DK MoP Beta Class Changes

[Count Zero]

I think you folks might be missing the point, or at least a possible point that I am seeing; It would be impossible to make all three of these completely equal. Not only would it be impossible, it would be boring.

I think the point is to have a very very slightly higher theoretical performance for one that requires a high skillcap to reach the max benefit, and one that has a very very slightly lower theoretical max performance, but is easier to reach the max benefit of. People forget or just don't realize that the overwhelming majority of players of this game are not anywhere near hardcore enough for tiny differences in performance to matter. And even for the min/max-ers, not all of them have the skill to maximize, and very few will realize max potential if they go for the theoretically-best one.

Yes, it will be mathed out, and the super hardcore will pick what is theoretically best, but they would be doing that even if the theoretical difference were within the margin of error of rng / human performance. This trend is becoming apparent in multiple design decisions for several classes/specs, and I like it. My DK may be my primary alt, but it's still just an alt, and I'll never raid anywhere near as hardcore on it as I do on my main (not that I'm "hardcore"; I just mean relatively), but I do want to perform well, but I don't have the time to invest to be great, especially when being great would make me way over-qualified for the content I do on my alt(s).

Maybe to casual tanks but the serious raiders are all going to gravitate to what ever provides the greatest DS/min. Quite often I would use BT to quickly generate a rune for RT when WotN proc'd (I haven't checked is WotN still the same/in game?), so I personally never saw set increase to DS/min.

I like what Blizz is 'trying' to do with the talents but so far for the DK's you can look a the tree and pick out what 90% of players will pick per spec.

I think there is a flaw in allowing 3 rune abilities to be a tier of talents.

They have, and will continue to be, mathed out. There will be a best solution in the end scheme of things.

Though, I think different kinds of rune styles for each spec at least brings some unique-ness to them... I just worry that balancing them to be equal is a bit much.

[Vereesà]

So uhh... How broken exactly is Frost Strike on beta right now? I stumbled across this Korean Frost DK on WoL in ICC and his #1 source of damage seems to be Frost Strike, or at that's what I inferred after seeing this mmo4ever page.

[zox2]

So uhh... How broken exactly is Frost Strike on beta right now? I stumbled across this Korean Frost DK on WoL in ICC and his #1 source of damage seems to be Frost Strike, or at that's what I inferred after seeing this mmo4ever page.

2H frost has unlimited RP, so a mastery decked 2H can spam super-frost strikes.

[Vereesà]

2H frost has unlimited RP, so a mastery decked 2H can spam super-frost strikes.

If you google the spellIDs (55268 and 66962), mmo4ever will bring up two Frost Strikes; the mainhand strike and the offhand strike, so he's dual wield. I'm just interested to know how hard you guys on the beta are hitting with your Frost Strikes as dual wield with mastery reforges and such.

[Mionelol]

I'm not too sure what th eheck is wrong with this DK, but he's not even level 85. He's using level 80 trinkets and procs (strength of the taunka etc). My guess would be a very mastery oriented twink with cata items or something ;< 288k crits seems like insane. i'm not even getting close to that

---------- Post added 2012-04-14 at 06:22 PM ----------

Just tested on my 2nd DK who has access to a frost spec, and I'm getting ~80k crits by combining both hands on beta on my 85 DK, using two heroic souldrinkers and every possible proc (x10 stacks+ fallen crusader + pof). The dude is obviously getting some kind of bug or excessive amounts of mastery somehow : his Razorice is hitting for 2445, FF ticks for 8k+. something is just totally wrong there.

i wouldn't be surprised if there was a stat stacking bug in this beta build considering this log tbh, he seems to have not only excessive damage (10k+ melees? what?), but also excessive mastery, excessive crit (like 70% on melee???), etc.

[Vereesà]

I'm not too sure what th eheck is wrong with this DK, but he's not even level 85. He's using level 80 trinkets and procs (strength of the taunka etc). My guess would be a very mastery oriented twink with cata items or something ;< 288k crits seems like insane. i'm not even getting close to that

I didn't actually think of that, but would a level 80 really average 11.5k melee swings? (even taking into account the doubled weapon damage on weapons) I could see mastery potentially scaling stupendously at level 80, so that could explain the Frost Strikes partly anyway.

[Mionelol]

Tbh after looking more closely, all of them are level 80 - wouldn't surprise me if these guys found out some bug at level 80 to get excessive damage

---------- Post added 2012-04-14 at 06:55 PM ----------

for some reason marrowgar was afflicted by http://www.wowhead.com/spell=36482 , which is coming from the kael'thas weapons.

this is becoming more and more intriguing with every second

---------- Post added 2012-04-14 at 07:05 PM ----------

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/7f0zw...ls/5/?s=8&e=60 details for the "tank" (frost dk, lol)

he's taking 6k melees and 11k saber lashes when he's the only one taking damage from them

he also somehow managed to BLOCK a tick of bone storm

either something EXTREMELY weird is going on (i wanna knooooooow), or this is simply a fucked up or edited log

ok, now i'm like 100% sure it's a private server. the guys are gaining runic power from Revitalize.

[Vereesà]

A private server makes sense now that I come to think of it, since the spells that are listed on mmo4ever actually have ranks and since spells no longer have ranks, they aren't listed on wowhead. I guess it's just a 3.3 private server then.

[Bryntrollian]

I used to have a 80 warlock with about 55 mastery and the doomguard hit so hard it was insanity
( felt good out dpsing all the 85s in icc)

[joepesci]

There is some bug in MoP beta, today I met a "I one shot everything Warlock". Look at his HP.
/edit: it's WL specific, something with sacrifice demon...

[Pissedjedi]

I love these glyphs.

[Tfudge]

Just thought I would pop this here - it gives a look at the basic numbers a Frost DK can put out with standard use at 85 in current beta build.

I will be putting up more, comment and let me know what I'm doing wrong, ideas/suggestion/observations/etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_X0p...yTIUTMt1HJs%3D

[Leviatharan]

There is some bug in MoP beta, today I met a "I one shot everything Warlock". Look at his HP.
/edit: it's WL specific, something with sacrifice demon...

Gotta wonder if they would add a glyph for Unholy DKs that could serve as a sort of 'sacrifice minion' mechanic... Other than Death Pact, I mean, something that would increase our damage output dramatically for those who don't enjoy the pet management style.
Not that I care either way- I love the ghoul too much (if I wanted to drop it I'd just play Frost)- it just got me thinking.

[Beefkow]

Gotta wonder if they would add a glyph for Unholy DKs that could serve as a sort of 'sacrifice minion' mechanic... Other than Death Pact, I mean, something that would increase our damage output dramatically for those who don't enjoy the pet management style.
Not that I care either way- I love the ghoul too much (if I wanted to drop it I'd just play Frost)- it just got me thinking.

Speaking of ghouls... man wow i don't think ghouls are gonna hit as hard as they did in cata and their hp/defenses are just weak!

[Damyou]

Speaking of ghouls... man wow i don't think ghouls are gonna hit as hard as they did in cata and their hp/defenses are just weak!

With the loss of the ghoul glyph and the scaling up of unholy's strike damage, it would appear that blizz want pet's to be a much less significant portion of unholy DPS for MoP. As they have said countless times, going into 5.0 they want people to be doing as similar numbers to live as possible, even if the damage source %ages may be shifted slightly.

[Beefkow]

With the loss of the ghoul glyph and the scaling up of unholy's strike damage, it would appear that blizz want pet's to be a much less significant portion of unholy DPS for MoP. As they have said countless times, going into 5.0 they want people to be doing as similar numbers to live as possible, even if the damage source %ages may be shifted slightly.

I pray that unholys are gonna be similar to wotlk... pets are less reliable and gargoyles are a THREAT and that SS is actually a very benefical spell.

[Leviatharan]

By the by... any chance someone on the beta server can suggest the re-introduction of portals to Acherus...? Considering it's in the middle of bloody nowhere? <.< >.>

[zox2]

Anyone else has a problem with the buff time the BT stacks have? I feel they should work like holy power, and only diminish once outside combat, and not all at once. On a fight like Ragnaros, you would waste a lot of stacks I think, which greatly diminishes it's value.

[kilometer18]

either something EXTREMELY weird is going on (i wanna knooooooow), or this is simply a fucked up or edited log

ok, now i'm like 100% sure it's a private server. the guys are gaining runic power from Revitalize.

well one of their hunters in their 62-second 25H Saurfang kill was getting 500k chimera shot crits so I'm inclined to say not legit, lol

[Vereesà]

With the loss of the ghoul glyph and the scaling up of unholy's strike damage, it would appear that blizz want pet's to be a much less significant portion of unholy DPS for MoP. As they have said countless times, going into 5.0 they want people to be doing as similar numbers to live as possible, even if the damage source %ages may be shifted slightly.

I pray that unholys are gonna be similar to wotlk... pets are less reliable and gargoyles are a THREAT and that SS is actually a very benefical spell.

Are you sure they haven't just baked the glyph into the ghoul by default? I'd find it hard to believe our ghoul would just up and lose almost 60,000 health due to the loss of the glyph.