"Herb" or "Erb"?

[Dragonwing]

How is it closer to to original latin, as the "h" in "herba" is not silent? Actually, they are no silent letters at all in latin.

In latin, H's at the beginnings of words tend to be very light, if not silent. This however, once again depends on dialect/region etc. I once had to translate a poem by Catullus, where he makes fun of someone who overly-pronounces the H in words, or even adds a H to the beginning of words without them (eg. Insidiae => Hinsidiae)

In fact, the latin word for "by"/"from" is 'ab'. However, before consonants, it was 'a'. So you would have stuff like "a domo" vs "ab Italia". With H words, it was usually "ab" before the word, eg "ab herbis". Same with ex => e (e domo/ex Italia) and simul atque=> simul ac (simul atque domum rediit.../simul ac Italiam rediit...). Usually with H, it was like a vowel (ab herbis, ex herbis, simul ac herbas rediit...) Once again, this all depends on a variety of factors. I have no doubt some people pronounced the H's and said "a herbis/e herbis" etc

[Deleted]

being from Yorkshire, where we are allergic to the letter H, its Erb

Anyhow, ere is a bit from wikipedia....

H-dropping is a linguistic term used to describe the omission of initial /h/ in words like house, heat, and hangover in many dialects of English, such as Cockney and Estuary English. The same phenomenon occurs in many other languages, such as Serbian, and Late Latin, the ancestor of the modern Romance languages. Interestingly, both French and Spanish acquired new initial [h] in mediæval times, but these were later lost in both languages in a "second round" of h-dropping (however, some dialects of Spanish re-acquired /h/ from Spanish /x/). Many dialects of Dutch also feature h-dropping, particularly the southwestern variants. It is also known from several Scandinavian dialects, for instance Älvdalsmål and the dialect of Roslagen where it is found already in Runic Swedish.

It is debated amongst linguists which words originally had an initial /h/ sound. Words such as horrible, habit and harmony all had no such sound in their earliest English form nor were they originally spelt with an h, but it is now widely considered incorrect to drop the /h/ in the pronunciation.

H-dropping in English is found in all dialects in the weak forms of function words like he, him, her, his, had, and have; and, in most dialects, in all forms of the pronoun it – the older form hit survives as the strong form in a few dialects such as Southern American English and also occurs in the Scots language. Because the /h/ of unstressed have is usually dropped, the word is usually pronounced /əv/ in phrases like should have, would have, and could have. These are usually spelled out as "should've", "would've", and "could've".

H-adding

The opposite of aitch-dropping, so-called aitch-adding, is a hypercorrection found in typically h-dropping accents of English. Commonly found in literature from late Victorian times to the early 20th century, holds that some lower-class people consistently drop h in words that should have it, while adding h to words that should not have it. An example from the musical My Fair Lady is, "In 'Artford, 'Ereford, and 'Ampshire, 'urricanes 'ardly hever 'appen". Another is in C.S. Lewis' The Magician's Nephew: "Three cheers for the Hempress of Colney 'Atch". In practice, however, it would appear that h-adding is more of a stylistic prosodic effect, being found on some words receiving particular emphasis, regardless of whether those words are h-initial or vowel-initial in the standard language.

Words borrowed from French frequently begin with the letter h but not with the sound /h/. Examples include hour, heir, hono(u)r and honest. In some cases, spelling pronunciation has introduced the sound /h/ into such words, as in humble, hotel and (for most speakers) historic. Spelling pronunciation has also added /h/ to the English English pronunciation of herb, /hɜːb/, while American English retains the older pronunciation /ɝb/.

[Aqueous]

Maybe it's because I've only become more aware of pronounciation quirks since moving to England, but I never noticed Americans explicitly dropping the h in 'herb', I suppose I never paid much attention to it.
English is a funny beast though with so many different accents and regional pronounciations, for example it always amuses me whenever I go past a sign announcing you're entering the county of Leicestershire - pronounced 'Lester-shuh'.

I didn't notice it that much until I played the game "Illusion of Time/Gaia" and each time I got a herb from a chest (notice the "a" xD) it would say "You got an herb" - when I was young I was sure it was a spelling error.

Hahaha, and what's even more weird is that the "shuh" pronunciation is only when it's a suffix; with "shire" the actual word in its own right (LotR anyone?) being pronounced how you'd expect.

What I love is when you get Europeans learning the language and pronouncing things in funny ways but then you sit back and look at the word and think: "actually...it should be pronounced that way really!" - word association is even better, I still remember a German friend of mine being utterly perplexed by the association of the ability "Cleave" in game with breasts as in "Cleavage".

Yep, weird language, but then it's a huge amalgamation of languages due to all the different peoples that have had input into it I guess - still, nothing compared to Welsh, have you seen that language? xD

[Deleted]

It has an H in it. Americanisation nonsense at its finest to ignore a letter for no real reason at all.

[Guyviroth]

I pronounce it "Herb".

Because there's a ****ing 'H' in it.

[Mister K]

It has an H in it. Americanisation nonsense at its finest to ignore a letter for no real reason at all.

Its not Americanisaiton as you call it, its same in the UK. /fail

'erb. I'm canadian. Either way would be fine if I heard it.

Let's be honest... English is spoken in many ways. Even in American, Canada or England. That's just how it is. Other languages are the same way. French Canadian is different from European french, which is different from Creole french.. etc etc..

This is very true.

[Aqueous]

Its not Americanisaiton as you call it, its same in the UK. /fail

I've got to stoke the fires for fun:

Yeah, only by you weirdos up north!

[Daverid]

I don't really mind TBH ... I spent 5 weeks in America and I did, and still do, chuckle everytime someone says, "Erb" ... But in essence .. All they're doing in dropping the H sound, it's not a Huge deal ...

I come from Australia, AKA - HERB .. But I wouldn't run around correcting you for saying Erb.

[Deleted]

From England here, only place I've ever heard "'erb" being the way to pronounce it is on American shows. :\

Edit: down in southern England if that matters.

[Aqueous]

Ye, it's only in northern England you might here it...but thar be dragons up there anyway.

[Deleted]

Herb - The H is not silent, if you say it 'erb' you are doing it wrong.

[Dragonwing]

Herb - The H is not silent, if you say it 'erb' you are doing it wrong.

Nope. While I also say 'herb', this is untrue. Neither way is wrong, it is an accent/dialect thing.

[Blackmist]

I've come to the conclusion that language should be defined by what we do with it, rather than what a dusty old book says.

If the book aims to be a complete guide to language, It's not our job to copy the book. It's the book's job to keep up!

If we never changed how we speak, we'd all be speaking Ænglisc...

[Blackspur]

The people using the example of northerner in England, specifically Yorkshire that is an accent thing not a dialect thing, there is a difference. People up north tend to miss the 'H' of a lot of words.

[Deleted]

Guys im sorry, I cant stop myself from doing this..

I prenounce it herp

[Paigeyotto]

"Supposed to" is a bit awkward to use in this situation considering it's different "supposed tos" depending on what region you're in or from. Almost every Brit I've talked to has pronounced it with the H, while almost every American I've talked to pronounces it without.

Hence the part where I said thought, because that's what I was always taught.

This thread has a lot of contradicting replies.

Every other person is saying it's only Americans that say 'Erb', while others are saying it's Americans that say 'Herb', and then the same thing for Canadians/Europeans/Etc.

I understand it's mostly depending on area, but then again there are people who just do it on preference.
In my guild there's a lot of Australians and Canadians and whenever any of them mention Herbalism or something, they say it with a silent H also.

I've never talked to anyone with a British accent, but I thought they pronounced H'es silently, or at least with a lot words?
But then again, I don't talk to a lot of people with those accents so maybe I'm mistaken :s

[Shakari]

Herb with an H sound is the male name.

Herb(urb) With the H silent is the plant.

They have 2 different meanings, and are essentially 2 different words.

Ummm no your not correct:

Erb is a slang or shorten version of Herb as happens with words in some locals. They are not different words at all.

its like the phrase ello, is shorten from Hello

its verbal laziness, a vast majority of people shorten words

the only way erb is a word is in slang i.e.

Slang Dictionary

herb definition

and erb

1. n.
marijuana. (Drugs.) : Carl has found a way to synthesize the erb.

also in erb the shortened version the "H" is not silent its simply removed or ignored for either local dialect or speed.

From an actualy language POV there is no such word as "erb"

Just because a word in slang is used does not mean its correct or actually in the english dictionary lol at best its can be describe as
"in common useage" it may get added to the language officially but either way untill it does its just slang

[Zelk]

it's herb, there's an H at the front. People from yorkshire basically speak their own language anyway.
And for those confused about the "north", I live in Newcastle, the most northernly city in England and no one here says "erb" unless they're from Yorkshire. Don't generalise half the country on a small part of it.

[Paigeyotto]

it's herb, there's an H at the front. People from yorkshire basically speak their own language anyway.
And for those confused about the "north", I live in Newcastle, the most northernly city in England and no one here says "erb" unless they're from Yorkshire. Don't generalise half the country on a small part of it.

So do you say Hour too?

[vizzle]

I pronounce it "Herb".

Because there's a ****ing 'H' in it.

Do you pronounce "hour" as "haower" too, because there's a ****ing 'H' in it? Not a very good argument.