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  1. #1
    Zookeeper Sunfyre's Avatar
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    [MoP] Incarnation: Chosen of Elune buffed

    The tooltip according to the MMO-Champion main page:
    Shapeshift into Chosen of Elune Form, increasing Arcane and Nature damage you deal by 10% and doubling Solar and Lunar power generation. Also reduces all damage taken by 15%. Lasts 30 sec. You may freely shapeshift in and out of this form for its duration.
    Damage reduction included as well as a 10% damage boost.

    EDIT:

    Never mind, it looks like those additions are because Incarnation replaces Moonkin Form while it's active.
    Last edited by Sunfyre; 2012-03-27 at 10:44 AM.

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  2. #2
    Well, actually, I'm about 95% sure that that isn't actually a buff.


    That 10% damage increase and 15% damage reduction is just what you'd normally get for Moonkin form. Since, you know, Chosen of Elune is probably going to replace the Moonkin Form buff. In other words, you won't have the Moonkin Form buff and the Chosen of Elune buff at the same time, so you wouldn't be able to "double-dip" the bonuses from Moonkin and CoE forms.

  3. #3
    Sadface. Any possibility of a beta-confirmation? Though I'm inclined to agree with TiredTofu
    loljk

  4. #4
    Zookeeper Sunfyre's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TiredTofu View Post
    Well, actually, I'm about 95% sure that that isn't actually a buff.


    That 10% damage increase and 15% damage reduction is just what you'd normally get for Moonkin form. Since, you know, Chosen of Elune is probably going to replace the Moonkin Form buff. In other words, you won't have the Moonkin Form buff and the Chosen of Elune buff at the same time, so you wouldn't be able to "double-dip" the bonuses from Moonkin and CoE forms.
    Yeah, you're probably right. And it's a shame, because Incarnation falls way behind SotF when it comes to overall DPS.

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  5. #5
    Its a shame because many ppl thought it'd be some kind of new berserk or sumthing for Moonkins, but it turned out boring. Both Soul of the Forest and this incarnation is too PvE orientated, blizz should've at least given 1 more effect on top of them and not just eclipse energy gains AGAIN...
    IMO, I'd like to see Incarnation to at least provide an on-the-move DPS buff like making Wrath castable while moving or sumthing. It could be OP in PvP i dunno, but that'd be at least interesting....if not, maybe make all heals become castable in moonkin form for the duration or make it double Starfall's DMG. Well anything will be gd xD

    Afterall its an Improved form! Other ppl are supposed to see the difference it makes on the outside! If it just buffs eclipse energy, why not just name it 'Gift of Elune'? Why call it a 'Superior Shapeshifting Form'?? >.>
    Last edited by Skyte87; 2012-03-27 at 09:21 PM.

  6. #6
    Chosen replaces moonkin entirely for the duration, so no, those are just the normal MK buffs. The only effect of Incarnation is the doubled Eclipse energy.
    maybe make all heals become castable in moonkin form for the duration
    Pointless, we get that as a glyph already.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    Chosen replaces moonkin entirely for the duration, so no, those are just the normal MK buffs. The only effect of Incarnation is the doubled Eclipse energy.
    Exactly thats why i said: "Afterall its an Improved form! Other ppl are supposed to see the difference it makes on the outside! If it just buffs eclipse energy, why not just name it 'Gift of Elune'? Why call it a 'Superior Shapeshifting Form'??"

    Pointless, we get that as a glyph already.
    Not that pointless if it'd allow Lifebloom and Tranquility to be casted as well in Moonkin Form.

  8. #8
    The glyph does allow Tranquility. Balance doesn't get Lifebloom, so allowing it would be completely pointless.

  9. #9
    how does chosen of elune look like anyway?
    Warlorcs of Draenorc made me quit. You can't have my stuff.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael121 View Post
    Sadface. Any possibility of a beta-confirmation? Though I'm inclined to agree with TiredTofu
    As i said before, that's just the normal moonkin effects. Chosen of Elune does replace Moonkin for the duration of Incarnation.

    Aside from that, it looks like a normal moonkin(the mob, that is) with the same color scheme tauren Moonkin Form uses, including regular moonkin animations instead of the ogre animations the form has. It's also roughly twice the size you would normally be.

  11. #11
    [Chosen of elune] now doubles the energy you generate both IN and OUT of eclipse.
    This means that his bonus is void if used at 0 energy, here is a very raw 30sec dps cycle simulation.

    With 3k haste I have:
    • Wrath cast time = 1.5 sec while under the effect of Nature's Grace = 1.3 sec
    • Starsurge cast time = 1.5 sec while under the effect of Nature's Grace = 1.3 sec
    • Starfire cast time = 2.0 sec while under the effect of Nature's Grace = 1.8 sec
    • We no longer start with Nature's Grace because only eclipse procs it
    • Double Wrath generates 30 power while double Starfire and Starsurge generates 40.
    • Starsurge is casted every 10 sec assuming you have 4t13
    • Shooting Stars proc every 10 sec
    • Euphoria is not fixed and still not proc when you are above 60 power
    • Chosen of Elune lasts for 30 sec.

    Nukes values:
    Wrath = 15k normal 33k crit
    Starfire = 19k normal 41k crit
    Starsurge = 20k normal 43k crit
    Crit chance = 20%
    Eclipse bonus = 66% (17mastery) 24% base +20% total mastery +2.5% each point (9 mastery from gear)

    Here is a simulation of the damage done from 0 to whatever i can reach in 30 sec with and without CoE active.
    Code:
    Apply Moonfire no chosen of elune time consumed
    0 energy -> Chosen of Elune
    1.0 sec wasted by Chosen of Elune GCD
    1.5 sec Starsurge not eclipsed -> 40 power
    2.0 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 80 power
    2.0 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 100 power
    Nature's Grace proc 15 sec hasted casts
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Sunfire GCD
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 70 power
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 40 power
    1.0 sec wasted by ShootingS eclipsed -> 0 power
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 30 power
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 90 power (we can assume that with 25% proc from euphoria it's time for a spell to proc)
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 100 power
    Nature's Grace proc 15 sec hasted casts
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Starfall GCD
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Moonfire GCD (sunfire still has 13 sec remaining but both dots can be up at the same time)
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 40 power
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 80 power
    1.3 sec Starsurge eclipsed -> 10 power toward solar (cooldown ended)
    1.8 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 50 power
    1.0 sec wasted by ShootingS not eclipsed -> 90 power (2 dots-up means an SS every 5-6 sec, 10 passed since last)
    1.8 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 100 power (this time we were not lucky and didn't get an euphoria proc)
    Nature's Grace proc 15 sec hasted casts
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Sunfire GCD (moonfire still has 14 sec remaining but both dots can be up at the same time)
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 70 power
    1.0 sec wasted by ShootingS not eclipsed -> 30power (we have 2 dots rolling we get a SS every 5-6 sec)
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 0 power
    31.1 sec have passed -> Chosen of Elune ended during the last Wrath
    Now without the Chosen of Elune buff:
    Code:
    0 energy -> No Chosen of elune
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Moonfire GCD (We apply it because even if it's not eclipsed it's does not waste CoE)
    1.5 sec Starsurge not eclipsed -> 20 power
    2.0 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 40 power
    2.0 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 80 power (we were lucky with euphoria)
    2.0 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 100 power
    Nature's Grace proc 15 sec hasted casts
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Sunfire GCD (moonfire still has 10 sec remaining but both dots can be up at the same time)
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 85 power (from beta video it seems that wrath generates 15 power)
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 70 power
    1.3 sec Starsurge eclipsed -> 50 power (haha! damned SS we managed to cast it one sec before the proc)
    1.0 sec wasted by ShootingS eclipsed -> 30 power (more than 10 sec dots uptime)
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 15 power
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 0 power
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 15 power
    1.0 sec wasted by ShootingS not eclipsed -> 35 power (2 dots-up means an SS every 5-6 sec) Moonfire ends
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 65 power (we can assume that with 25% proc from euphoria it's time for a spell to proc)
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 80 power
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 95 power Nature's Grace ends
    1.5 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 100 power
    Nature's Grace proc 15 sec hasted casts
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Starfall GCD
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Moonfire GCD (sunfire still has 14 sec remaining but both dots can be up at the same time)
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 80 power
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 60 power
    1.0 sec wasted by ShootingS eclipsed -> 30 power (10 sec dots uptime and 4 sec double dot uptime)
    If we were lucky with Starsurge cooldown and Proc we could cast 2 Starsurge here but we don't care time is up
    31.3 sec have passed
    CoE active and to Lunar eclipse first:
    Code:
    Apply Moonfire no chosen of elune time consumed
    0 energy -> Chosen of Elune
    1.0 sec wasted by Chosen of Elune GCD
    1.5 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 30 power
    1.5 sec Starsurge not eclipsed -> 70 power
    1.5 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 100 power
    Nature's Grace proc 15 sec hasted casts
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Starfall GCD
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Moonfire GCD
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 40 power
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 80 power
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 20 power toward solar
    -- Let me insert an euphoria proc here because otherwise it never proc because we reach 60
    1.3 sec Starsurge not eclipsed -> 100 power toward solar (cooldown ended) woot lucky!
    Nature's Grace proc 15 sec hasted casts
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Sunfire GCD (moonfire still has 15 sec remaining but both dots can be up at the same time)
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 70 power
    1.3 sec Wrath eclipsed -> 40 power
    1.0 sec wasted by ShootingS eclipsed -> 0 power (2 dots-up means an SS every 5-6 sec)
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 30 power
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 60 power (no euphoria this time we used all our luck the previous proc)
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 90 power
    1.3 sec Wrath not eclipsed -> 100 power
    Nature's Grace proc 15 sec hasted casts
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Starfall GCD
    1.0 sec wasted by Apply Moonfire GCD (sunfire still has 13 sec remaining but both dots can be up at the same time)
    1.0 sec wasted by ShootingS eclipsed -> 60 power (2 dots-up means an SS every 5-6 sec) compensation for euphoria bad luck?
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 20 power
    1.8 sec Starfire eclipsed -> 20 power toward solar
    1.8 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 60 power 
    1.8 sec Starfire not eclipsed -> 100 power
    31.6 sec have passed -> Chosen of Elune ended during the last Starfire
    With Chosen of Elune:
    Wrath: 3 -> 45.000
    Wrath Eclipsed: 4 -> 99.600
    Starfire: 3 -> 57.000
    Starfire Eclipsed: 2 -> 63.080
    Starsurge: 3 -> 60.000
    Starsurge Eclipsed: 3 -> 99.600
    Total = 424.280 + 20% = 509.136 damages in 30 seconds

    Without Chosen of Elune
    Wrath: 5 -> 75.000
    Wrath Eclipsed: 4 -> 99.600
    Starfire: 3 -> 57.000
    Starfire Eclipsed: 2 -> 63.080
    Starsurge: 2 -> 30.000
    Starsurge Eclipsed: 3 -> 99.600
    Total = 424.280 + 20% = 509.136 damages in 30 seconds

    With Chosen of Elune to Lunar first:
    Wrath: 6 -> 90.000
    Wrath Eclipsed: 2 -> 49.800
    Starfire: 2 -> 38.000
    Starfire Eclipsed: 5 -> 157.700
    Starsurge: 2 -> 40.000
    Starsurge Eclipsed: 2 -> 66.400
    Total = 441.900 + 20% = 530.280 damages in 30 seconds

    So if you use it at 0 Eclipse Power it does exactly nothing?
    If you use it going toward Lunar and are lucky you can do 30k more damages...really ? :|
    Let me know if my math was wrong but I think this talent, even if used at the start of an eclipse sucks badly and might add 3-4 eclipsed nukes every 3 min.
    If they change it back to double the energy only while outside eclipse the result is the same because we lose Nature's Grace uptime.
    This talent definately need a +dmg% modifier.
    Last edited by Meldon; 2012-03-28 at 11:08 AM.

  12. #12
    Now do the same, but go to Lunar first. That's a better idea from 0 energy anyway, as 2 Wraths + 1 Starsurge = 100 energy exactly with Chosen.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by huth View Post
    Now do the same, but go to Lunar first. That's a better idea from 0 energy anyway, as 2 Wraths + 1 Starsurge = 100 energy exactly with Chosen.
    Added it...it gives 30k more damages..i really really hope I'm wrong and someone can find a flaw in the rotation used or the cast times
    If not... well that's another talent to add in the discard pile with:

    Heart of the Wild, Mass Entanglement, Dream of Cenarius (clunky), Disentanglement (root breaking should be baseline or not in the tier6 row)
    Last edited by Meldon; 2012-03-28 at 02:06 AM.

  14. #14
    Yeah, it's quite disappointing so far, we aren't getting anything (and we're in fact losing our balance specialization bonus of 15% arcane/nature damage). I wish Blizzard receives ludicrous amounts of QQ and changes its mind.

    Dot like there's no tomorrow.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by checking facts View Post
    how does chosen of elune look like anyway?
    Last time I tried it out (a few days ago now) it was just a bigger moonkin model. That's probably placeholder for now.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Nephyron View Post
    Added it...it gives 30k more damages..i really really hope I'm wrong and someone can find a flaw in the rotation used or the cast times
    If not... well that's another talent to add in the discard pile with:

    Heart of the Wild, Mass Entanglement, Dream of Cenarius (clunky), Disentanglement (root breaking should be baseline or not in the tier6 row)
    So that 2. Starfall you're getting does no damage?

  17. #17
    @huth:
    You get only 1 extra starfall not 2 and in a boss fight you get only 10 out of 20 stars if there's only one target.
    The increased double dot uptime barely gives you an extra chance to proc a SS (because the proc with 2 dots happens about every 5 sec and CoE gives 4 extra sec uptime).
    For a 3 min CD / 30 sec duration having a starsurge and 3 stars hits (in the 30 sec timeframe) is a very very low and negligible bonus. I could proc 2 extra spells with DTR and have a better bonus that this 3min "burst" CD.
    Remember that it is supposed to be a burst CD (it's a burst for the other specs) and actually it is not because it's not affecting our nukes.

    To fix the talent and increase our dmg with something more than an extra starsurge per eclipse they should change the eclipse power generated while in an eclipsed state to make the eclipse last longer.
    That would reduce NG and CoE uptime.
    They could increase CoE duration, but that would make the cooldown too strong for the other specs.

    The final solution for this talent is to give it a +X% Mastery bonus effectively increasing our eclipsed nukes dmg.

    Compared to his 2 brothers: Soul of the forest would always be better than CoE and Force of nature could be better in heavy movement fights. I thought they wanted to give us "hard choices"
    Last edited by Meldon; 2012-03-28 at 10:56 AM.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Nephyron View Post
    Chosen of elune doubles the energy you generate both IN and OUT of eclipse.
    Idk how it looks on the beta but I swear the tooltip is "HALVES Lunar and Solar Power generation while in Eclipse and DOUBLES it while not in Eclipse."
    So if its not doing that its most likely a bug
    Soul of the Forest still looks better regardless though

    To be honest Im more curious how Celestial Alignment works exactly

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Jibjabb View Post
    Idk how it looks on the beta but I swear the tooltip is "HALVES Lunar and Solar Power generation while in Eclipse and DOUBLES it while not in Eclipse."
    So if its not doing that its most likely a bug
    Soul of the Forest still looks better regardless though

    To be honest Im more curious how Celestial Alignment works exactly
    [Chosen of elune] has been changed, it doubles the eclipse power both in and out on the eclipse.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYzkI...layer_embedded
    Last edited by Meldon; 2012-03-28 at 11:08 AM.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Nephyron View Post
    @huth:
    You get only 1 extra starfall not 2 and in a boss fight you get only 10 out of 20 stars if there's only one target.
    The increased double dot uptime barely gives you an extra chance to proc a SS (because the proc with 2 dots happens about every 5 sec and CoE gives 4 extra sec uptime).
    For a 3 min CD / 30 sec duration having a starsurge and 3 stars hits (in the 30 sec timeframe) is a very very low and negligible bonus. I could proc 2 extra spells with DTR and have a better bonus that this 3min "burst" CD.
    Remember that it is supposed to be a burst CD (it's a burst for the other specs) and actually it is not because it's not affecting our nukes.

    To fix the talent and increase our dmg with something more than an extra starsurge per eclipse they should change the eclipse power generated while in an eclipsed state to make the eclipse last longer.
    That would reduce NG and CoE uptime.
    They could increase CoE duration, but that would make the cooldown too strong for the other specs.

    The final solution for this talent is to give it a +X% Mastery bonus effectively increasing our eclipsed nukes dmg.

    Compared to his 2 brothers: Soul of the forest would always be better than CoE and Force of nature could be better in heavy movement fights. I thought they wanted to give us "hard choices"
    Second. Not 2. I didn't put that period there for no reason. Also, it's not 3 stars extra, it's having Starfall back up earlier. Incarnation basically doubles the effect of haste on our DoT uptime and Starfall CD for the duration. Some of those effects persist for a while after Incarnation ends.

    Still, i doubt it's going to stay like that for long, since even in the best case, the gain is rather small. I've been thinking about other changes, like removing the Starsurge CD or it making Eclipse last till you hit the next one, but haven't found anything i'd really like yet.


    On a sidenote, it's kinda funny that Inc turns out to be the weakest of the bunch, when before beta "everybody" was beating down on FoN.

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