In that case, WR would have something like a "half-reliable" stun, because it always hits, but is not always guaranteed the full duration.
Sort of like Chaos Knight too.
Heroes that can pull creep waves like Bear, BH, known solos like DS, Weaver, Clinkz, Puck... Again, the lack of a "reliable stun" is what makes it not that great of a lane for me.
Last edited by OscaR; 2013-02-27 at 08:38 PM.
As the Es/lion comment, they are, but its not uncommon to see people trying to be "pro" and clicking the ground to launch the stun as that's possible as well. Es has a position component to his as if its done right you can gurante a kill at lvl 1 by blocking an enemy hero back tracking to their tower (say on safe lane) with your melee creeps. Of course this baring its a low HP hero... drow, veno, shadow shaman.
@OscR. out side of Es and Sven, all other stuns you listed are single target. Sven's has an AOE component, but you still have to target a hero to for it to be casted. Es, Nyx and Lion can be targeted to ground or enemy player and still go off. As I mentioned earlier some people like to try and play "pro" and will cast in on the ground in hopes of a "hit" Es and Nyx's stun might hit multiple people as long as they are in the path. Not sure on Nyx's, if its target on a hero it only hits that hero and doesn't continue out. Lions is will only hit the target hero or 1 hero if cast on the ground.
VS, Sand King, Skel King, Gyro, Shadow Shaman (Shackle), CM's Frost bite (the encasement) are good examples of single target stuns
Tide, Magnus, Enigma are good examples of Multi Hero stuns - ulty version
WR, Sven, Witch Doctor are good examples of Multi Hero stuns
Lina, Lesh, Tiny are also good example of Multi Hero stuns that don't have to target a player. These are generally considered Unreliable.
Enigma, Witch Doctor, Envoker are good examples of mini stuns
I wouldn't consider malefice to be a mini stun. It might only stun for a second but the combination of three in a row pretty much prevents someone from doing anything. Only a hero with blink is going to get away in the tiny window it gives you to act.
I don't know why it's even a debate. Reliable stuns, you can "rely" on it stunning people the majority of the time. If it makes you happy, WR's shackle is a reliable mini stun and an unreliable 3.75s stun. It doesn't matter how well you play your WR, the stun depends on the situation, the location of the target and his movements, something you can not control.
And CM's frostbite is not a stun either.
If you can hit 100% of your WR shackles on your 2nd windrunner game, then you are either the Bobby Fischer of Windrunner, or embellishing the truth a bit (or a lot).
Um... Shackle shot is easy to hit, and can be hit every time... Shackle shotting 2 heroes together or to a tree/creep is a different story. Depending on the situation It might be better to just use shackle shot as an interrupt, like during a bane ulty or enigma ulty. Also... player skill is always relevant, I could say sven's is a shit hero because I can't play him well. Is it true? no, is it relevant yes.
@ Lysah I think at level 4 theirs very little delay between the stuns, but till that point its more like Invokers stun, where their is enough duration between them that something can be done. So, i guess i'll amend my earlier statement and say, that pre-level 4 its a "mini" stun.
hey how do i go about reporting a bug? I got doombringer bracers the other day (the elven doom something or other ones) and whenever I move they don't follow my character. The armor like stays behind him and then when doombringer stops they magically warp to his wrists.
The 2nd time I played her I was with a group of friends and we did random draft and I took to long to decided and ended up with her. In the beginning I still had that mentality of using shackle when you can get two heroes. But early on, by say 8 minutes. we had missed 2 easy kills because I was trying to shackle two heroes instead of just trying to shackle to a tree or creep. At that point I got bitched at by my friend and lane partner. Pissed that I had been yelled at I started just using the ability when ever I could. Thus if it was off CD, I used it. What this lead to was me noticing the max distance and angle full duration shackle would happen. By the end of the game, I had a good grasp of where the enemy needed to be in order to get a full shackle, if I should use it to get that full duration, or use to interrupt someone else and save a team mate.
Knowledge of a hero goes a long way. Also, people are prone to pick up different hero's faster than others. For me WR was a hero i picked up easily because of play style and situation. A hero I've played many times and still don't do well with is Furion, and it would be easy to argue that he's far easier to use then WR, yet in at least 3 of the games I've played with him, the sole reason we lost is because I couldn't play him well.
Is there any real way to quickly improve with a certain hero, a batch of heroes or a certain role besides simply practicing them? I've been playing AR a lot more lately but I regularly stumble upon heroes with whom I struggle, such as Lesh. Repeatedly canceling his stun feels more awkward than canceling other spells.
Also v1lat doesn't seem to be particularly impressed with Na`Vi's roster change.
Do note that no player is infallible and regardless of how well their team is performing, there will be mistakes. Sometimes you die even if you made the correct decision. To draw a comparison to poker: When you have a strong hand (and a statistical advantage), you go for it. Even if you end up losing to a better hand, there are situations where going in is worth the risk every time. There's a difference between a player making a mistake, and a player taking a risk which turns out bad.
Rogue dragon knight? And they said I was a stupid paranoid lunatic for building an underground bomb shelter!