1. #15321
    Maxing fissure first is really nice if you have no easy way of approaching he enemy heroes without getting wrecked, and/or if the enemies try to disengage while on low health... Being able to snipe enemy heroes with your big, fat rod is pretty fantastic.

  2. #15322
    Herald of the Titans Puffler's Avatar
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    #5 ES every game so I can't go the fun strongman ES builds.

    The only thing to remember if you are not going carry ES is that you are one of the best ganks in the entire game, make use of it.
    Diablo 3 - Demon Hunter - Wizard - Monk - Crusader
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  3. #15323
    Stood in the Fire
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    Soul ring on ES is amazing.
    Islas Canarias - Work 2 days, Rest 5.
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  4. #15324
    carry es is so op, can solo vs any1 cuz enchant totem build. and after u get treads blink armlet u can solo any1 with - pre enchant totem->blink-fisure->hit->enchant totem->hit. if they dont die, echo slam for fun. a simple soul ring, help u a lot with ur mana, and here u get heart if try hard. or crit for fun
    "We live in a world where a style of play that uses posession and passing to try and make spaces is made fun of.
    While a style of play where a team sits back for 90 minutes and breaks away in 1v1 situations is respected."
    - Ronald Koeman.

  5. #15325
    God it's so satisfying when you have a Nature's Prophet try and go for your head (I was Vengeful Spirit) only to find his ass wrecked in a few hits.

  6. #15326
    Stood in the Fire
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    I thought void jungle is gonna be terrible experience once noobs pick 2 carries, offlane, mid. 15:15 battlefury with some roaming here and there to lane when mid was trying to gank. 2 points in backtrack, shield and queling blade with killing neutrals between trees solo, ring of health and than you have all options open for MoM/Boots or finish that BF.
    Last edited by Sorcereria; 2014-08-20 at 09:52 PM.
    Islas Canarias - Work 2 days, Rest 5.
    Retired from WoW, ex. Feral, WoL #1-10 25HC . Ex CS pro.

  7. #15327
    Quote Originally Posted by Puffler View Post
    #5 ES every game so I can't go the fun strongman ES builds.

    The only thing to remember if you are not going carry ES is that you are one of the best ganks in the entire game, make use of it.
    Make someone else hard support, leaving a melee caster hero with low base mana to buy wards and chicken is just asking to lose imo. ES absolutely need items to be effective, at least blink, AT LEAST, and something to do his mana over, heroes like CM need nothing.
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  8. #15328
    Herald of the Titans Puffler's Avatar
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    heh, make someone else.

    If I could make that happen my winrate would go up by atleast 5% :P


    Generally I pick ES first (no reason not to, he is good against all heroes) and then watch as the team picks 2 / 3 carries and an offlaner. So far I've since I've played ES differently I've got 6/9 wins (should have been 7 but my internets died on me)
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  9. #15329
    Quote Originally Posted by Puffler View Post
    heh, make someone else.

    If I could make that happen my winrate would go up by atleast 5% :P


    Generally I pick ES first (no reason not to, he is good against all heroes) and then watch as the team picks 2 / 3 carries and an offlaner. So far I've since I've played ES differently I've got 6/9 wins (should have been 7 but my internets died on me)
    Still doesn't mean you have to be the ward bitch. Tell the team to man up and help or you go jungle 30 minutes cy@
    Win and live. Lose and die.
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  10. #15330
    Herald of the Titans Puffler's Avatar
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    If is good enough to win games by myself I would, but alas I am not good enough for that. I can certainly make a big impact but not quite good enough for the finishing touches most of the time.
    Diablo 3 - Demon Hunter - Wizard - Monk - Crusader
    Dota 2 Rampage # 1 # 2 # 3 # 4
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  11. #15331
    Pandaren Monk crackleslap's Avatar
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    Think I just witnessed one of the most toxic players I have ever encountered on this game. Literally, this guy (Clockwerk) claims mid. But the fact is Tinker was at mid. Then he complained that Clockwerk is a shit hero outside of the mid lane. How do these people even get in the same mmr? So he decides he would feed to everyone. Shaming Asians and saying how he would "nuke" all of China, Taiwan and Japan. I don't understand people sometimes.

    Fucking cunt.

  12. #15332
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Still doesn't mean you have to be the ward bitch. Tell the team to man up and help or you go jungle 30 minutes cy@
    I will try this in the future!


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    You write your sandwich on it.



  13. #15333
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Could somebody give me some pointers to beating SF? I always have a lot of issues surviving against him in lane.

  14. #15334
    Mechagnome PraisetheSun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    Could somebody give me some pointers to beating SF? I always have a lot of issues surviving against him in lane.
    He shouldn't really be able to solo-kill you without a Haste rune unless you screw up severely and eat Razes to the face. On top of that, his base damage is absolute ass, so instead of trading harass with him early, focus on your denies and lasthits - the longer it takes him to grab those first extremely important souls, the better. With 38 damage, it's not like he can really bully you out of lane in the first place.

    If you're a melee hero, it's obviously a lot harder since he'll have an easier time clipping you with Razes, but the first few minutes against SF really are the most critical - the longer you force him to play with terrible damage, the harder you make his life.

  15. #15335
    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    Could somebody give me some pointers to beating SF? I always have a lot of issues surviving against him in lane.
    Beating SF is all about not letting him get momentum. The first level you should try your best not to let him get any CS and try to get harass on him as well. After he gets level 2 he will probably start razing a bit but his damage output will still be low so try to keep harassing him while getting all last hits. By doing this you will get a lead that will allow you to maybe win the lane.

    At level 3 and forward there isn't much to stop SF from farming because of level 2 Raze. You just have to try to kill him if you want to win the lane. Do note that most good SFs will try to hit you+creeps with their razes. SFs don't want to waste raze for only one last hit. So if you see a creep that is low and you are standing close to it then move away. He will for sure raze you.

    I've done a lot of SF vs X and the biggest mistake people make is too little pressure and bad last hitting the first three levels.
    Last edited by Ariadne; 2014-08-21 at 09:16 PM.

  16. #15336
    Dreadlord veiledy0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    Could somebody give me some pointers to beating SF? I always have a lot of issues surviving against him in lane.
    Also check his starting items (do it against every hero, but extremely important against SF). If he starts with a Wraith Band that means he has no Salve, so you shoud focus on harassing him as much as possible, since he only has tangos for regen. Also check if he has Necromastery at lvl 1 when he arrives to the lane (the icon shows even if he has 0 souls), because some SF's start with Raze at lvl 1, to get their Bottle ASAP (I've seen S4 and rtz occasionally do this), but lvl 1 Raze only does 75 dmg, which is equal to the damage of any melee hero with a QB, so it's still not that hard to deny him CS, just a bit harder than when he tries to CS with his 44 starting dmg. And probably the most important thing against SF is to get a good block at the start. He will then try to aggro the creeps downhill, at which point you can just walk up and right click him. On the bright side, if SF dies once, he lost mid forever. His chances of comeback are 0.
    Last edited by veiledy0; 2014-08-21 at 09:36 PM.
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  17. #15337
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    Also check his starting items (do it against every hero, but extremely important against SF). If he starts with a Wraith Band that means he has no Salve, so you shoud focus on harassing him as much as possible, since he only has tangos for regen. Also check if he has Necromastery at lvl 1 when he arrives to the lane (the icon shows even if he has 0 souls), because some SF's start with Raze at lvl 1, to get their Bottle ASAP (I've seen S4 and rtz occasionally do this), but lvl 1 Raze only does 75 dmg, which is equal to the damage of any melee hero with a QB, so it's still not that hard to deny him CS, just a bit harder than when he tries to CS with his 44 starting dmg. And probably the most important thing against SF is to get a good block at the start. He will then try to aggro the creeps downhill, at which point you can just walk up and right click him. On the bright side, if SF dies once, he lost mid forever. His chances of comeback are 0.
    QB doesn't work with denies I think and SF is one of the best heroes to make a comeback from a death. Very few heroes can stop SF who go Raze first from getting CS with level 1 Raze. TA with a Wraith Band is about the only one I can think of.

  18. #15338
    Dreadlord veiledy0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    QB doesn't work with denies I think and SF is one of the best heroes to make a comeback from a death. Very few heroes can stop SF who go Raze first from getting CS with level 1 Raze. TA with a Wraith Band is about the only one I can think of.
    It doesn't work on denies, I used the "melee hero with a QB" for comparison of how much damage it does. That's why I said to check what he skilled first. If you know he has Raze first, you will need to try a bit harder to deny him creeps, but it's not that mega-hard to just make him miss at least 1 creep per wave, and delay his Bottle. I don't think SF is good to make a comeback from death though. If you kill him early and he misses some XP his Raze will be lower lvl than it should, and if you kill him a bit later he loses all his souls and it takes 3-4 waves to get them back.
    When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears
    When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears
    And I held your hand through all of these years

  19. #15339
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    It doesn't work on denies, I used the "melee hero with a QB" for comparison of how much damage it does. That's why I said to check what he skilled first. If you know he has Raze first, you will need to try a bit harder to deny him creeps, but it's not that mega-hard to just make him miss at least 1 creep per wave, and delay his Bottle. I don't think SF is good to make a comeback from death though. If you kill him early and he misses some XP his Raze will be lower lvl than it should, and if you kill him a bit later he loses all his souls and it takes 3-4 waves to get them back.
    So where did you get the "it's still not that hard to deny him CS" part from? Because denying against 75 pure damage is quite difficult.

    SF is good at comeback because all he needs is level 3 and he will have guaranteed CS even if you killed him once. Doesn't matter what level you are. Once he hits level 5 you can't stop him. Once he hits level 7 he can clear mid then farm jungle. Even if you mange to force him out of lane he can find farm in jungle.
    Last edited by Ariadne; 2014-08-21 at 10:15 PM.

  20. #15340
    SF is the best comeback, 0 mana cost 900 damage nuke with no cooldown makes it impossible to stop him from getting gold. Even if you somehow manage to completely kick him out of mid so hard that he can't even shadowraze for gold, he can just stack jungle and still maintain 500 GPM.

    You want to beat SF, pick a better carry and have a better team. All SF is is a ton of auto attack damage and guaranteed farm. Most melee carrys make short work of him and the proper team that can keep strong early game will keep him down as well. The biggest way people lose to SF is letting him have runes and letting him get a lot of early power, such as a quick blink dagger so he can run around and start two shotting supports.

    Pick a hero like SB or PA and gank him endlessly and he is no scary hero. Try to sit back and outfarm him and you will lose.
    Win and live. Lose and die.
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