1. #1521
    It's a very nice trinket. Agility and crit are both wonderful stats for reducing the damage we take. That said, since crit is kind of an indirect method of reducing damage (it builds more EB stacks which are then used to reduce damage via a dodge buff), having it as an 'on-use' doesn't work as well as, say, a direct dodge or parry cooldown for a plate tank.

    So what you could do is macro the trinket into your Jab, which will then ensure it's used ASAP, every time it comes off cooldown. This has the reduced benefit of sometimes being horribly mistimed (jabbing just as you get banished on Gara'jal, for example), but 9 times out of 10 this will work just fine.

    Alternatively you can just manage the trinket yourself manually. An extra thing to keep track of on a tank which already has a ton of stuff to watch, but less chance of it being wasted.

    Personal preference really. In short, yes the trinket is very nice.

  2. #1522
    Blademaster Genoqt's Avatar
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    Hey guys, one short question, which trinkets would u prefer for endgame heroic content? In my oppinion i will go for Lei Shi Heroic and The Agi Crit mentioned above.
    The Tsulong trinket is nice too, but i think this trinket is more likely for fights like empress hc.

  3. #1523
    Personal preference IMO (getting to sound like a broken record now...).

    Trinkets are two of the most inter-changeable item slots we have, I think. We should be changing them on a per-boss basis, depending on what we need. More stam? More agi? More crit? More mastery (lol)?

    Personally... I like a very steady and predictable resource income, so I would avoid anything with a haste proc (even if technically speaking, it's one of our best stats). On the other hand, we're still at that point where we can never get enough EB stacks, so crit procs are a very welcome idea for me. I'm concerned about what a double crit proc would be like, though! Could be a bit too much crit in that situation, haha.

    I'm not sure really. There's my thoughts on the above, at any rate. As a disclaimer, haste is still very good for us and getting a trinket with haste on is certainly not a bad idea: it's just my own personal preference for trinkets. I'd rather get static haste on our gear, then have procs of other stats.

  4. #1524
    what kind of specc would u use for beeing the off-tank at heroic will of emperor.

    i need a lot of damageoutput without getting vengeance. nearly have to kill him on my own... AND have to soak the sparks( every 50 sec. 750k magic damage ) (if u wonder, i need at least 500k life cause, i have to take the 3rd spark with my 25 % damage reduce cd + guard. otherwise i would die)

    any suggestions?

    crit meta ... etc. etc.



    PS: thats my character pre try: eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/kiljaeden/Screwlee/advanced
    Last edited by Screwlee; 2012-12-16 at 02:20 PM.

  5. #1525
    By off-tank, do you mean you're tanking adds (neither of the bosses), and soaking the sparks?

    As far as soaking sparks goes, I doubt you'll need to be Brewmaster spec. The three abilities that will help with soaking are available to all specs (Fortifying Brew, Diffuse Magic, and Zen Meditation), and Windwalker would even have an extra ability to help (Touch of Karma, assuming you can get a target for it). As for tanking adds though... I'm afraid I'm unsure of the sort of damage output they have. I've not done Heroic Will yet.

    You could try being Windwalker spec for it and seeing how that works out for you. Otherwise, one of your other tanks should probably do it when in DPS spec, if their DPS is important to getting the adds down. You should work pretty well on tanking the bosses and avoiding devastating combos anyway: roll is boss, and being able to save up EB stacks while dancing then using them all whilst regularly tanking helps so much in reducing the damage we take.

    But of course, I've not done heroic will yet, so I may be forgetting something.

  6. #1526
    Not sure what you mean by off tank either. Are you tanking the Strengths? If that's the case their damage is entirely avoidable if you stay out of energizing smash.

    When it comes to tanking that fight as brewmaster, I used my normal haste/crit build and did just fine.

  7. #1527
    yes. tanking the "strength". well i need brewmaster for holding the aggro, right ? ....

  8. #1528
    Quote Originally Posted by Screwlee View Post
    yes. tanking the "strength". well i need brewmaster for holding the aggro, right ? ....
    You still have taunt as WW. Should be enough, I'd imagine.

  9. #1529
    the trinket question is one of the biggest here besides the 15% or 7,5% expertise question.

    kisho pointed it out very well. a haste-on-use-trinket could be usefull when you know, there is a big wave of hits incoming and you have the chance to clear more stagger while building up shuffle f.e. or a mastery on-use to take more dmg but, for the most parts i like a stat on procc that gives me the possibility to stack something i can use later - like crit->EB.
    avoidance trinkets on procc are rather stupid, when you have some off-tank-time. (doesn't mean you can go afk). it really really really depents on the bosses, but for the most time, i have that agi procc trinkets, they are giving me all i need in every situation. but i would love to have the agi crit procc trinket (dropped yesterday, rogue took it)

  10. #1530
    Mechagnome Chuupag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by siccora View Post
    the trinket question is one of the biggest here besides the 15% or 7,5% expertise question.
    Exp hasn't been in question in a long time. 7.5 and 15 are basically just arbitrary numbers. Take what you feel comfortable with, that number could be 15, 12.37, 7.5, 6.02, or any other completely random number between 0 and 15.

    And with the way BrM stats work the best trinket is going to be an agility proc for the average fight. Crit/haste/mastery/avoidance procs aren't super useful for us. Avoidance on use are nice for certain fights. Like Kisho said just get a collection and switch per fight.
    Last edited by Chuupag; 2012-12-17 at 04:16 PM.

  11. #1531
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuupag View Post
    Crit/haste/mastery/avoidance procs aren't super useful for us.
    Terror in the Mists would like to have a word with you.

  12. #1532
    Mechagnome Chuupag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragethorn View Post
    Terror in the Mists would like to have a word with you.
    11.5% extra crit chance over 20 sec will give you on average 1 extra EB proc. Please note the phrase 'super useful' which implies they are moderately useful, but nothing game changing.

  13. #1533
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    Considering it's one of the two BiS trinkets, I'm not sure what to say to that. What other trinkets would you rank as "super useful"?

  14. #1534
    Mechagnome Chuupag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragethorn View Post
    Considering it's one of the two BiS trinkets, I'm not sure what to say to that. What other trinkets would you rank as "super useful"?
    It's BiS b/c the static agil, not the proc, which is what you were referring to when you quoted my first post.

  15. #1535
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    Yes, the Agi is great on it, but being that crit is the go to stat once a certain level of haste is reached, you can't deny that it's useful.

    I have the 483 version and when it procs, I'll see a string of EB stacks. I can't say that I find this trinket "moderately useful".

    My personal stat weights are 1.5 for agility, 0.9 for crit, for reference.

  16. #1536
    Quote Originally Posted by Ragethorn View Post
    Yes, the Agi is great on it, but being that crit is the go to stat once a certain level of haste is reached, you can't deny that it's useful.

    I have the 483 version and when it procs, I'll see a string of EB stacks. I can't say that I find this trinket "moderately useful".

    My personal stat weights are 1.5 for agility, 0.9 for crit, for reference.
    Nobody is saying it's not useful.

  17. #1537
    Mechagnome Chuupag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragethorn View Post
    Yes, the Agi is great on it, but being that crit is the go to stat once a certain level of haste is reached, you can't deny that it's useful.

    I have the 483 version and when it procs, I'll see a string of EB stacks. I can't say that I find this trinket "moderately useful".

    My personal stat weights are 1.5 for agility, 0.9 for crit, for reference.
    You are in Windwalker spec atm, so I can't use your exact numbers, so I'll just use some generalities.

    The 483 version that you have 1021 Agility and 6121 crit for 20 seconds on proc. The 1021 agility gives you 1.3% crit and .73% dodge. The 6121 crit gives you 10.2% crit. Using a 2-hander (and it doesn't matter if you are DW b/c the charges of EB will be almost exactly the same RNG permitting) you will have about 9 white attacks in that 20 second time frame. That gives you an estimated 'extra' crit of .918 and an estimated EB charge value of 2.75 per proc. So I'm dubious of your 'string of crits.'

    Terror has a 15% chance to proc and a 105 sec ICD. The crit you gain from the static agility will give you the same amount of charges of EB as the proc will after about 140 seconds or so, which given the ICD and the proc chance is almost spot on to it.

    TLDR: The static agility on Terror gives almost the exact same EB charges as the crit proc does.

    This shows why a crit proc isn't that great for us and static crit, whether from crit or agil, is far superior.

  18. #1538
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    Ok, I can see your point when you break it down like that. Would you say Xuen, upgraded twice, is a better option than the 496 Terror? What trinket is it that you find super useful?

  19. #1539
    Mechagnome Chuupag's Avatar
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    Xuen upgraded twice is worth about 1844 Agility thanks to someone who already did the math over at wowhead. IMO that is prob BiS even with a lower ilvl than the raid trinkets. Bottle will edge it out slightly if you reforge the mastery to haste/crit. Terror is below both since crit's weighted value is much lower than that of agility. If you are looking for trinkets for an average fight Xuen/Bottle is prob the best choice. Stam trinkets and avoidance trinkets have their place for different fights as well though.

    Remember with proc trinkets you really have 3 variables; the proc value itself, the internal cooldown, and the proc chance. The latter two can give you the maximum uptime from which you can estimate an expected uptime, which you then multiply by the proc value to get an equivalence factor. It's not perfect since so much of our mitigation is active and having a huge buff for only 20 seconds the RNG gods may smite you and it gives you zilcho. At best you may get super lucky and have several dodges/white crits in that time frame and you feel like a champ, at worst you had a bit more dps and threw out an extra statue guard.
    Last edited by Chuupag; 2012-12-17 at 10:44 PM.

  20. #1540
    Hello everybody,

    I have a simple question, but not so simple for me : What choice i can do between 2 config stuff ?

    first : the 4p tier (2 ilvl 496 & 2 ilvl 483)
    second : the 2tier (1ilvl 496 & 1 ilvl 483) but with the 2 other tier remplaced by a torso 496 & a pants 502 ?

    the SS I run, show me 190 856 damage avoided /s in 4p, and 189 071 in 2p and hs superior. I think the 4p is better, but clearly or not?

    In other word, the 4p, with 2 lfr tier, is better than 2p with hs superior ilvl?


    Sorry for my english

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