Can Anet pull this off?

[Valeron]

I don't think Korea uses subscriptions either. They use the time card thing.

[Cherrysoul]

It's a known fact that in Asia, China more specifically, that they don't have monthly subscriptions, they use time cards to play.

This also plays into the whole 10 million subs number being complete BS, since someone in China that hasn't played in a year, but has 5 minutes left on his/her playing card is still an "active" sub and gets counted in their BS sub numbers.

$15 a month in sub, x amount in cards they still cost money, money which goes to Blizzard, i dont know how much they are in China, but here in Aus a gaming card is $38AUD for 2 months sub is actually more money in there pocket $19 per month that works out to be (probably to cover the cost of the massive box the tiny card comes in) LOL

Point in case no matter how you pay blizzard they are still making cash and the fact that the prepaid cards are dearer than paying by credit card/paypal = more $$$

[Deleted]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...In-DG-c#t=110s

So around $2 per player each month. And we can all agree that WoW is a rather large MMO. The costs were probably a lot higher back in the days when WoW just been released, but that's just not the cast anymore.
If each player also costs Arenanet around $2 per month, and they sell the GW2 box for $60 then they break even after 30 months. I think it's safe to assume we'll see expansions more frequently than that. And we totally ignore the GW2 store now, which was a large revenue source in GW1.
Why do you think Blizzard has a net income of 335 million each quarter?

[Loaf Lord]

If they couldn't pull this off they wouldn't have tried it in the first place. Contrary to popular belief companies are not stupid.

[georgevonfranken]

If they couldn't pull this off they wouldn't have tried it in the first place. Contrary to popular belief companies are not stupid.

Except for Ubisoft

OT: Yes they did it with GW they will do it with GW2

[Fencers]

I don't think Korea uses subscriptions either. They use the time card thing.

Most are like that, yes. You have to pay for time or buy time ala carte.

[Squirrelbanes]

Worth pointing out that final fantasy's profits pretty much tripled overnight when it dropped sub fees. Dropping subs reduces the barrier of entry for players, and then many micro transactions really do make a lot of money. You'd be surprised how inclined you'd feel to spend on a cash shop when you have no sub to pay.
Fencers is probably right that tor will be the last or one of the last sub MMOs. The business model has been proven to be fundementally less profitable. Gaming companies are now waking up to it.

[Deleted]

Cant wait!! No sub means 3 nigths raid & arena in Wow, and rest on this
Bring It!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Fencers]

Asura's are often stereotyped as brainy, cantankerous and rat-people with gross feet/teeth. But I find Mif and Squirrelbanes are usually on the money in just about every thread.

+1 for reasonable rats.

[Deleted]

Haha, you people are funny =]. It's almost cute how you try to discuss things you have no idea about ^_^.

OK, let me enlighten you, Server costs are VERY minor. I work for a company that provides business solution software for over 500 000 people. Our services are live 24/7 without ANY downtime or maintenance - we actually outsource our technology in this department cause we've come up with innovative way of updating our framework and software without rolling restarts.

Server costs, maintenance etc is very cheap to the point it's negligible. You know what's expensive? Building the framework. After that expanding, upgrading and upkeep is dirt cheap.

So yeah, blizzard's server hosting costs should be around 5% of their income (and that's assuming they have very ineffective grid and software >_>).

[Kelathos]

So it turns out I'm greatly overestimating server costs, and the first reply with the video was quite brilliant.

Thanks for sharing. It helps to know I had the wrong idea about things.

[Fernling306]

No monthly fee.

When you think about how awesome this game is with its wide ranging features and incredible 'persistent' world, do you think ArenaNet is capable of handling its own game without a monthly fee? I cannot picture how they can do something like this on a grand scale, with such a popular game, and keep the lights on at their office.

I'm in love with what I'm reading, and hearing, but I fear what might happen if the severs end up lagging or having to be reduced in number. If the technical aspects of it all cannot be managed on their budget.

So the question is, will they do it, can Anet pull this off?

I'd be heart broken if such great ideas were tarnished by choosing the wrong financial model for the game.

Box sales + cash shop should handle it fine.

[Squirrelbanes]

Asura's are often stereotyped as brainy, cantankerous and rat-people with gross feet/teeth. But I find Mif and Squirrelbanes are usually on the money in just about every thread.

+1 for reasonable rats.

Awwwww And I find you rational, knowledgeable and insightful. And witty ofc. Lol. Anyway...OT.

So it turns out I'm greatly overestimating server costs, and the first reply with the video was quite brilliant.

Thanks for sharing. It helps to know I had the wrong idea about things.

Glad we could help Takes integrity and whatnot to say you had things wrong.

[airea]

Server infrastructure is NOT cheap, and neither is the electricity to run them.

You or someone else can find a source, but if you look on the quarterly expenses sheets Blizz has to legally show to all of their investors, you'll see that running servers and making sure that they're free of bugs costs such a relatively low amount of money that it's not even included in the main list. It's included as a footnote on the bottom of the page.

[Morogoth]

Ok I will make really basic maths here it's not scientific, I'm just trying to figure their business model.

3 millions copies sold x 40$ profit on each copy = 120 millions$ profit + let's say 100 more millions for various products = 220 millions$ profit

250 employees paid 50k a year for 6 years = 72 millions$ in salary for development (wich is probably less than that)

3 millions per year for server maintenance for 8 years (approximately the life span of the game) = 24 millions

They still have 124 millions left for future developments and investments. It's not that bad. I know I forgot a lot of other expenses and incomes, but I don't think A-Net will be in the minus with this game.

Also, it's refreshing to have the feelling of not being exploited by a big corporation.

[Rapti]

Theyll pull it off with their eyes closed.
They will even EARN on it quite often.

[Fencers]

3 millions copies sold x 40$ profit on each copy = 120 millions$ profit + let's say 100 more millions for various products = 220 millions$ profit

Well, SWTOR had roughly a million copies by the 2nd day of release. Can't get much higher profile than that game for MMOs. Are you guesstimating 3mil copies sold over a year or so? Because I don't think they will have close to 3 million even in the first year.

[Mif]

So it turns out I'm greatly overestimating server costs, and the first reply with the video was quite brilliant.

Thanks for sharing. It helps to know I had the wrong idea about things.

Thumbs up for being a good person

---------- Post added 2012-02-18 at 10:16 AM ----------

Well, SWTOR had roughly a million copies by the 2nd day of release.

First day sales are a common lie in the games industry.
They always fail to mention that they count the months of pre-orders as day 1.

[Blackmist]

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/20...ney-go-article

If you bought a game in the run-up to Christmas and it cost £39.99 to buy, approximately £7 (17.5 per cent) went on VAT (that figure increased to 20 per cent as of 4th January), while £10.50 (27 per cent) went to the shop and £12 (30 per cent) to the publisher.
The rest goes on what's called cost of goods: the nuts and bolts of videogame publishing. 65 pence (two per cent) goes on distribution, £1.75 (four to five per cent) on marketing, and an £8 (20 per cent) licence fee goes to the platform holder (Microsoft, Nintendo or Sony). All these costs are paid for by the game's publisher. If a third-party is behind the game, approximately £3 goes to the developer, or 25 per cent of the publisher's revenue after deductibles, although developers are often paid in a series of advances as they meet milestones.

So from retail money alone, probably not so much. The micro transactions are going to keep it alive. Expect them to push online sales of the game and it's expansions and for good reason.

[Fencers]

First day sales are a common lie in the games industry.
They always fail to mention that they count the months of pre-orders as day 1.

Perhaps. But I find it hard to believe a license as big as Star Wars would comparatively speaking move less units than Guild Wars 2 after a year. Retained subs is another matter. But just box sales? Star Wars is one of the largest brands in history.

What's bigger? McDonald's? Walt Disney? Star Wars is on a whole other level from Guild Wars.