1. #1

    Heroic Warmaster Blackhorn DISC or HOLY?

    Hello. I have just started progression on this boss on 10 man and I am thinking Disc Shield's would be more useful here but my raid leader insists that I should go Holy for Divine Hymn because he healed it on his druid with a hpally.

    My partner is a holy pally as well.



    Any experienced advice? Please tell me the REASON why as well and not just answer holy or disc.

    I am AA disc. Also, any reforging required for first timers?

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Field Marshal Rfx's Avatar
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    Are you talking about N or H?
    Either way, I'd play disc but AA is useless here.
    Reforge: int>mst>hst>spr

  3. #3
    WELL....
    Quote Originally Posted by helloberry View Post
    Please tell me the REASON why as well and not just answer holy or disc.
    Thanks for trying to help anyway...

    wtb more answers! and title says Heroic >.>

  4. #4
    This fight will have you on your toes. AA will simply not be nearly as effective as holy or another Disc build.

    I would be holy for this because mastery seems to do really well here and it will be something you rely on to do some work while your dodging stuff. Divine Hymn is self explanatory.

    Trust me, heroic warmaster will involve a lot of movement in both phases. Any hot will provide some breathing room because of how tight everything is.
    Last edited by Toroc; 2012-02-18 at 09:21 AM.

  5. #5
    aa is fine for this fight as long as you dont use atonement to heal, but only to stack for archangel.

    basically for disc this fight can be seen as poh spam (also overhealing, to stack da) and shields. so its good to have pw:s glyph, poh glyph and some kind of mastery/haste strong gear.

    unfortunately i cannot compare to holy as i dont really play holy myself. hopefully someone who tried both specs there will answer your thread.

    i just had a look at wol, seems that disc priests can pull a bit more hps than holy does, guess you can show them to your raid leader if you really dont want to go holy

  6. #6
    I would say that holy might be the best way to go since you got the Hymn and well to use and i think that renew hoting the "raid" or just tanks helps alot more then
    trying to get sheilds up most becus you need to move alot and disc really dosent have that much instant spells.

    I myself pref playing holy on pretty much all fights only going disc on morchok and when we are 3 healers on a fight.

  7. #7
    Healing wise I'd say holy, but if your raid setup lacks raid cooldowns going Discipline is fine aswell. I've played both specs and yes Holy does heal alot more, but my disc shields have saved many many lives. So if your raid setup allows you to skip a raid CD go holy, if not go disc.

  8. #8
    Field Marshal Rfx's Avatar
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    Disc:
    -Most damage isnt group spread (i.e damage is 'random' to raid members) and considering a large portion of holy is PoH, it won't be nearly as effective as shielding soakers.
    -Holy also won't be as viable due to both the large amount of movement/raid spread for holy word: sanc.
    -While Divine Hymn is fantastic on this fight, the barrier is going to be stronger for both phase one and two.

    I'd suggest going disc for this fight, and sorry about not reading the title, i'm mentally retarded.

  9. #9
    Herald of the Titans Yilar's Avatar
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    Disc.

    P1 is kidda random dmg everywhere, as dmg is mostly created by player activity. Holy and Disc do about equally well, with maybe a slight advantage to holy, but healing is really not a concern here, you won't die because the raid is taking unhealable damage, you will die because people play badly and die before you can heal them or they take one shot abilities. Heck if people don't suck a single healer can easily do this alone.

    P2 is disc all the way. The dmg is based off psychical dmg, some classes will take less dmg than others and will require less healing, you spew PoH to heal people up and right before the next aoe you cast a few shields on the people that weren't topped off. Holy is crippled by the fact that if you keep spewing PoH you will only pour straight up overhealing into the people who were already topped and the other heals that holy have are pretty lackluster in comparison with disc pws.

    Warmaster is the only boss in DS where AA is rather useless, but I wouldn't bother respeccing out of it just for this fight. ToT/SoS or whatever isn't gonna make or break the fight tbh.

    Also make sure the hpala is focusing on tanks in p2, so you can cast PoH without having to worry about tanks falling over. And tell ranged not to stand a trillion miles away from the boss, though no closer than 10 yard, as the aoe will lock your school for like 8 seconds.

    If you run with a balanced setup of mastery/haste/crit i'd just stick with that tbh, though mastery might be slighty better for this encounter, but not worth reforging for imo.
    Last edited by Yilar; 2012-02-18 at 08:24 PM.

  10. #10
    What tank classes do you have in your setup? We had a DK and Bear tank which made P2 a bit harder to heal without shield tanks, as it got really spikey in damage. I was 2 healing with a Holy Paladin but the sudden spikes made it safer for me to be Disc and focus on the tanks mainly while weaving in some POH inbetween and the Holy Pally spot healing.

    So personally I think: P1 both specs can heal fine, P2 will depend really on your setup.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Piffnifty View Post
    What tank classes do you have in your setup? We had a DK and Bear tank which made P2 a bit harder to heal without shield tanks, as it got really spikey in damage. I was 2 healing with a Holy Paladin but the sudden spikes made it safer for me to be Disc and focus on the tanks mainly while weaving in some POH inbetween and the Holy Pally spot healing.

    So personally I think: P1 both specs can heal fine, P2 will depend really on your setup.
    This times a thousand. I run this with a hpally as a holy priest, prot warr and pally tanks. Without the Damage reduction CDs from the tanks, I would have to run Disc for the abosrbs. Here is my guild's log from our last kill. We struggled with it this week, just too much extra damage. Raid awareness is so important for this fight.

    worldoflogs.com/reports /rt-cezoi1mmoci5bdrt/ dashboard/?s=10572& e=10946

    (remove the spaces)

  12. #12
    Thanks for all the tips everyone. My tanks are Prot Warrior and DK, Prot Warrior's gear being the weaker one. I had to go shadow this fight /sigh so I couldn't get much experience out of it

  13. #13
    We killed it on 25H and whilst the other priest and I started off as Disc we soon switched to Holy. Disc is great in P1 for emergency shielding low health targets, it really suffers in P2 when you have to heal up large amounts of AOE damage in very quick succession. Lightwell, Sanc and Divine Hymn were just too valuable in the end for us.

  14. #14
    Depends on your team make up but having Barrier to mitigate a sub 50%HP shout is super helpful, as well as the added 'fake health' that DA can provideI think is more helpful than a hymn later in the fight.

  15. #15
    Disc is better than Holy in both Utility and HPS for this fight.

    Shield, Pain Suppression, PI to give your dot classes for multi dots. For P2, you still have a half-decent Divine Hymn on top of your VERY potent Barrier.

    Look at the top parses for these two specs on WoL, and you'll see that Disc HPS edges out slightly in 25m and more so in 10m.

  16. #16
    I can't see a time where holy is more powerful than disc on this, in a 25 man mindset. If you are smart about assigning positions for p1, the damage is 100% predictable and not at all random like some people above claimed. If you do the three ranged groups covering 1/3 of the ship for barrages, you can get shields on each group as you see them running into soaks as well as timing a PoH to hit that group of 5 right as the little barrage hits them, and then go shield crazy on the raid as the big barrage comes, which will do more to practically prevent deaths while learning the fight than holy's renews will. Not to mention that you can shield 5-6 people each shout and if you play well, you can maintain a huge DA on a number of groups for each shout. Just roll your DAs slowly across a few groups as you sit and wait for the shockwave, then you'll instantly mitigate a ton of the damage from the shout that comes right after. It takes a bit of timing, but it's pretty powerful, and it doesn't matter how much extra thoughput holy has if you go too long in p2 and shouts start killing people outright. Barrier is by and far better than hymn for p2, as is PS over GS for p2 tanking.

    I never even considered holy for this fight. Disc just offers too much mitigation on a mitigation-friendly fight.

  17. #17
    Stood in the Fire h3lladvocate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rfx View Post
    Disc:
    -Most damage isnt group spread (i.e damage is 'random' to raid members) and considering a large portion of holy is PoH, it won't be nearly as effective as shielding soakers.
    -Holy also won't be as viable due to both the large amount of movement/raid spread for holy word: sanc.
    -While Divine Hymn is fantastic on this fight, the barrier is going to be stronger for both phase one and two.

    I'd suggest going disc for this fight, and sorry about not reading the title, i'm mentally retarded.
    The same could be said for holy though too... Ive tried both holy and disc, and I've liked holy better. There is lots of movement, and it can be hard to get good pre-PoH's off as disc, especially after the big barrage and the charge that almost always happens right after. Disc can't aoe well on the move, holy can. Damage is random, so it is hard to know who to pre-shield as disc (minus tanks obv). Single target holy seems to have better control over healing the small barrage and the charge failers.

    P2, disc is probably better before Gariona dies because of the shields to help with the healing debuff. Havnt seen too much of P2, but both seem decently viable. HWSanc has diminished effect because of the shockwave, which sucks, but hots and strong movement aoe really helps out. If you've got the damage CD's, id say holy. If not, Disc.
    <Rustlemania> - 10 Man Raiding - 12/14 H SoO, 13/13 H ToT, 16/16H T14

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  18. #18
    Field Marshal Rfx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by h3lladvocate View Post
    The same could be said for holy though too... Ive tried both holy and disc, and I've liked holy better. There is lots of movement, and it can be hard to get good pre-PoH's off as disc, especially after the big barrage and the charge that almost always happens right after. Disc can't aoe well on the move, holy can. Damage is random, so it is hard to know who to pre-shield as disc (minus tanks obv). Single target holy seems to have better control over healing the small barrage and the charge failers.

    P2, disc is probably better before Gariona dies because of the shields to help with the healing debuff. Havnt seen too much of P2, but both seem decently viable. HWSanc has diminished effect because of the shockwave, which sucks, but hots and strong movement aoe really helps out. If you've got the damage CD's, id say holy. If not, Disc.
    When your running to/before the animation is on the ground the stack points in P1 you can just pre-shield a good 5+ people. You can easily get a PoH off during these stack points too. The damage really isn't 'random' you know who your soakers predominantly are so why not keep a shield on them. I can shield any ranged and the shield will proc before the duration runs out.

    At the end of the day, you could easily kill this fight with either spec. It's not a healing challenge.

  19. #19
    I do most of that place as holy. (8/8 H 25)

    H blackthorn is one where both of us are discipline. Seem's much easier to keep people alive, our HPS looks like shit but it gets the job done.

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