1. #3661
    3 licenses to give away on steam here... shoot me a pm if you want one.

  2. #3662
    Quote Originally Posted by Finear View Post
    tbh items are worth 90% of this price so its not like you are paying 30euro for ONLY beta
    Truth, the items in the store are probably over priced, though =p
    Some mythicals are 10 USD, that's pretty extreme imo...pretty much everything I have I got by trading (well, Trixie trading my items for me), even getting gifts from friends is rare when everything is worth so much. Still, if you're interested in the cosmetic item trade game you at least have....somewhat of a start with the invite.

    The real question remains:
    Why OH WHY did I not make a green greevil....white was such a bad decision.
    Win and live. Lose and die.
    Rule of life. No change rule.
    Running worse than losing.
    Random casual stuff now


  3. #3663
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    The real question remains:
    Why OH WHY did I not make a green greevil....white was such a bad decision.
    I have a green one you can have if you want, I'm just gonna use my badger anyway.
    Also, agreed, white without unusuals is bleh.

  4. #3664
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Truth, the items in the store are probably over priced, though =p
    Some mythicals are 10 USD, that's pretty extreme imo...pretty much everything I have I got by trading (well, Trixie trading my items for me), even getting gifts from friends is rare when everything is worth so much. Still, if you're interested in the cosmetic item trade game you at least have....somewhat of a start with the invite.
    well thats another story ;p
    but invite alone is not a huge ripoff

    The real question remains:
    Why OH WHY did I not make a green greevil....white was such a bad decision.
    i fed my white 3 unusual ;_________;

  5. #3665
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfInvocation View Post
    YWorst argument in this thread.

    So according to you, a replicate was ONLY able to stand in well? So Morphling couldn't actually shotgun someone, then port back to his team? O.K.

    And if he can, then why make that argument about the 4v4 scenario? It's freaking false.
    I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say.

    I was talking about a scenario involves team fight(5v5) and I was saying, shotgun combo is not an advantage in that case because you can not teleport to some safeplace. Also shotgun combo involves agi-dumped morph which is risky and can be ended with moprh's dead in team fight. So shotgunning some support to death between his/her team mates and switching to safe replicate is not always case. So if a heroes OP strength is situational, maybe its not OP? PizzaJoke insisted replicating to safe place during team fight after shotgunning some support to death which leaves both sides 4vs4 so 4vs4 scenario coined by PizzaJoke not me.. Anyway, in that case, one side has their carry in battlefield, the other has not.

    This is the case I'm talking about.

    I hope you are not talking about shotgunning and then replicating to base and TPing back...
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2012-11-23 at 12:00 AM.

  6. #3666
    Write to me if u want invites

  7. #3667
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfInvocation View Post
    Suure. Saying my posts are hyperbole and complete trash does not make it so.

    And yet again you fail to counter-argument with anything beside "DIZ IS STOOPID"
    The burden of proof lies on the individual asserting a claim. In this case, that would be you. Hermanni does not need to "counter-argument". Back up what the fuck you're saying with proof.

  8. #3668
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say.

    I was talking about a scenario involves team fight(5v5) and I was saying, shotgun combo is not an advantage in that case because you can not teleport to some safeplace. Also shotgun combo involves agi-dumped morph which is risky and can be ended with moprh's dead in team fight. So shotgunning some support to death between his/her team mates and switching to safe replicate is not always case. So if a heroes OP strength is situational, maybe its not OP? PizzaJoke insisted replicating to safe place during team fight after shotgunning some support to death which leaves both sides 4vs4 so 4vs4 scenario coined by PizzaJoke not me.. Anyway, in that case, one side has their carry in battlefield, the other has not.

    This is the case I'm talking about.

    I hope you are not talking about shotgunning and then replicating to base and TPing back...
    I am talking about shotgunning someone DURING a waveform (Invulnerable), so he will always escape and then replicate say back to lowground(So maybe only replicate the range of 2000 or so) to his team, and then go force that 4v5 fight at their tier 3.

  9. #3669
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfInvocation View Post
    I am talking about shotgunning someone DURING a waveform (Invulnerable), so he will always escape and then replicate say back to lowground(So maybe only replicate the range of 2000 or so) to his team, and then go force that 4v5 fight at their tier 3.
    What if enemy team is forcing the fight? That's a clear 8-10 second fight without carry. What I'm saying "shotgunned you sucker enjoy your 4vs5" is not always the case. Also you always assume morph is initing but what happens if enemy team engages first? true weakness of shotgun morph is not being durable in fights(unless you wander around morphed to full str which means your damage will make enemy giggle) because of well...shotgun build and I'm not talking about early game. It's mid-late game I'm talking about where heroes get their key items and capable of doing good cc and burst.
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2012-11-23 at 12:40 AM.

  10. #3670
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    What if enemy team is forcing the fight? That's a clear 8-10 second fight without carry.
    I am not sure where you get that 8-10 seconds timing from? Have you played morph? It's instant if you didn't know, his replicate can MOVE, so he will NEVER be out of the fight for that long.

    Even if they somehow force a fight without morphling there(So let's say he is farming while his team is pushing, so actually he should be pretty farmed, yeah?) he can INSTANTLY morph to his team and join the fight. He can then still shotgun someone, only difference is morph's team might actually lose some heros in engagement instead of wiping them 5-0..Oh the horror :/.

  11. #3671
    Quote Originally Posted by Lycoris View Post
    I have a green one you can have if you want, I'm just gonna use my badger anyway.
    Also, agreed, white without unusuals is bleh.
    Give it to Trixie she can trade it for lots of stuff :3
    Unless it has 3 unusuals in which case I'll still use my war dog but I'll sure show it off to people to make them jealous.

    Also why are you banned? You were supposed to learn from my mistakes not make them yourself. Next you'll be saying "Birth control? Not important."
    Win and live. Lose and die.
    Rule of life. No change rule.
    Running worse than losing.
    Random casual stuff now


  12. #3672
    You can't morph back 800 hp instantly, that takes time.

  13. #3673
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    You can't morph back 800 hp instantly, that takes time.
    But why does he need to morph 800hp ? I am not sure what you are talking about.

  14. #3674
    Quote Originally Posted by Longview View Post
    The burden of proof lies on the individual asserting a claim. In this case, that would be you. Hermanni does not need to "counter-argument". Back up what the fuck you're saying with proof.
    I kind of wanted to stop posting to this, but like I edited into my last post, I don't really feel like I have to prove anything when he does it for me. Example:

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfInvocation
    Suure. Saying my posts are hyperbole and complete trash does not make it so.

    And yet again you fail to counter-argument with anything beside "DIZ IS STOOPID"
    This post is uses hyperbole. If it's not obvious, you need to retake some literature. So from where I look at it, if he wants to get back at me because I was trying to point out his posts are overly hyperbolic and not very well argued by making a post like this (that is a hyperbole), there isn't much left for me to prove, no?


    Well, at least Loda made himself worth it in fantasyleague. If only I had checked which teams actually played today more carefully.



    Manni | paragon.fi | Dota 2 forum | The golden rule: Listen to Lysah.

  15. #3675
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterOfInvocation View Post
    But why does he need to morph 800hp ? I am not sure what you are talking about.
    Oh god. Have you ever played morphling? You can't just shotgun people, not without solid amount of points in agility which gaining some hp will take time. 800 was just a number, sometimes you need less, sometimes you need more but you just can't replicate back to 3-sec-distance and then come right click people because you will die instantly if they focus on you. Amount of str pomped will not be sufficient if enemy got some burst..If you forgot str morph toggled in cc that means you will losing right click power means rest of your fight is fucked. Morphling is not shift-que'ing three spells.

    All of your argument assumes a perfect initialization of morphling then replicating back to some perfect/magic spot which is not far away and the moment you came, somehow, morph having more right click steroid than AM and at the same time having more hp than a AM(AM builds involve vanguard you know that right? if you exclude previous trend of going straight bfury) while half of str is morphed to agi and managing to survive throughout team fight.

    Is this some sort of super morphling you are talking about or the one I know? Also There is too much assumption here.
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2012-11-23 at 02:05 AM.

  16. #3676
    Titan PizzaSHARK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hermanni View Post
    Oh you read things. Not difficult, no? Then you wouldn't mind letting me in how you would balance a game like dota without reducing gameplay depth?
    I'd probably scrap it and start from scratch. I don't really see any way of dramatically altering gameplay mechanics to be more reliant on individual skill/APM instead of sheer knowledge without pretty much completely changing the game. Likewise removal of RNG mechanics and so many other things I feel are bad design decisions - it wouldn't be Dota by time I got done with it.

    But I'm not necessarily a huge fan of asymmetric games when it comes to competitive play, anyway - they're too hard to get balanced to a point of "perfection," especially compared to symmetrical games like Quake or UT. I guess you could argue chess and checkers are balanced to perfection, but they've had hundreds of years to figure it out, and white still wins more often than black because white gets first move.

    I dunno. Dota is a fun game, but I'm having an increasingly difficult time taking it seriously as a true competitive eSport because I just feel there are too many poor design choices in it that shift the burden away from individual player skill/APM and towards just memorizing information.

    I would still point towards Brood War as the best example of an asymmetrical game that incorporates roughly equal requirements of both skill/APM and game knowledge for professional play, and which is balanced exceptionally well. But, just like chess, that took a long time to get to that point, and it's still not perfectly balanced.

    Maybe it's just mentality or viewpoint. Nothing I see in professional Dota play makes me think "man, I don't think I could ever pull that off..." Not in the same way watching the really good Code S Terrans in SC2 or any of the professional Quake/Nexuiz/Warsow players do their thing does. Some of the things those guys pull off, I don't think I'd ever be capable of matching, even if I really worked at it.
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/PizzaSHARK
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Cailan Ebonheart View Post
    I also do landscaping on weekends with some mexican kid that I "hired". He's real good because he's 100% obedient to me and does everything I say while never complaining. He knows that I am the man in the relationship and is completely submissive towards me as he should be.
    MMOC IRC!

  17. #3677
    I agree that DotA isn't impressive to watch, but for people who aren't me and haven't played for 10 years it's probably one of the better "esports" to watch. For the 90% of the player base that just auto attacks creeps, never checks the mini map, never jukes in the forest, a lot of the stuff that happens in tourneys is probably really cool to watch.

    Hell, just listen to how excited casters get when someone uses an ability.

    BLACK HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLE
    Win and live. Lose and die.
    Rule of life. No change rule.
    Running worse than losing.
    Random casual stuff now


  18. #3678
    Titan PizzaSHARK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    I agree that DotA isn't impressive to watch, but for people who aren't me and haven't played for 10 years it's probably one of the better "esports" to watch. For the 90% of the player base that just auto attacks creeps, never checks the mini map, never jukes in the forest, a lot of the stuff that happens in tourneys is probably really cool to watch.

    Hell, just listen to how excited casters get when someone uses an ability.

    BLACK HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLE
    Tobi's been turning me off the same way Husky started turning me off. Especially when he's solo casting, it becomes increasingly obvious that he doesn't know a whole lot about what he's talking about, and he often misses a lot of important things, or he watches something and comments on it incorrectly. He's much better when he has a very skilled player/commentator joining him (like when Day9 joined with Husky for certain events) to be there to constantly correct him, but at that point you might as well just go "okay Tobi, go take a break, we got this."

    But you're raising a good point. When I was just getting back into Dota, I really enjoyed watching Tobi's casts. But as I gained more knowledge, I enjoyed his casts less and less because he kept making bad observations or outright missing important things. I've lost count of how many first bloods he's missed :-/
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/PizzaSHARK
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Cailan Ebonheart View Post
    I also do landscaping on weekends with some mexican kid that I "hired". He's real good because he's 100% obedient to me and does everything I say while never complaining. He knows that I am the man in the relationship and is completely submissive towards me as he should be.
    MMOC IRC!

  19. #3679
    I haven't watched anything....at all...but the two or three times I've watched 4 minutes of something I get linked I hear the casters flipping tables over the most trivial stuff...like people just using their abilities in the generic and completely expected way. Oh many, that guy side stepped the powershot, what a champion...only the best of the best of us can right click the ground...
    Win and live. Lose and die.
    Rule of life. No change rule.
    Running worse than losing.
    Random casual stuff now


  20. #3680
    Quote Originally Posted by Longview View Post
    The burden of proof lies on the individual asserting a claim. In this case, that would be you. Hermanni does not need to "counter-argument". Back up what the fuck you're saying with proof.
    I can't back up a statement about Morphling being OP before the nerf with hard facts, cause it is subjective in a way. Maybe Hermanni's views of OP are differen't than mine, and think Morph should be able 1v4 a team every game and still be O.K. and balanced since there is a banning and pick phase.

    And even if 99% of the population thinks something is OP, there is always someone who think's it is not.

    But why does the burden of proof lie with me? He is the one claiming he was NOT OP to other people, so HE made the claim about morphling. He got nerfed, so the general consensus at valve was obviously that he was OP. A lot of pro's also thought Naga(Nerfed) and Morphling(Nerfed) was OP, yet he is the one claiming: "No he was not that good for x, y reasons".. Which I might say were all pretty much wrong, so I question his game knowledge tbh.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-23 at 10:19 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Hermanni View Post
    I kind of wanted to stop posting to this, but like I edited into my last post, I don't really feel like I have to prove anything when he does it for me. Example:



    This post is uses hyperbole. If it's not obvious, you need to retake some literature. So from where I look at it, if he wants to get back at me because I was trying to point out his posts are overly hyperbolic and not very well argued by making a post like this (that is a hyperbole), there isn't much left for me to prove, no?


    Well, at least Loda made himself worth it in fantasyleague. If only I had checked which teams actually played today more carefully.
    Yes, that post is hyperbolic.

    And no, my previous posts about Morphling are not. If anything, what you wrote about him was meiosis. You are also the one using ad hominem arguments against Pizza all the time, so good job.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-23 at 10:31 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    Oh god. Have you ever played morphling? You can't just shotgun people, not without solid amount of points in agility which gaining some hp will take time. 800 was just a number, sometimes you need less, sometimes you need more but you just can't replicate back to 3-sec-distance and then come right click people because you will die instantly if they focus on you. Amount of str pomped will not be sufficient if enemy got some burst..If you forgot str morph toggled in cc that means you will losing right click power means rest of your fight is fucked. Morphling is not shift-que'ing three spells.

    All of your argument assumes a perfect initialization of morphling then replicating back to some perfect/magic spot which is not far away and the moment you came, somehow, morph having more right click steroid than AM and at the same time having more hp than a AM(AM builds involve vanguard you know that right? if you exclude previous trend of going straight bfury) while half of str is morphed to agi and managing to survive throughout team fight.

    Is this some sort of super morphling you are talking about or the one I know? Also There is too much assumption here.
    Go watch a old replay of Morphling before the nerf, I seems to me you just started playing after he was nerfed. THERE IS NO NEED FOR STRENGTH MORPHING, you are sitting at 1str but 900-2000hp and invulnerable while shotgunning someone, then in the teamfight you jump in AFTER say tidehunter and clean up. Oh and 190-250+ agi = Shit tons of armor, so good lucking focusing him. (Probably a linkens too to stop that spell)

    You once went vanguard/vlads on AM..And why does this pop up in the conversation? I am talking about the current trend anyhow. AM with Vanguard sucks anyway, since you might as well NOT pick AM at all if aren't gonna rice him.

    Give me a hard carry that has 2 escape mechanisms and 2 nukes with low cd's, one stun/mini stun, 1 full health illusion that deals 50% damage you can use on enemy carry but doesn't take more damage than a normal hero, has awesome stat gains(+10 on top of that), some of the best last hitting power in lanning, and can right click I will say better than an AM, slightly worse than a PA/Void. Oh and is Ranged. Oh and is the most mobile hard carry in the game, maybe shares that spot with Spectre and AM.
    Last edited by MasterOfInvocation; 2012-11-23 at 09:46 AM.

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