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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by JoErVoL View Post
    I find it silly that people say that dota2 has more options than lol's current meta. Ofc it has, it's new. If one year from now it still has various strategies, then yes, it would be better than LoL. I don't think lol's current meta was from the start, so it isn't exactly "fair" to compare the two.

    Personally I can't bring myself to play any more dota.
    Having being a "dota classic" player, who moved to all stars and his first words were "what's this unbalanced sh!thole?", then focusing on allstars (since everyone else stopped playing classic! ), I can't bring myself to do it again....
    umm but you have same strats(well not exatcly, we are still missing few meta changing heroes in dota2)
    in warcraft dota and its not a new game
    so it already proven that dota is better in that case
    Last edited by Finear; 2012-03-11 at 03:08 AM.

  2. #62
    DoTA2 is a clone of DoTA with a better engine under the hood. In terms of play it is identical. So saying that DoTA2 has more options in its meta-game than LoL because it is "new" is just laughable. Comparison with LoL is not really fair anyway. LoL was designed to be easier to pick up and play than DoTA and will never have the complexity of the original...because it is not meant to be so. HoN is a better comparison.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Jinto View Post
    DoTA2 is a clone of DoTA with a better engine under the hood. In terms of play it is identical. So saying that DoTA2 has more options in its meta-game than LoL because it is "new" is just laughable. Comparison with LoL is not really fair anyway. LoL was designed to be easier to pick up and play than DoTA and will never have the complexity of the original...because it is not meant to be so. HoN is a better comparison.
    Really? So dota2 is just dota with a better engine? They didn't change anything? skills,items,heroes, abilities, ANYTHING? If yes, then indeed my argument was laughable. Not just laughable, f*cking hilarious! Now on the other hand, I want to congratulate you. You traded a free updated game with a payable game from valve! Congrats! (whether it's f2p with shop or b2p).

    On the other hand, if they changed anything, from a single ability in a couple of heroes to how powerful supports are or whatever, if they plan to add new heroes, items etc, the meta can change at any moment. It might already have. That's my point. Maybe going 3bot is viable atm, maybe it was in dota (haven't played it for a quite a while). Maybe it won't be a year from now when people have played a thousand matches and have ended up in one or two valid strategies. So basically it comes down to this. Is it a new dota, following closely on the steps of the previous? then you can't possible know the strategies it has. Is it exactly like the old, complete copy paste? then you know everything.

  4. #64
    Mechagnome akts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoErVoL View Post
    Really? So dota2 is just dota with a better engine? They didn't change anything? skills,items,heroes, abilities, ANYTHING?
    Well something must have changed, but its like 6.74 -> 6.78 update. Not a major remake definately. But they now get a new engine, their own engine that they can tweak any way possible, that will allow them more innovations.
    Last edited by akts; 2012-03-11 at 11:58 AM.
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  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by JoErVoL View Post
    Is it exactly like the old, complete copy paste? then you know everything.
    what?
    you dont know everything, this game is changing constantly, like starcraft someone got briliant idea that works and few weeks later someone else figured way to counter it so you need to find new strat
    and icefrog is still adding new heroes to pool, new items etc.


    Quote Originally Posted by JoErVoL View Post
    Now on the other hand, I want to congratulate you. You traded a free updated game with a payable game from valve! Congrats! (whether it's f2p with shop or b2p).
    srsly?
    do you really think that warcraft dota was better because its free? (DOTA2 is most likely going to be fp2 and you have to buy warcraft 3 anyway)
    new engine allows new mechanics but the game is still in beta so they need to finish copying original and then start something new
    and cmon
    finding good game in dota was huge pain in the ass
    no matchaking, tons of custom lobbys (garena, dotalicius etc.) so you can ragequit without any consequences
    keybinding sucks, manualy placing items in curier and if dont have enough slots in inventory you were wasting time trying to complete item on lane
    gameplay wise warcraft dota is perfect for me
    but engine is terrbile (now)
    DOTA2 is just better

  6. #66
    In Dota 2, contrary to HoN and LoL, you can win a game where the enemy team out levels, out farms and out carries you.

    The meta game changes almost every week without patches or changes to the game of any kind. The game is so versatile, a setup that you've been running for ages can be wrecked by a single hero and you need to rethink your entire strategy. It's beautiful.

  7. #67
    I am Murloc! Grading's Avatar
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    Now DotA2 is starting to sound like WoW PvP, to be honest.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Swiftero View Post
    Now DotA2 is starting to sound like WoW PvP, to be honest.
    in a positive or negative way :P?

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Thigrai View Post
    It's already on steam dude. Kinda ironic how you don't want to go with HoN/LoL becuase they look weird but don't think so for Dota. Nearly EVERY hero looks different. Chen for example was an Orc in Dota, he's a black guy in Dota 2. So you're kind of contradicting yourself.
    Ofc the heroes are gonna look differently. Especially the ones that are originally created by blizzard. Chen is one of them. Look at bounty hunter for example, he was a dreanei in dota 1 in dota 2 its some goblin mutation... why? because if they would recreate dreanei they would get sued by blizzard...
    But the fact is, in most cases you just look at the hero and you know which hero it is when comparing to dota 1. Like magina for example, its no longer a night elf, but you jsut look at magina and you know its him. Same goes for pretty much every hero.


    ps. Kingdom for dota 2 beta key

  10. #70
    I am Murloc! Grading's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finear View Post
    in a positive or negative way :P?
    Kind of negative. I mean, from what I hear, if you mess up just a tiny bit, you're screwed. And there are heroes that can simply destroy others, just like that? Sounds like the shifting balance of WoW and it's classes, tbh.

    I mean sure, I always welcome games that put up a challenge, but I don't think it's very fun when you can get absolutely obliterated in an instant.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Swiftero View Post
    Kind of negative. I mean, from what I hear, if you mess up just a tiny bit, you're screwed.
    if your enemy can exploit your mistakes (plural form!) than yes you are screwed but so in other multiplayer games

    Quote Originally Posted by Swiftero View Post
    And there are heroes that can simply destroy others, just like that?
    yes and no
    yes if you are playing bad
    e.g. Tiny http://www.dota2wiki.com/wiki/Tiny he can one shot you with toss avalanche combo in early stages of the game (looks like OP hero on paper) but only if you are alone so to counter his ganks you need to place wards on map and stay near creep/tower/friendly hero when hes coming if you didnt do this and he killed you few times well its your fault
    and as hes strength hero he need to build his mana pool with items so you can pick good hero to shut down his farm in early game and hes useless later without items
    Last edited by Finear; 2012-03-11 at 03:47 PM.

  12. #72
    I am Murloc! Grading's Avatar
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    I just got a bit worried, because I really want to try DotA2 (either beta or when it comes out), but it just sounds like you'll get completely destroyed as a newbie.

    Heck, I just recently did a 5v5 PvP match in LoL, and my team got absolutely decimated, which only made me dread what kind of hell you could experience in DotA2.

  13. #73
    All the Dota2 love in this thread makes me a happy guy.

  14. #74
    Dota will most likely be F2P with a micro-transactions system similar to Team Fortress 2. LoL has a huge playerbase, the only way they can compete is making the game more accessible. As it stands the game has a higher learning curve than League, if you also have to pay for it people are going to be turned off.
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  15. #75
    Elemental Lord Noomz's Avatar
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    I just really don't like the visual style of DotA 2. The animations, the heroes, everything. It's just ugly and sluggish-looking and the map that I've seen is really boring.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Noomz View Post
    I just really don't like the visual style of DotA 2. The animations, the heroes, everything. It's just ugly and sluggish-looking and the map that I've seen is really boring.
    Yeah aesthetics also do not fit into my taste as well. Gameplay is sluggish compared to HoN. The map is the same as DotA (and to some degree the same as HoN) so that is just fine, you can't make a new map every other month... it takes time for people to learn juke spots, hiding spots, warding and what not.

    I do have to say warding in DotA is lame... it is a lot better in HoN (where you can place the ward anywhere you like) If you are really interested I'd say wait till more heroes are added... the pool is fairly limited and there aint no like a techies party.

    Really we need more kamikazes in games.
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  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Finear View Post
    if your enemy can exploit your mistakes (plural form!) than yes you are screwed but so in other multiplayer games


    yes and no
    yes if you are playing bad
    e.g. Tiny http://www.dota2wiki.com/wiki/Tiny he can one shot you with toss avalanche combo in early stages of the game (looks like OP hero on paper) but only if you are alone so to counter his ganks you need to place wards on map and stay near creep/tower/friendly hero when hes coming if you didnt do this and he killed you few times well its your fault
    and as hes strength hero he need to build his mana pool with items so you can pick good hero to shut down his farm in early game and hes useless later without items
    Jumping in thread for this post.

    Tiny really is OP, you don't really stop him at any point of the game. He's a prime example of why STR>AGI in terms of carrying. AM or spectre might end a game solo, but they need 45 minutes of being left completely alone to do it. Tiny can 1v2 two ranged heroes, still pick up kills if anyone runs into him alone, still push ranged and support heroes of out lanes, and also become one of the most terrifying carries late game. But that's what's great about DotA, any hero can perform any role if built that way. The game is centered around the items, not the heroes.

    Main reason I left LoL permanently the day I got a DotA2 key > boring meta play. LoL is a solid 20 minutes of lane phase most games, DotA the lane phase is over as early as 6. LoL is pretty much ALWAYS solo mid, solo top, support/carry bot and jungler. DotA is solo top/tri bot, two top solo bot roamer, two mid solo top solo bot roamer, etc. And then, once people FINALLY start leaving their lanes for pushes, LoL becomes 150% about staying in a pack of 5. Team fights are over in mere seconds, and that's the entire game. DotA is much, much more friendly to split pushing and late game traps/ganks than LoL, where most games that last more than 30 minutes both teams just run around as 5 until they happen to run into each other or someone tries to baron.

    I won't put up a value statement like "dota takes more skill," but I will assert that it has much more personal involvement in the gameplay. Look at the difference in how supports and carries play out in late game team fights and it should be at least a little obvious.
    Last edited by Lysah; 2012-03-11 at 09:45 PM.
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  18. #78
    Elemental Lord Duilliath's Avatar
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    While I know the meta went stale a bit in LoL, I don't think it's as stagnant as some make it out to be. M5 pretty much single-handedly (single-teamedly?) changed the way the jungler works now. AD carries weren't an uncommon sight in mid. People can still send AP carries top. Kill lanes still exist to some extent.

    I do agree that for the most part it doesn't diverge much and this is probably one of the main reasons for the slow release of support champions in LoL.

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by JoErVoL View Post
    Really? So dota2 is just dota with a better engine? They didn't change anything? skills,items,heroes, abilities, ANYTHING? If yes, then indeed my argument was laughable. Not just laughable, f*cking hilarious! Now on the other hand, I want to congratulate you. You traded a free updated game with a payable game from valve! Congrats! (whether it's f2p with shop or b2p).

    On the other hand, if they changed anything, from a single ability in a couple of heroes to how powerful supports are or whatever, if they plan to add new heroes, items etc, the meta can change at any moment. It might already have. That's my point. Maybe going 3bot is viable atm, maybe it was in dota (haven't played it for a quite a while). Maybe it won't be a year from now when people have played a thousand matches and have ended up in one or two valid strategies. So basically it comes down to this. Is it a new dota, following closely on the steps of the previous? then you can't possible know the strategies it has. Is it exactly like the old, complete copy paste? then you know everything.
    Why would you even comment in a thread about DoTA2 if you don't even know anything about it -.-" It just makes yourself look foolish.

  20. #80
    I am Murloc! Grading's Avatar
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    I think creating some different maps in LoL might make the gameplay a bit more exciting, perhaps some maps that can offer other strategies.

    But this should probably not be discussed in a DotA2 thread.

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