1. #3141
    I am Murloc! Xuvial's Avatar
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    IMO I'd get H80i. Almost the same performance as H100i, less hassle to install, you get to keep your top exhaust, etc.

  2. #3142
    The Insane DeltrusDisc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Methanar View Post
    What is your electricity bill for doing that.
    Not sure.

    When I first started folding for the mmo-champ team sometime back in late 2011, I spoke to my dad about it and he said that it sounded like a good cause, so he has no issues.

    Plus I only have an OC'd 2500K and 560 Ti, so that's not very much draw. :P
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  3. #3143
    Elemental Lord Drunkenvalley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catanowplx View Post
    Soon getting my Corsair H100 send back for RMA since the pump broke. Been stuck with my louder, uglier and less efficient NZXT havik 140 cooler. Cant wait to get my H100 back. Im considering to get the H100i simply because i can. 140$ aint nothing
    Currently, the H100i, H80i, etc, are all experiencing very common issues with the fans undervolting anything but gracefully on the default firmware, and the firmware update that is available apparently replaces the fan noise with a high-pitched squealing noise from the CPU-block.

  4. #3144
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    Quote Originally Posted by n0cturnal View Post
    I remember back in Windows 98 when you used to download programs to "overclock" the PS/2 port for the mouse to increase the polling rate
    wait a minute.....

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  5. #3145
    Brewmaster Majesticii's Avatar
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    Not sure why everyone is so hung-up on these closed loop coolers. Just get a decent air-cooler. Like Noctua or Dark Rock Pro 2.
    They are, in regard to aircoolers, terribly inefficient and have to use more CFM to get the same performance. And have to use a pump to circulate, creating more noise. I really really don't get it.

    Even my modest (50-60 euro) BeQuiet Dark Rock Advanced C1 keeps my 4.2ghz i5-760 below 70.
    Last edited by Majesticii; 2013-02-14 at 08:44 PM.

  6. #3146
    TOTALLY NOT
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    More surface area = better, regardless
    More surface area = takes up more space

    They aren't always convenient. I personally like their looks and I dislike windows on cases, so I don't much mind their alleged 'hugeness'; My NH-D14 or others.
    I do enjoy an air cooler with the fans turned down to a minimum though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyanotical View Post
    wait a minute.....
    Isn't that precisely the point you want to eliminate by overclocking?

  7. #3147
    The Insane DeltrusDisc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Majesticii View Post
    Not sure why everyone is so hung-up on these closed loop coolers. Just get a decent air-cooler. Like Noctua or Dark Rock Pro 2.
    They are, in regard to aircoolers, terribly inefficient and have to use more CFM to get the same performance. And have to use a pump to circulate, creating more noise. I really really don't get it.

    Even my modest (50-60 euro) BeQuiet Dark Rock Advanced C1 keeps my 4.2ghz i5-760 below 70.
    Because most people want to be able to say...

    "OOOH OOH LOOK AT ME I HAVE LIQUID COOLING! I AM SO COOOOOOOOOL."

    When really, unless you built the loop yourself, no, you aren't that cool. Laziest way to get a "liquid cooling loop" in your rig. Also the cheapest. If I ever wanted to go liquid, I'd go custom so I can drain etc etc.
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  8. #3148
    Brewmaster Majesticii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tetrisGOAT View Post
    More surface area = better, regardless
    More surface area = takes up more space
    Except you forget that in order to dissipate heat, the closed loop as a few extra thermal resistances.
    Close loop: CPU -> CPU Block -> Liquid -> Heatsink heatpipes -> Fins -> Air
    Brick cooler: CPU -> Heatsink heatpipes -> Fins -> Air.

    That's why i was implying with "inefficient".

  9. #3149
    Quote Originally Posted by Majesticii View Post
    Except you forget that in order to dissipate heat, the closed loop as a few extra thermal resistances.
    Close loop: CPU -> CPU Block -> Liquid -> Heatsink heatpipes -> Fins -> Air
    Brick cooler: CPU -> Heatsink heatpipes -> Fins -> Air.

    That's why i was implying with "inefficient".
    IIRC, it will even out with temperatues so that these resistances arent a problem. Rather it takes a bit longer for the closed loop to adjust to a new temperature.
    Last edited by Martinussen; 2013-02-14 at 09:32 PM.
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  10. #3150
    Brewmaster Majesticii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Catanowplx View Post
    IIRC, it will even out with temperatues so that these resistances arent a problem. Rather it takes a bit longer for the closed loop to adjust to a new temperature.
    Aye, the thermal resistances largely only influence the RC-time which creates a more spiky temperature for the CPU, and slow cooling behaviour. Added though, water has a lower thermal conductivity, and thus creating a more difficult heat transfer. Meaning the necessity of an active pump, and more airflow required.
    I'd guarantee that given the same surface area of the heatsink, and applied fan, the temperature of a direct contact heatsink will be lower when compared to a closed loop. Combined with the fact they're usually twice as expensive... i really dont get it :P

  11. #3151
    I am Murloc! Xuvial's Avatar
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    @Majesticii, do you have any solid numbers/evidence/benches to back up any of the stuff you have said so far about CLC coolers? And no hand-picking benches, lets see a trend. Obviously all PC builders who dare recommend CLC coolers must be retards, but perhaps there is more to it?

    @Deltrus, I recommend not being a sheep and hopping onto the hate bandwagon so quickly until the guy presents some actual numbers to back up his claims
    Last edited by Xuvial; 2013-02-14 at 09:58 PM.

  12. #3152
    i really dont get it :P
    The low temps will be slightly higher than an air cooler and the high temps will be (slightly) lower than an air cooler.

    Mostly water cooling is for silence, or for aesthetics.
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  13. #3153
    i said earlier why i like my H100 over my havik 140.

    Its more silent.
    It has cooler temps under load.
    It takes up less space in my case allowing me to go 4x memory stick instead of only 2, and i can go SLI with two graphics cards, which i wouldn't be able to either.
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  14. #3154
    Pit Lord Ghâzh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Majesticii View Post
    Except you forget that in order to dissipate heat, the closed loop as a few extra thermal resistances.
    Close loop: CPU -> CPU Block -> Liquid -> Heatsink heatpipes -> Fins -> Air
    Brick cooler: CPU -> Heatsink heatpipes -> Fins -> Air.

    That's why i was implying with "inefficient".
    But that's not really correct either.
    Close loop: CPU -> CPU Block -> Liquid -> Pipes -> Fins -> Air
    Brick cooler: CPU -> CPU Block -> Air -> Heatsink heatpipes -> Fins -> Air.

    CPU Block is just the surface in contact with the CPU and it transfers the heat to the water or air (that's inside those heatpipes). Both air and liquid coolers have them. There's also no "heatpipes" inside radiators. Only pipes that are filled with the liquid and the fins are really just connected to the pipes so it's really just one structure. You also have to account for water being better at transforming heat compared to air. Also the liquid inside the tubes counts as an added surface area relative to the air coolers.

    To put it really simple, liquid coolers are just like air coolers but instead of air in the heatpipes they have liquid in the tubes. Because air is so inefficient in itself those heatpipes must be as short as possible whereas with liquid the length of the tubes can be longer and you can relocate the place of the heat dissipation better.

  15. #3155
    Brewmaster Majesticii's Avatar
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    How can something that requires more fan CFM and a pump be a better option for silence ...

    @Ghâzh
    The CPU block on the closed loop is disconnected from the heatsink by water.
    For a brick these are connected. That´s why it´s seperate, and not incorrect as you say.

    This is also the reasoning behind the "DirectCU" by asus. This removes the heattransfer from the base to the heatpipes, and just does it directly.

    Brick: CPU->Pipes/Heatsink->Fins->Air.

    Only thing i can understand to use it, is the convenience of placing the heatsink away from the CPU. But you see people with HAF cases, or other large gaming rigs that can easily place a brick cooler and cut 50 euro of the price...
    Last edited by Majesticii; 2013-02-14 at 10:14 PM.

  16. #3156
    Quote Originally Posted by Majesticii View Post
    Only thing i can understand to use it, is the convenience of placing the heatsink away from the CPU. But you see people with HAF cases, or other large gaming rigs that can easily place a brick cooler and cut 50 euro of the price...
    It is mostly due to the associated "coolness" and the myth that liquid cooler are quiet, when that actually only goes for proper custom loops.
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  17. #3157
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    Fans are fans. Apart from air noise bouncing off of heatpipes, I don't see how they would differ, noisewise. You use roughly the same fans for both kinds, and with air coolers you have them further from the leaky parts of your computer; I'd say they produce less noise because of it, especially in a soundblocking case such as my own.
    Pump.

    Then again, more surface area + more fans on less RPM = less noise. Which is why multi-fan radiators are so efficient, noisewise.
    And to me, noise is what matters.

  18. #3158
    Pit Lord Ghâzh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Majesticii View Post
    @Ghâzh
    The CPU block on the closed loop is disconnected from the heatsink by water.
    For a brick these are connected. That´s why it´s seperate, and not incorrect as you say.
    Depends how you look at it. I'd rather say the CPU block and the radiator are connected by water, it's not disconnection if it's used to connect the two points now is it?

    If we used your logic, air coolers had the same disconnection between the base and the heatpipes. You can't just remove it no matter what DirectCU marketing claims. You can reduce and make it as small as possible but there's still transfer from one material to the other. The base that is in contact with the CPU surface is some metal like copper. From there the heat moves inside the heatpipes and vaporizes in to gas / air and moves trough the pipes. Basically just like the water inside the tubes in liquid coolers.

    I hope you also realize we are arguing apples and oranges here. It's not a matter of how many thermal resistances we have inside the loop but how much they each resist. Even if liquid cooler had more, it would still be a more efficient system when you can increase the surface area a lot more compared to air cooler because water conducts heat better than air. There's only so much you can do with air cooler when at some point increasing your surface area isn't going to help anymore because the heat doesn't get transferred anymore.

    Why liquid cooling can be more quiet compared to air is because you can run the fans a lot slower due to better surface area which is the result of water being able to spread the heat much wider.

  19. #3159
    Something which is kinda the "bottleneck" of AIO closed loops is that the pump is generating extra heat on the cpu hence why they have to be powered from sata/molex and that's reason why Swiftech's H220 pump is being powered by the motherboard because this pump is only 6W at full rpm. A MB only has like 1A shared over all fan headers or each header has 1A.

  20. #3160
    Immortal Evil Inside's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Majesticii View Post
    Not sure why everyone is so hung-up on these closed loop coolers. Just get a decent air-cooler. Like Noctua or Dark Rock Pro 2.
    They are, in regard to aircoolers, terribly inefficient and have to use more CFM to get the same performance. And have to use a pump to circulate, creating more noise. I really really don't get it.

    Even my modest (50-60 euro) BeQuiet Dark Rock Advanced C1 keeps my 4.2ghz i5-760 below 70.
    I've got a H100 and it's quieter than my old air cooler, used to have a noctua D14, I get awesome temps with less noise = win for me. The only things that are remotely loud are my graphics cards.
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