the OP has read my post and will take to heart some actual sound advice from an informed individual.

If you are trying to argue that disc is stronger on this fight then holy. Then you are wrong, and evidence is in 90% of the WoL Parses for this fight. (No im not just talking about sheer HPS)

Shields are strong yes, and can prevent deaths when grips+debuffs are a combination I completely agree, but the fact of the matter is that holy is stronger on this fight. And you still didn't acknowledge the whole AMZ > Everything.

Im not trying to start some sort of back and forth fight (which this has ended in anyway).

[Sark]

If you are trying to argue that disc is stronger on this fight then holy. Then you are wrong, and evidence is in 90% of the WoL Parses for this fight. (No im not just talking about sheer HPS)

Shields are strong yes, and can prevent deaths when grips+debuffs are a combination I completely agree, but the fact of the matter is that holy is stronger on this fight. And you still didn't acknowledge the whole AMZ > Everything.

Im not trying to start some sort of back and forth fight (which this has ended in anyway).

If you think healing is about parses, then my words are wasted on you.

And there is nothing to acknowledge,you fail to have provided any sort of evidence for you claim. I am aware it will reduce the magic damage done by 75% for all simultaneous ticks, even if it reaches the absorb threshold, but that does not compare to 25% reduced damage for 10seconds regardless of damage taken, and an increase to healing done. It simply does not. Either way, don't bother responding, we can agree to disagree. I'll take progression over parses any day.

Either way, i'm going to bed. Have a great morning and rest of the day.

[Yilar]

What does smiting a lot have to do with holy smashing disc throughput? Shields mean nothing on this fight. Disc means nothing on this fight.

Throughput means nothing if you can't deliver it on demand. Much of the holy throughput comes from standing in the HWS circle where you heal the periodic blood dmg, where you're just competing with the resto shaman and the resto druid for "useless" hps. Disc can heal around the debuff, has a better cd (hey no channeling required!) and can assist with dps (maybe not as relevant now), but back in the day when dps mattered disc was pretty much the only option.

I'm not sure why we're discussing AMZ btw, this is the priest forum?

[Cookiematico]

The whole point those who are voting for Holy are trying to make is that holy is better then disc for removing the debuff quicker and as a main spec Disc priest I completely agree but at the same time Disc is also good for pure prevention of deaths if the debuff isn't removed quick enough. I've seen it many a time where a player is sitting on 1% health with the small oozes eating at their ankles and the debuff on their heads, a PW:shield at that moment along with some DA from Gheals can support the player long enough to remove the debuff and save them where as you wouldn't have gotten enough time with standard throughput.

So dependent on how your fight goes and how good your group is at removing the debuff both specs have their uses.

I would say if your group is only having minor issues with the encounter and the debuff it's self is not that big of an issues they Holy would be the best spec for you, that is to say the group as a whole is not making any mistakes and random people are not taking much random damage like the grasping tendrils getting cleared quickly.

On the other hand if you are having random damage issues and people with the debuff tend to lose a lot of health then Disc is the better option to support that group.

Tbh I kind of make that sound like Holy is for elite groups and Disc is for scrubs but imo it's not far off, Disc is only better on this fight if your group screws up and that's purely in a who lives who dies sense hps for Disc on this fight don't matter.

This tbh, though I would call disc is more as a contingency safety when progressing and there is nothing wrong with that. Which spec is better or worse on this specific fight depends on your guilds progress, players, setup etc. If you have for example controlled dps on corruption to immediately free the gripped people out without overnuking and also thus not even allowing one tick to hit , then holy would have an increased value. Could say this in almost every scenario: asking which is better is fine, but you have to look in the big picture of your teammates abilities, skills and needs for that specific encounter.

p.s: lightwell is nifty , though might be a clusterfuck to click it with lots of shit/healthbars going on