Last edited by Freezymcgee; 2012-03-21 at 07:58 PM.
I want my Dota2 access, but they haven't given it to me yet
You don't send a hero to solo the hard lane and expect them to "win" that lane. One of the common ideologies in high level dota is that if you can win two lanes out of three, you're in a great position going into mid-game. You throw a Windrunner to solo that hardlane because even she obviously has no chance of "winning" against 2-3 heroes she can often safely get enough XP and gold to keep herself relevant in the game while protecting the tower against weaker pushes. Meanwhile your 4 other heroes can focus on controlling your safe lane, mid and the jungle inbetween.
So I don't really get where this "weak heroes" comes from. Windrunner is powerful early game and is usually played as utility hero while good Shackleshots can win you games no matter how far you're into lategame. Even if Mirana can't quite outcarry Anti-mage with equal farm, she is extremely good on a lane, pushing and ganking (combo a stun from another hero with arrow and you're racking in kills) and your ultimate forces the other team to invest into True Sight or suffer when your team appears from nowhere on top of them. Both are also some of the best solo heroes there are (in lanes other than mid.) You can solo (hardlane) with heroes like Clockwerk or Sand King, but it definitely isn't going to be easier.
A ranged winning against a melee, because no other ranged can also do that.
I don't mean weak all around. I never meant weak all around. We were never talking about anything but early game. They are weak heroes early game, almost any hero can jump on top of them and force them to run. Most PotM/WR players skill leap/windrunner first or second at the very latest because they NEED it to stay alive in their lane against just about anything. They are weak heroes.
Both of them have very good utility, yes, this is what redeems them and makes them pickable.
Can PoTM and WR get owned in a solo hard lane? Yeah if you had some stupid combo to lane against. However what other hero(s) can do it better than them. You get decent farm ability to not get ridiculously out CSed and an early escape mechanism in case you get ganked.
The majority of post referred to WR and PotM not being weak heroes which you conveniently ignored.
Keep carrying with Earthshaker and thinking PotM and WR are weak because of amazing escape mechanisms
WR is currently one of top competative picks. Basic base dmg of hero doesn't matter when you evaluate their viability. WR is extremly capable soloer. Her lane control comes from great attack animation, a superb harassment skill(Powershot), also potential shackels with hitting creeps. Also extremly capable in teamfights. 3.75 stun on TWO heroes ain't nothing to laugh about, + a great nuke that's easy to hit on 2+ heroes, a good and reliable escape mechanism. Her ult allowes her to somewhat transition lategame as well, and be a good pusher as well.
About POTM, meh won't go into details. There might be a reason while team who won 1.6million tournament picked her in every game except some finals where they wen't suprise picks.
Sorry, but your game understanding is a bit lacking. No offense intended, but perhaps you should play some more higher level games. Everythign works and anything doesn't work in true pub games.
So what makes a hero "strong" is being able to sit there tanking the enemy lane and take it like a man early game?
Windrunner may not be as strong as heroes such as Batrider or Shadow Demon at guaranteeing a winning lane, her kit is just so versatile that she'll hold her own, or at least survive decently in any lane. I wouldn't mind seeing her getting a slight nerf so that teams don't pick her as often, coz honestly, she's freaking boring hero to watch (other than played by Vigoss, of course).
A random off-topic question - does Paragon players in fact play dota while waiting for MoP or something?
Thanks for info. Would love to see a Paragon vs Smth(Perhaps team of pro SC2 players?) showmatch :P
Stop assuming that the extremely small number of people who play tourneys are the ultimate answer to the DotA meta. The people who win tourneys are not even the best players, because the best players don't go to tourneys. I know this is an assumption we all love to make, but it's possible to be both good and casual. I play with people regularly who would force several top tourney picks to feed. The community is still extremely small, and the support for esports is practically nonexistant. The tourneys are not the best players, they are the players who care the most. They are undoubtedly good, but stop thinking that they are unbeatable, never wrong, and that we should just go into sheep mode and copy whatever it is they do.
I don't really have anything to prove, I really could not care less what you think of my skill or knowledge. But please don't mislead a new player into trying out a very niche hero like Windrunner because "she's so OP." If you don't land a shackleshot, you've just lost 90% of your hero and you're barely worth the two spells it will take to kill you. How about we lead newer players to trying out heroes who aren't so dependent on a single skill shot so that they can try to learn the game before they feed hardcore.
Lol your opinion is the quintessence of someone who plays with a couple of friends and pub-stomp and then think they are amazing for doing so.
You posted your Dota2 name. Unless someone else is now Starling you are playing against some amazing noobs. I mean do I really see Lothar's on ES? I mean its not even a troll build when you don't get a blink...
oh wow I just saw another gem. Dazzle getting FBed without even trying to SG himself with backup coming. Yeah...
p.s. I do have say your last hitting as Tiny was pretty good...with quelling blade.
Last edited by Jinto; 2012-03-21 at 11:56 PM.