1. #3521
    Your incessant whining is going to get this thread be closed, no matter how candidly it represents the Dota2 community at large.

    Anyone have any idea what hero's are coming next, or what time frame they have been looking at for releasing hero's?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lugo Moll View Post
    Consider this philosophical question: If Blizz fails, but noone is there to see it. Will there still be QQ?

  2. #3522
    Quote Originally Posted by Sackman View Post
    Your incessant whining is going to get this thread be closed, no matter how candidly it represents the Dota2 community at large.

    Anyone have any idea what hero's are coming next, or what time frame they have been looking at for releasing hero's?
    Medusa or a surprise, with the amount of mass invites going out I expect heroes to be coming out quickly from here. They've proven they're capable of a hero a week.

    @Ariadne
    It's for the best since we seem unable to look at simple concepts in the first place.

    @Kuntantee
    If all you're gonna do is rage and whine and cry, then don't post.
    Last edited by Lysah; 2012-11-19 at 02:22 PM.

  3. #3523
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Medusa or a surprise, with the amount of mass invites going out I expect heroes to be coming out quickly from here. They've proven they're capable of a hero a week.
    I wouldn't be so certain, previously they've had from half a dozen to dozen heroes as WIP in game files, right now I think it's just Dusa, Shredder and Jah'rakal according to Cyborgmatt. And according to devs it takes at least a month to work a hero from start to finish, so I'm inclined to doubt they will hit hero/week rate any time soon. I'd imagine they're focusing more heavily on other things like those tutorials or Unix support.

    That being said, I will still explode if I don't get my hands on Gorgon this week.

  4. #3524
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    TA getting farm mid is a TA that wins mid. End of story. Gryo won't stop her from getting last hits ever.

    Yeah, TA will Blink into enemy and die because of dust... Because a TA uses Meld defensively when she blinks in. Most stupid thing I've heard in a while. I'm out.
    Meld is the only thing that's stopping her from getting gibbed against a team that knows how to deal with defensive Refraction charges.

    Look at it from the reverse - you're saying none of these heroes stop TA from getting last hits (that's a flat-out lie, but we'll go with it.) What's TA doing to stop the enemy mid hero from getting last hits? If both heroes get plenty of last hits because apparently neither of them can prevent the other from getting them, how is TA automatically winning her lane?

    How is a TA with 60 CS at 10 minutes more dangerous than a Sand King with 60 CS at 10 minutes, or a Viper, or a Gyro, or a Huskar, or a fucking Batrider?

    60 CS at 10 minutes. That means 3000 gold gained including the 1 g/sec inherent gold gain. That's Arcane Boots and 3 creep kills shy of Blink Dagger for Sand King. At 10 minutes!

    Huskar has his Helm of the Dominator or Armlet and most of his treads (or more likely, treads and then a few hundred away from either other item.)

    Bat has his Blink Dagger and Bottle.

    Viper has... whatever the hell he wants, really. I'm a big fan of Armlet+Hood on him, but I'm sure you'll laugh at that.

    The point is that even if they just break even with TA on CS (which is very possible for all of those heroes), they're a fuck of a lot more dangerous at that 10 minute/3000 gold mark than TA is. I don't know if that means they won their lane, but it definitely means they didn't lose it.



    ---------- Post added 2012-11-19 at 11:43 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Hermanni View Post
    I wouldn't be so certain, previously they've had from half a dozen to dozen heroes as WIP in game files, right now I think it's just Dusa, Shredder and Jah'rakal according to Cyborgmatt. And according to devs it takes at least a month to work a hero from start to finish, so I'm inclined to doubt they will hit hero/week rate any time soon. I'd imagine they're focusing more heavily on other things like those tutorials or Unix support.

    That being said, I will still explode if I don't get my hands on Gorgon this week.
    What makes you like Medusa so much?
    Last edited by PizzaSHARK; 2012-11-19 at 06:02 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Cailan Ebonheart View Post
    I also do landscaping on weekends with some mexican kid that I "hired". He's real good because he's 100% obedient to me and does everything I say while never complaining. He knows that I am the man in the relationship and is completely submissive towards me as he should be.
    Quote Originally Posted by SUH View Post
    Crissi the goddess of MMO, if i may. ./bow

  5. #3525
    Quote Originally Posted by Hermanni View Post
    I wouldn't be so certain, previously they've had from half a dozen to dozen heroes as WIP in game files, right now I think it's just Dusa, Shredder and Jah'rakal according to Cyborgmatt. And according to devs it takes at least a month to work a hero from start to finish, so I'm inclined to doubt they will hit hero/week rate any time soon. I'd imagine they're focusing more heavily on other things like those tutorials or Unix support.

    That being said, I will still explode if I don't get my hands on Gorgon this week.
    They surprised us before with heroes they hadn't released much data for, so, I'm hoping for the best. If it does take them this long then we still have a very big wait ahead of us.

  6. #3526
    Man, there sure have been a lot of people acting big in this thread. Sounds mostly like people managed to feed TA and lost, then got mad.

    Recently lost a PvP game (I'm pretty new so bear with me on this) to a fed Riki, he would just ambush someone, throw up his smokething and death. I got pretty mad, but then I remembered that he's only that good if you feed him. At least I can imagine a non-fed Riki being pretty useless.

    Also Sniper is an asshole. He wouldn't be nearly as bad if he didn't have that insane proc rate on Headshot with his insane range.

  7. #3527
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swiftero View Post
    Man, there sure have been a lot of people acting big in this thread. Sounds mostly like people managed to feed TA and lost, then got mad.

    Recently lost a PvP game (I'm pretty new so bear with me on this) to a fed Riki, he would just ambush someone, throw up his smokething and death. I got pretty mad, but then I remembered that he's only that good if you feed him. At least I can imagine a non-fed Riki being pretty useless.

    Also Sniper is an asshole. He wouldn't be nearly as bad if he didn't have that insane proc rate on Headshot with his insane range.
    Sniper is just waiting to be discovered by pro teams, IMO. His base damage sucks and he has no escape mechanism, but he doesn't even need many items before he's dangerous, and by time the early mid game rolls around he can plink people from well outside tower range and his ulti (being both cheap and on a short cooldown) makes fighting anywhere near Sniper extremely risky if you're around half health. Hell, Sniper can open with his ulti and drop underfarmed supports to half health before the fight even starts. Late game Sniper is truly scary, basically 800+ range permastun.

    Maybe pool him an early Wraith Band/Aquila for quick stats and to boost his damage. Then something to help him not die if Nightstalker comes out of the woods and says hi - Lothars is the usual choice but Dust is a really good answer to it when it's being used as an escape button. I'd imagine Mask of Madness would be good on Sniper after you already have some kind of damage item - like after Manta Style, maybe.

    Riki is still really strong, his cloud is OP as hell. I guess he'd be more common if he fit into the current meta well. He's like part ganker and part carry and isn't the best at either, and his laning is awful, so it seems like it's hard to find a place to squeeze him in right now. But his smoke cloud wins games and he hits extremely hard pretty quickly once he has treads+diffusal or treads+yasha.
    Last edited by PizzaSHARK; 2012-11-20 at 10:26 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Cailan Ebonheart View Post
    I also do landscaping on weekends with some mexican kid that I "hired". He's real good because he's 100% obedient to me and does everything I say while never complaining. He knows that I am the man in the relationship and is completely submissive towards me as he should be.
    Quote Originally Posted by SUH View Post
    Crissi the goddess of MMO, if i may. ./bow

  8. #3528
    (I don't watch pro Dota games yet so don't take my word on this too literally.)

    I think the reason pro players wouldn't use Sniper much is because he's pretty much just good at taking down someone 1v1. If you are more people, and if you manage to ambush him or disable him, he's toast. I know this goes for most people (fuck, the stuns in Dota can be really brutal. Screw you Chaos Knight), but Sniper the most squishy bastard IN THE GAME.

    He does good damage, his Headshot thing is crazy and he has long range, but I imagine pro players would counter/ambush him pretty easily.

  9. #3529
    Sniper was the default solo mid pick back in 04? or 05, he has insane range, best attack animation in game, headshot is free MKB, but he is slow, has no health, no escape mechanism so he kinda fell out of grace as metagame evolved (then came orbwalking era and Silencer's glory days, then MYM.Merlini and his legendary Zeus as i recall). Sadly, Sniper doesn't offer anything than damage, and that's easy to come by in dota, while being easy to gank (morph was op because he was unkillable carry, not because of his damage potential).

    On the other hand, how would you all feel if items were nerfed in power a bit? In my opinion, we see same heroes in metagame because any holes in your team can be easily plugged by items, maybe we would see more dynamic picking because you'd need to proper counter enemy's team.

  10. #3530
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    Quote Originally Posted by cudomix View Post
    Sniper was the default solo mid pick back in 04? or 05, he has insane range, best attack animation in game, headshot is free MKB, but he is slow, has no health, no escape mechanism so he kinda fell out of grace as metagame evolved (then came orbwalking era and Silencer's glory days, then MYM.Merlini and his legendary Zeus as i recall). Sadly, Sniper doesn't offer anything than damage, and that's easy to come by in dota, while being easy to gank (morph was op because he was unkillable carry, not because of his damage potential).

    On the other hand, how would you all feel if items were nerfed in power a bit? In my opinion, we see same heroes in metagame because any holes in your team can be easily plugged by items, maybe we would see more dynamic picking because you'd need to proper counter enemy's team.
    I'm undecided on nerfing items. Items are by far the most interesting aspect of Dota, especially compared to LoL, and of the items closest to being overpowered or in need of nerfing, it's usually due to an activated ability which can't be easily quantified.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Cailan Ebonheart View Post
    I also do landscaping on weekends with some mexican kid that I "hired". He's real good because he's 100% obedient to me and does everything I say while never complaining. He knows that I am the man in the relationship and is completely submissive towards me as he should be.
    Quote Originally Posted by SUH View Post
    Crissi the goddess of MMO, if i may. ./bow

  11. #3531
    Quote Originally Posted by Swiftero View Post
    Man, there sure have been a lot of people acting big in this thread. Sounds mostly like people managed to feed TA and lost, then got mad.
    So you are saying we are bunch of noobs who got pwned and gone mad by TA that's why we think she's a good hero or she can win mid against SK?

    I see.

    This thread is getting more and more hilarious.

    About sniper, also keep in mind that sniper's projectile speed is one of the highest in game which lets him easily CS and deny. Only problem is he's like Drown Ranger which he lacks a reliable escape mechanism.
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2012-11-20 at 06:43 PM.

  12. #3532
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    So you are saying we are bunch of noobs who got pwned and gone mad by TA that's why we think she's a good hero or she can win mid against SK?

    I see.

    This thread is getting more and more hilarious.

    About sniper, also keep in mind that sniper's projectile speed is one of the highest in game which lets him easily CS and deny. Only problem is he's like Drown Ranger which he lacks a reliable escape mechanism.
    First why is SK mid (assuming you mean Sand king, as Skeleton king would be an even worse choice- in my opinion)? TA is fairly easy to counter. Dust/wards for her meld and a dot of any kind for refraction. I've noticed in many games that if TA's defensive refraction is down... shes not as cocky/ballzy as if it were up.

    I like sniper as is. His squishy-ness makes up for his High dmg. The problem I see is most player focus on just that, his dmg. going for a shadow blade as his only real means of escape & defense, then building things like Deso, mkb. Many times I'll see the sniper (both enemy and friendly) for go getting a bkb, even when the enemy team has heavy magic dmg or cc, a decision that is usually based of how well his early game is. Personally I like building Eye of skedi and/or Manta with shadow blade, or eye/bkb with shadow blade.

  13. #3533
    Quote Originally Posted by Ichy View Post
    First why is SK mid (assuming you mean Sand king, as Skeleton king would be an even worse choice- in my opinion)? TA is fairly easy to counter. Dust/wards for her meld and a dot of any kind for refraction. I've noticed in many games that if TA's defensive refraction is down... shes not as cocky/ballzy as if it were up.

    I like sniper as is. His squishy-ness makes up for his High dmg. The problem I see is most player focus on just that, his dmg. going for a shadow blade as his only real means of escape & defense, then building things like Deso, mkb. Many times I'll see the sniper (both enemy and friendly) for go getting a bkb, even when the enemy team has heavy magic dmg or cc, a decision that is usually based of how well his early game is. Personally I like building Eye of skedi and/or Manta with shadow blade, or eye/bkb with shadow blade.
    There has been a 3, 4-page discussion about TA and SK or TA vs any hero in mid etc. That's why I thought he's talking about recent discussion.

    Well sniper is good and fun but that hero needs change of mechanics. In terms of DPS, Drown ranger is way way better than him and she got silence. His only arsenal is nearly perma-bash at high attack speed(I think stuns do not persist through BKB not sure tho) and the damage comes with headshot but you got a real problem until you get that point. His ulti is useless. I really doubt we would see him in current competitive scene unless some player feels like it and picks it. Shadowblade is not an escape mechanism just like meld. It's not a defensive item. Well, at least it's not meant to be and I don't think it would fit to sniper. I wonder how it would be if they make his ultimate global with same projectile speed.
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2012-11-20 at 08:13 PM.

  14. #3534
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    I wonder how it would be if they make his ultimate global with same projectile speed.
    Why not make every spell in the game global, that would balance everything.

  15. #3535
    Quote Originally Posted by Daraiki View Post
    Why not make every spell in the game global, that would balance everything.
    You got a better idea? I would like to hear because that was just a thought not even a suggestion.

  16. #3536
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    You got a better idea? I would like to hear because that was just a thought not even a suggestion.
    New sniper tactic: Bloodstone, ulti everything you see earlygame.
    GG.

  17. #3537
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    There has been a 3, 4-page discussion about TA and SK or TA vs any hero in mid etc. That's why I thought he's talking about recent discussion.

    Well sniper is good and fun but that hero needs change of mechanics. In terms of DPS, Drown ranger is way way better than him and she got silence. His only arsenal is nearly perma-bash at high attack speed(I think stuns do not persist through BKB not sure tho) and the damage comes with headshot but you got a real problem until you get that point. His ulti is useless. I really doubt we would see him in current competitive scene unless some player feels like it and picks it. Shadowblade is not an escape mechanism just like meld. It's not a defensive item. Well, at least it's not meant to be and I don't think it would fit to sniper. I wonder how it would be if they make his ultimate global with same projectile speed.
    I've been following the last couple pages pretty loosely, but would have to say a TA mid != guaranteed win.

    Think your right on Head shot not going through BKB, but fairly certain mkb does (no one really gets this item anymore-from what I've seen solo queing) might need to test. Sniper's Ulty is no more useless then Laguna Blade or Finger of Death. However, its better than the last 2 do to its ridiculous range (1800 I believe, or there aboot). Also fairly certain Burizza works on utly and so does the add dmg from shadowblade stealth (testing tonight to see)

    Drows DPS only appears better because her ramp up time is lower (aura + ulty), however in the long run Sniper will win, at least this was the case in dota1 (the heros haven't changed much in a long time).

  18. #3538
    Quote Originally Posted by Ichy View Post
    I've been following the last couple pages pretty loosely, but would have to say a TA mid != guaranteed win.

    Think your right on Head shot not going through BKB, but fairly certain mkb does (no one really gets this item anymore-from what I've seen solo queing) might need to test. Sniper's Ulty is no more useless then Laguna Blade or Finger of Death. However, its better than the last 2 do to its ridiculous range (1800 I believe, or there aboot). Also fairly certain Burizza works on utly and so does the add dmg from shadowblade stealth (testing tonight to see)

    Drows DPS only appears better because her ramp up time is lower (aura + ulty), however in the long run Sniper will win, at least this was the case in dota1 (the heros haven't changed much in a long time).
    No1 said TA mid != guaranteed win. I'm kinda curious how did you get that idea. I think snipers ultimate is way more useless than both of those ultimates. Why?

    Both of those ultimates does significantly more damage compared to Assassinate. It's something around 325 or 350 damage if I remember correct which is pretty poor. Venge's stun + 1 right click will do same, if not more damage. Those spells are instant and Assasinate needs 1 or 2 seconds before releasing the projectile. Also during a team fight you need to wait the casting time while lina and lion can easly hit and run if necessary. Its only advantage is range but I really don't think thats a huge thing. Also sniper is a carry which makes the ultimate conceptually useless at some point because your right clicks will do more damage with some Headshot procs. If it was a dummy dps race, sniper would win on paper but its not. Personally, I don't consider both Drow Ranger and Sniper as strong carries.
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2012-11-20 at 10:29 PM.

  19. #3539
    well, you cant actually compare Laguna Blade/Deadly Fingering to Assasinate.
    Why?
    Because Assasinate has 200\2500\3000 cast range, and is spammable at lvl3.

  20. #3540
    Quote Originally Posted by Storm the Sorrow View Post
    well, you cant actually compare Laguna Blade/Deadly Fingering to Assasinate.
    Why?
    Because Assasinate has 200\2500\3000 cast range, and is spammable at lvl3.
    What?

    ps: It's not spammable. After two uses in a row, you will be out of mana. And again, that range is not a huge thing.
    Last edited by Kuntantee; 2012-11-20 at 10:48 PM.

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