[Megathread] DotA 2

[Lysah]

Juggernaut.

[Lillpapps]

Jugger or a strong str hero (not Sven!).

[Pickled Eyebrows]

I've been playing with a friend of mine, we're usually going together top/bot in games. I've been having a lot of fun with Lich, anyone have any thoughts on a good laning partner for him? My friend's usually playing an agi carry, and sometimes some of the strength heroes, figured we could iron out a solid strategy.

Lich works with anyone really, he is an extremely strong lane presence if you play him right.

If you want a lane that can get early kills however, Juggernaut as a couple of people have mentioned is the perfect choice. Just combo Frost Blast with Spin at the right moment and you're golden.

But really, any carry will work with Lich because he is a great babysitter.

[Kuntantee]

If you want a good lane, I suggest Juggernaut + vengeful spirit. This lane will always work in pubs. Also tiny + centaur is a deadly lane.

[Defaulty]

If you're looking for an amazing pubstomp hero; Bat Rider.

Easily harass anyone in the lane. Nice to have a big hitter along with you like Sven, Jugg, Tiny, etc..

[Hermanni]

Your lanes are all terrible. If you really want your enemy to hate you pick an Axe based dual offlane. Axe + Veno is one of the best, especially if the enemy has a melee carry.

[Kuntantee]

Your lanes are all terrible. If you really want your enemy to hate you pick an Axe based dual offlane. Axe + Veno is one of the best, especially if the enemy has a melee carry.

I'm pretty sure venge + jugger lane can beat yours. Level 3 jugger + venge with initiation advantage is almost guaranteed kill. Especially considering the fact that jugger is magic immune while spinning which means that gale will be useless on him. Key factor is venge's position because she is pretty fragile and if gale hits, that means a taunt inc. but again, this lane setup is pretty safe for jugger.

[Hermanni]

I'm pretty sure venge + jugger lane can beat yours. Level 3 jugger + venge with initiation advantage is almost guaranteed kill. Especially considering the fact that jugger is magic immune while spinning means that gale will be useless on him.

Juggernaut doesn't work that well in offlane, and guaranteed kills are a rarity against skilled enemies who can assess the amount of damage you can put out and don't take risks. Veno + Axe completely stop you farming your own safelane except when it pushes to their tower and can easily force you to take a jog back to your base. Or if you're careless, they'll kill you effortlessly.

I haven't even played this lane in ages because I can't even do it in good conscience, but if you won't believe me I can find a replay.

[Kuntantee]

Juggernaut doesn't work that well in offlane, and guaranteed kills are a rarity against skilled enemies who can assess the amount of damage you can put out and not take risks. Veno + Axe completely stop you farming your own safelane except when it pushes to their tower and can easily force you to take a jog back to your base. Or if you're careless, they'll kill you effortlessly.

I haven't even played this lane in ages because I can't even do it in good conscience, but if you won't believe me I can find a replay.

I do believe you but I was just talking for average pubs. If you consider theoretical discussion where everyone is skilled and very experienced, your lane sucks as well.

[Hermanni]

I do believe you but I was just talking for average pubs. If you consider theoretical discussion where everyone is skilled and very experienced, your lane sucks as well.

People can be skilled in pubs too. I'd like to have an argument better than "your lane sucks as well" though, considering I've never lost a lane with it and the only way I can see that happening is either against a good trilane, which is pretty rare in pubs, or ganks, which can be avoided.

[Kuntantee]

your lane sucks as wel

You didn't provide a better argument other than saying

"Your lanes are all terrible." and suggesting another lane(but I wasn't crying about it). I could easily counter your lane by suggesting another lane composed of three heroes(which is why I said your lane sucks) as you said but that would be too theoretical or fit to pros so I decided not to. I think chaos knight + lesh lane can deal with axe + veno. You are right about jugger + venge will be outfarmed in terms of CS but capable of decreasing the CS difference by killing heroes in lane and again I was just suggesting for pubs.

Also note that even if you can't kill enemy, you will force them to go back for sure which will let jugger to farm more in safe.

[Lysah]

People can be skilled in pubs too. I'd like to have an argument better than "your lane sucks as well" though, considering I've never lost a lane with it and the only way I can see that happening is either against a good trilane, which is pretty rare in pubs, or ganks, which can be avoided.

Solo Lich, stack other lanes and crush them or have a free farming jungler because Axe is wasting his time in a lane. Lane won.

[Hermanni]

"Your lanes are all terrible."

You know I was joking, right?

Besides, I did explain that Venge/Juggernaut is based on getting kills on safe lane, and if you're against a careful player or certain heroes you won't get them. Axe/Veno hardlane is meant to put a lot of pressure on the enemy carry and can achieve that without getting kills or committing much. Anyway, this discussion is sorta pointless, you can try it yourself, just get a friend you can communicate with and who knows whats up. If you don't know how it works here's how to do it.

If the enemy has a jungler get obs, otherwise optional. Veno gets lots of regen, few branches, maybe a RoP for Basi if someone else bought courier/obs. Axe gets maybe a stout shield or just str gloves and regen. When enemies come to farm their creepwave Axe attacks them to force them back and take damage. With a few levels Axe spams Battle Hunger and together with Veno they attack anyone coming close to the creepwave, and Veno Gales any enemy who dares to come close with low on HP or overextends. Axe farms Arcanes and maxes Battle Hunger, Veno puts 2 or more points in Gale, 2 or more in Sting and 1 in Wards at 3 or 4 if you need vision.

Full Battle Hunger + Poisons at level 3 are like 450 magical, 700+ at level 5, taking them at anything but full HP means death and every attempt your enemy take at coming close to the creepwave when it's not in range of the tower means they will take damage. Your kills might get denied but it doesn't matter. Any attempt to initiate on Axe is met with Gale and possible turnaround, any attempt to initiate on Veno needs to get past Axe. If you fail to get your kill, you probably won't get away after having taken few Helixes + Hunger + poisons.

Sorry for the empty talk about replays though, they're all too old and are unavailable.

---------- Post added 2012-12-03 at 09:34 PM ----------

Solo Lich, stack other lanes and crush them or have a free farming jungler because Axe is wasting his time in a lane. Lane won.

This would be met with creepskipping Axe and a quick tower takedown. You're right, though, it's not exactly unbeatable, but against an unprepared enemy this lane is ridiculously good.

Some variants of this lane I've played include Axe/Undying, Axe/Silencer and something I've probably forgotten. You get the general idea. Seeing almost every Axe jungle is pretty sad considering how ridiculous he can be on a lane.

[Olli]

For those of you who haven't been able to get in yet, I'm giving away 5 keys in my latest video to help you guys out! Let's all play this amazing game

[Kuntantee]

stuff

Your lane seems good even at firs glance I have never said it wouldn't work. I was just trying to say the lane setup I suggested has capability do well against your lane setup. Stun + Spin combo would be setback(at worst) for axe + veno means you will be getting CS you were missing.

If you want CS, you don't even have to kill them. Just use stun spin combo at level 1 and force them back. I think jugg venge lane can beat veno axe if its played aggressively.

Blade fury? is too powerful at lowlevels...

[PizzaSHARK]

Your lanes are all terrible. If you really want your enemy to hate you pick an Axe based dual offlane. Axe + Veno is one of the best, especially if the enemy has a melee carry.

If you want your enemy to hate you just run either Veno+Viper or Silencer+Keeper. Silencer+Keeper is really annoying, literal non-stop Curse spam will just make you hate your fucking life for the first fifteen minutes of the game. Veno+Viper means you're dead if you move more than ten feet from your tower and even if you get away, poison's gonna kill you anyway.

[WalkingChaos]

I've been playing with Hecarim in LoL so I decided to try Centaur in DotA 2.
The game has definitely better UI than LoL, better graphics and more character variability. And also level cap in 25 (rather than 18) and of course no maxed out items within a game. I think that Valve will eventually win the war, no matter when DotA 2 will launch.

[Lysah]

As long as Valve keeps the purpose of DotA at promoting a competitive sporting environment I don't see how DotA can possibly lose the "war." LoL is about making money and, so far, DotA is not.

[Finear]

could you guys reguraly remind me to NOT play at night? ;_;

[Grading]

If there was anything in the world that made Russians look bad, it would be Dota 2. It makes me feel bad for the actual decent Russian people out there.

For crap sake, they even have their own server now. Don't come to EU West or even more west with your "Посмотрите на меня, я могу дышать через рот!".

Also the amount of people who start Dota 2 with medium bots... urk. No offense, but most people are not at that level at the start. They need to get that tutorial up, Dota 2 is really newbie-unfriendly.