Garrosh as Warchief of the Horde: Do you think there's hope for him?

[Skytotem]

I have hope for him and I like him, but Blizz has already passed their verdict sadly.

Metzen said he's "kill kill kill" and admitted he was only put into the story to make Thrall look better.


So much wasted potential.

[ambigiouslynamed]

Wow I must have missed that. Was that from when you deliver the package directly to him?

yeah, basically http://www.wowhead.com/quest=25267 you deliver an SI:7 patch to garrosh and he freaks out when he hears thrall had you deliver it

[Trassk]

Oh please sky, I think you just prefered the notion of a blood crazy warmonger leading the horde down a dark path. Which is... kind of ironic, given your stance of Sylvanas.

[Combatbulter]

Oh please sky, I think you just prefered the notion of a blood crazy warmonger leading the horde down a dark path. Which is... kind of ironic, given your stance of Sylvanas.

Garrosh cares for the orcs, Sylvanas sees her people as some sort of meatshield. So Garrosh isn't as dark as Sylvanas

[Trassk]

Garrosh cares for the orcs, Sylvanas sees her people as some sort of meatshield. So Garrosh isn't as dark as Sylvanas

Given the questchain in silverpine, all it seems Garrosh regards the forsaken as is meatshields for his war, a useful tool for his conquest. Sylvanas might be dark and I do think her cause for her people has changed, but she isn't meant to be the leader of all the horde, Garrosh is, and he's doing a misrable job of keeping things together.

[Skytotem]

the end of the goblin starter experience implies garrosh tried to have thrall killed or at least captured so no

It's sad that this might be what Blizz is doing, but it makes no sense.

1. Even if Garrosh is secretly evil somehow, he's never been one for subtlety, manipulating the Alliance into taking out Thrall? That's not something you'd think he -could- do.

2. Thrall mentions someone tried to get him captured/killed to Vol'jin but doesn't go into detail and then defends his choice ofGarrosh to Vol'jin in the starter area, why would he do that if he thought Garrosh did it?

3. Garrosh says he 'knows the meaning' of the badge... but aside from being shaken by it doesn't react all that much, he just lets the goblins into the Horde.

[gypsybob]

Garrosh is a warrior type. Just because some people don't like this it doesn't mean he's necessarily a badly written character, you just don't like how its been done. I liked the whole 'fuck our enemies' stance that the Horde had in WCII

[Mongoose19]

Thrall > Garrosh, nothing else to add. He will always be temporary warchief for me.

[Leonidas]

I have hope for him and I like him, but Blizz has already passed their verdict sadly.

Metzen said he's "kill kill kill" and admitted he was only put into the story to make Thrall look better.


So much wasted potential.

I don't like Garrosh, but I do agree, they wasted a character that could have been very compelling and awesome. Thrall is severely overdone in my eyes. Yeah, he's interesting, but there is only so much Thrall I can handle in my Warcraft... and it's close to the limit before I start getting truly annoyed with Thrall's character being so dominate in the story-line.

Personally, I would love to see Saurfang or even Vol'jin lead the Horde, if not for just a while... They both have much character that can be brought to light by being put into a position like that... Both good and bad.

[Skytotem]

I don't like Garrosh, but I do agree, they wasted a character that could have been very compelling and awesome. Thrall is severely overdone in my eyes. Yeah, he's interesting, but there is only so much Thrall I can handle in my Warcraft... and it's close to the limit before I start getting truly annoyed with Thrall's character being so dominate in the story-line.

Personally, I would love to see Saurfang or even Vol'jin lead the Horde, if not for just a while... They both have much character that can be brought to light by being put into a position like that... Both good and bad.

I agree Vol'jin could grow, but I think Saurfang is too perfect.

[Mikey P]

Garrosh is a warrior type. Just because some people don't like this it doesn't mean he's necessarily a badly written character, you just don't like how its been done. I liked the whole 'fuck our enemies' stance that the Horde had in WCII

This is pretty much how I feel. When I rolled my first Horde toon, the Horde still had some of that aura to me. Then it became the "cool" faction to play, and now it will never be seen as playing as the bad guys.

At this point I wish WoW would just do away with factions.

[Chouzan]

I'd love for Garrosh to stick around as some figure. The problem I really see with plans for him is that no one expects him to improve things in any way. There is no surprise or dynamic in the character.

When I look at him I think Blizz is just waving this HI, REMEMBER REND BLACKHAND AND THE 'TRUE HORDE'? YEAH, WE'RE GONNA DO THAT AGAIN banner in everyone's faces.

If Thrall does return as the Warchief, I'd love for him to basically let Garrosh know any of the faults that Thrall saw but at the same time absolve him and thank him for taking over in his absence. Hopefully from there, instead of us getting this stereotypical, one-note RAAAAGE from Garrosh, he can use the experience to set himself to purpose and assume a position of power, wisen up, and become this incredible Horde leader and inspiration for the Warriors within the Horde.

For all the negatives that Blizz loves to throw in our face, let's not forget that Garrosh is someone who will give every drop of blood for the Horde, and Orcs in particular. I think his unyielding devotion is really downplayed in light of his RAAAAGE behavior. I'd be perhaps intrigued if Garrosh fulfilled the noble sacrifice trope, but I don't think anyone in the Horde would be satisfied with Garrosh going down after how much he has been built up as the successor of the Orc that killed Mannoroth.

[Rhys]

People, you do realise hating Garrosh because he's a bad leader is like hating Dr. Zoidberg because he's a bad doctor?

He's a flawed character and that's a good thing, this is World of Warcraft, not World of Peace Treaty-craft. Thrall was a good leader and he was boring as fuck, Blizzard couldn't do anything with him.

Needless to say, I like the guy.

[mafiakipas]

Hmmm so the horde is in the brink of broken alliance and Garrosh isn's helping.
But Garrosh is just the Warchief the horde need: Aggressive, Leader, Brutal and Risky.
The new times need an Aggressive leader and Garrosh is perfect for leading the horde to glories future.

[Crashdummy]

Garrosh is not our true Warchief.

He's just some idiot keeping the seat warm for our real Warchief.

Garrosh is a complete idiot that has caused enough damage and would have lost the entire Eastern Kingdoms if it wasnt for Sylvannas refusing to obey him, as it is explained in Sylvannas Short story, where she actually gets to see how the future would be if she doesnt come back to lead the forsaken.

he was already saved several times of being killed by lesser beings, almost lost Gorehowl and is breaking the Horde apart from within.

Garrosh is nothing more than a skilled idiot grunt.

And yes, i have finished the stonetalon questline, as well as all the others. That doesnt mends anything. He just killed a commander thatw as doing the same that many other commanders around the word does which is what Garrosh encourages people to do with his attitude, and he has done equivalent things (he killed people that were in a boat, SINKING).

[Eucep]

I see Garrosh for what he is, a tool to promote this silly need to up the war in warcraft and doing so in a completely failed way. Blizzard put their writing into a bad corner by how the horde is build up, consisting of monsters and nobles alike, it's going to explode in their face, starting with Garrosh.

[Herethebeef]

Garrosh is such a douche, he makes the king of stormwind look like a nice guy.

[Callei]

The way things stand, I'm starting to wonder if he hasn't burned too many bridges to stay in power long-term. Baine and Vol'jin both needed external counseling to remain in the Horde after interacting with Garrosh, and Sylvanas has openly stood up to him on several occasions, one of which she spelled out that Garrosh's only real political tactic--strongarming and bullying--won't work on her, because she's been to Warcraft's equivalent of hell--nothing he can do to her is anything she hasn't already experienced. Lor'themar is really just along for the ride, offering token support to the Horde's war effort against the Alliance, and seems more focused inwards on bringing the blood elves back to their former glory, than he is about seriously helping Garrosh conquer the world. Gallywix is nowhere to be found, but he was pressganged into the Horde after Thrall beat him around some.

Garrosh's biggest character traits are those commonly used in villainous characters, and most if not all of his art portrays him in typically-villainous poses (whereas Thrall's tend toward the heroic and Varian's toward the intense). He's arrogant, sociopathic, treats his allies as weapons (he specifically calls you a weapon of the Horde at the end of the Tauren 1-10 quest line, when your entire reason for showing up was to inform him that the tauren are ready to be the Horde's spiritual center again), has no problem with wasting troops (both his and his allies') en masse with zerg rushes that typically either fail fantastically, or end up easily counterattacked unless the commander engages in something the Horde has banned, and veers rapidly between (informed ability incoming) strategic genius, and strategic idiot.

My honest-to-the-stars opinion of him is that he's too far gone, both in schitzophrenic characterization and in whether or not he's a greyscale antihero or a villain-in-progress. He's taken an antagonistic role for the Alliance and the Horde both since Northrend, and in the current makeup of the Horde, a second Blackhand won't last long.

[gypsybob]

I think Garrosh will be able to go balls out in MoP with the big war. We'll finally get to see him do what he does best.

[Inahu]

People, you do realise hating Garrosh because he's a bad leader is like hating Dr. Zoidberg because he's a bad doctor?

He's a flawed character and that's a good thing, this is World of Warcraft, not World of Peace Treaty-craft. Thrall was a good leader and he was boring as fuck, Blizzard couldn't do anything with him.

Needless to say, I like the guy.

That's all well and good, but why does he have to be such a damn retard? Well, I suppose we have that answer, because Metzen wanted a cardboard cut-out to make his own (admitted) self-insert look better. I don't hate Garrosh because he's Garrosh, I hate that the son of Grommash Hellscream has been written so damn terribly that I can't bring myself to respect him as a wise leader or Warchief. What's more, now they have plenty of bloodthirsty, smarter orcs that could replace him - Zaela, for example (perish the thought! A female Warchief?! Anticipate the QQ!).