[MoP] Misc Demonology Notes

[OOMM]

I've seen those versions of MC speed and fury, but never seen anything other than 60f gained in the log. My experience has been that bugs come and go at random in this patch, so they very well could be giving different fury amounts but just not when I was looking. And has anyone else gotten the instant Soul Fire yet?

I'm not worried about bugs like that though. But I hope the next patch shows better ideas than what we've been told and seen for ourselves so far.

[deviantcultist]

I believe that most of the bugs/flaws that are mentioned will change on time, however I am worried about whether we will be able to use sacrifice effectively as demo or not. It would be a shame to exclude this talent from this spec.

[OOMM]

All of this is from the db, I'm not in the live beta yet.

Looks like base damage on Hellfire/ImmoAura, HoG, BoG, Shadowflame, Carrion Swarm, Demonic Slash, Corruption, Doom, Void Ray (formerly Twilight Ray), Fel Flame all were increased by roughly 10-20%.

Fel Flames spell coef went up. Soul Fire's coef went down. Shadow Bolt's coef and base went down.

Shadow Bolt's cast time reduced to 1.7s.

Soul Fire's mana (not fury) cost reduced slightly.

HoG Shadowflame generates 2 fury per tick.

Touch of Chaos: Your melee attacks become long ranged, deal Shadow damage and extend the duration of Corruption.

Demonic Slash seems to cost 40f

Hellfire might be replaced by Immolation Aura. This could just be me not searching correctly! Looks like we use Rain of Fire now?

That's all the damage spells I've looked at so far. I'll research buffs/cd's next.

---------- Post added 2012-04-25 at 01:04 AM ----------

Molten Core: When Shadowflame or a Wild Imp deals damage you have a 5% chance to trigger Molten Core.

Grimoire of Sacrifice: You sacrifice your demon to increase the power of your direct damage spells by 15% and regenerate 2% of maximum health every 5 sec. Lasts for 15 min. This effect is doubled for the first 15 sec. Summoning another demon cancels the effect. $?W5>0[Damage dealt by Malefic Grasp and Fel Flame increased by 60%.][]$?W6>0[Single target damage dealt increased by 30%.][]$?W7>0[Immolate, Incinerate, Conflagrate and Fel Flame damage increased by 30%.][]

Glyph of Dark Soul: While off cooldown, your Dark Soul ability passively grants you 10% of the active effect, but reduces the power of Dark Soul by 10%.

Dark Souls do 3% when glyphed and off cd. No passive if unglyphed.

Doomguard has a sweet new icon.
Doomguard's bolt has an execute now.
Doom Bolt 35 Energy 30 yd range 1.7 sec cast
Sends a shadowy bolt at the enemy, causing (1,288 + 180.0% of SP) Shadow damage. Deals 20% additional damage to targets below 20% health.

Glyph of Chaotic Energy: You drain energy directly from the twisting nether. Your mana regenerates 650% faster and your spell haste also increases your mana regeneration.
Glyph of Hand of Gul'dan: Your Hand of Gul'dan can now be targetted at a location.
Glyph of Imp Swarm: Teaches you the ability Imp Swarm. Requires Demonology.
Glyph of Verdant Spheres: Your Soul Shards are transformed into Verdant Spheres.

http://www.wowheadnews.com/blog=2029...ities-and-more
More info here under the warlock section. edit: and now MMO's main post.

[MrMarique]

Metamorphosis now prevents us from casting Hand of Guldan when in demonform, does this mean that we will have to use Breath of Guldan?

Melee Meta is back again?

[OOMM]

Soul Leech - Now also heals your pet.
This might be an indirect buff to Soul Link too.

Master Demonologist - Increases the damage you deal in caster form by 0.00%.
No mention of 500 fury level buff. This could rework the rotation by a bit.

Glyph of Hand of Gul'dan. Your Hand of Gul'dan can now be targetted at a location.
This appears to trigger no GCD and might be a dps increase to use. (This could be referring to the glyph and not the spell.) Would be an awkward dps increase. I doubt this is the case but I'm making a note of it so we can check in game.

[OOMM]

Testing in game now:

Corruption gives 6f per tick.
Doom gives no fury. Tooltip says 30f per tick though.
Shadow Bolt is still 2.5s cast.
Molten Core doesn't increase Soul Fire's fury return. SF gives 40f in caster form.
Wild Imps' Demonic Calling buff time scales with haste.
Hellfire is gone. We have Rain of Fire now.
Immolation Aura seems to be the same.
Breath of Gul'dan is gone.
Hand of Gul'dan hits the target like it does on live. Instant cast now though.
HoG graphic stays around forever. Use it glyphed to create a permanent firework show in town.
Glyph of Life Tap absorbs 25k healing (I have 171k hp on my level 87 warlock.)
Pets give half of their previous fury. 8-12f, depending on pet.
Touch of Chaos does not give fury and is still melee range only. It does about 1k damage and refreshes Corruption.
Mastery gives bonus damage unrelated to current fury level.
Mastery tooltip formula seems to be simplified and smaller. Casterform =mastery*0.667, Meta = mastery*2. Tooltips on the form itself seems to be the old one still. Will have to determine what is really happening.
Grimoire of Sacrifice doesn't kill pet.
Soul Harvest is passive, just being out of combat heals you and your pet.
Glyphing Wild Imps puts the spell in the general tab and makes it usable. Costs 150f. Unglyphing may be bugged and Imps may not come back out.

---------- Post added 2012-04-25 at 06:08 AM ----------

So... Are we going to be in demon form for 100% of fights? I'm seriously confused by the wording in some of the tooltips...

No, you will be in Demon form for about 25-35 seconds if you get to 1000f before entering and then spend about 60s building back up. More testing needs to be done to determine timing and rotation though.

DA's Demonic Slash gives 60f.

[Deleted]

I have a question about "Dark Apotheosis": How much damage reduction do we actually get? And which of the % damage bonus do we lose?
They changed the glyph so much, that i don't know the actual state and i can't test it by myself

[Marximos]

Doomguard seems to be a 6min cd now. Tooltip in the db says 10m still though.

You're still wearing the T13 2p, that could be a reason for the 6mins if you are, because the tooltip without the bonus is still 10 mins.

[OOMM]

You're still wearing the T13 2p, that could be a reason for the 6mins if you are, because the tooltip without the bonus is still 10 mins.

You are right. I took it off to test, but actually put it back on again by the time I actually did the test. It is still 10 minutes.

[Jessicka]

Glyph of Imp Swarm: COST 150 DF !! WTFH

Demonic slash have been NERF and by nerf it's... Oo

Meta rota is... I don't even know now, Meta seems is big dps loss.

So in meta soulfire with MC. 4 Max... but demonic slash is so low..... without mc procs I don't even understand what we are supposed to do in meta. Seems broken.

Glyph of Imp Swarm is just the 'On Use' effect of the last build, the cost is the same and results in a net gain of Fury; there's no problem with that - it's what a Glyph should do in terms of adding some flexibility to the spec. The new Glyph of Dark Soul is much the same, but to be honest I think they have that working backwards like Carrion Swarm; those effects should be baseline and have the Glyphs add the utility of the bigger cooldown and knockback respectively.

The Caster rotation is starting to look more solid, we're tracking 2 DoTs again with a filler, proc and execute; I'd like to see another 12-18s cooldown short cast time (about 1.5s) spell though to get that mix back; and I'd like MC to have a couple of charges at least, so it's not feeling like a poor man's Hot Streak.

Meta as you say needs more work; it's more like 'mobility stance' than 'big moment' at the moment. The difficulty is going to be to have it feel different to caster form, while still having a smooth transition in and out (I mean, dropping stance to refresh DoTs, WTF?!)

[Deleted]

I have a question about "Dark Apotheosis": How much damage reduction do we actually get? And which of the % damage bonus do we lose?
They changed the glyph so much, that i don't know the actual state and i can't test it by myself

Only tested the new build a few mins this morning, DA's reduction scaling seems to be the same as last build, ie 10% physical damage reduction + 1% per 2.5 mastery. So using Dark Soul - Knowledge for example only grants 12% more physical damage reduction. If it's the same as last build we don't get any magical damage reduction through it. Dunno about the other part.

[Jessicka]

"" No mention of 500 fury level buff. This could rework the rotation by a bit. """ from OOMM #133

This.

Soulfire have been adjusted. In the last build. It was more powerful is caster form, it seems they only reversed le coefficient between Meta and caster stances. Not even sure if the DPET of DSlash of superior to a human SB. Clearly not a 10 % increased. (See Drain Soul twisting being gone from Affliction).

Corruption / Doom and ?

Shadowflame (through HoG) and Corruption. I'm not bothered by numbers at the moment, they're basically meaningless since they can adjust them to make the spec play how they want to play at a whim.

The anomaly between Meta and Caster is basically because they haven't really touched Meta yet - the fact Touch of Chaos is still there, along with a spammable instant ranged attack, however nerfed but still does decent damage, is just untenable, especially for PvP. Nor is the problem of stance dancing out of Meta to reapply DoTs and re-ramp up of DoTs prior to popping Meta tackled - there just isn't the necessary smooth transition. Corruption and Shadowflame would need to be very weak, and whatever attack Meta ends up with exceptionally strong to have a higher DPET, and make up for the Fury generation to make them worth casting over the DoTs.

[Deleted]

It's a dot effect yes, but not something to keep permanently on the target, only because, you can't.

[Deleted]

Only tested the new build a few mins this morning, DA's reduction scaling seems to be the same as last build, ie 10% physical damage reduction + 1% per 2.5 mastery. So using Dark Soul - Knowledge for example only grants 12% more physical damage reduction. If it's the same as last build we don't get any magical damage reduction through it. Dunno about the other part.

thank you for the accurate information

[deviantcultist]

Demo using rain of fire...? Seriously? I hope that changes real soon along with some of the newest changes for demo.

[huth]

Soul Harvest is passive, just being out of combat heals you and your pet.

It also counts as a heal cast on yourself every second. Which means it can proc stuff. Like Power Torrent or the WoE trinket.

It starts getting a tad annoying after a while.

[wholol]

Do they even know where they're heading anymore? ... it just seems like random shit happening all together.
woohoo reticules , dots-nowait melee nvm ranged orrr ...>.>

[Jessicka]

Do they even know where they're heading anymore? ... it just seems like random shit happening all together.
woohoo reticules , dots-nowait melee nvm ranged orrr ...>.>

I think they know where they want to go with Caster form, but Meta, not sure. With the stated aim of moving away from melee range with it, they're looking at having to completely rebuild the rotation within it. The problem is, changing the rotation means the transition wont necessarily be smooth and you either spend globals before, or on entering, and on leaving Meta setting up your rotation again - that's just unnecessarily awkward, and doubtless a DPS loss. Obviously they've also stopped us from casting DoTs in Meta to prevent us jumping into Meta to maintain them, but instead, now we need to drop out of Meta to maintain them; or else the DPET of Slash needs to be so rediculously high as to be more valuable than maintaining the DoTs; aside from the fact that it really isn't, the consequences of having such a high DPET spell would break PvP, and mean you'd want to be in Meta for your entire Fury pool thus breaking the entire concept.

Because of all that, attempting to theorycraft around the present Beta build is madness. It simply cannot go live as anything even close to resembling what it is, if only because it is so impossibly broken for it's damage and mobility in PvP.

[Torq]

I'd have to beg to differ. I wouldn't actually mind having two distinct rotations within one spec. Kinda brings out the whole "Demon Form" side of the thing; after all, if you turn into something akin to a demon, you're probably more likely to fight like one. The implication being, of course, that the fighting style would be different than your normal one.

The idea behind having your auto-attack maintain your DoT (we only have one now, right? :P) removes the problem of keeping it up while you hop into demo form and nuke away, and then you really don't have to spend much while dropping in and out of the form.

If they do keep meta/non-meta as different rotations, it plays really well into a build-dump-build-dump rotation.

[Jessicka]

I'd have to beg to differ. I wouldn't actually mind having two distinct rotations within one spec. Kinda brings out the whole "Demon Form" side of the thing; after all, if you turn into something akin to a demon, you're probably more likely to fight like one. The implication being, of course, that the fighting style would be different than your normal one.

The idea behind having your auto-attack maintain your DoT (we only have one now, right? :P) removes the problem of keeping it up while you hop into demo form and nuke away, and then you really don't have to spend much while dropping in and out of the form.

If they do keep meta/non-meta as different rotations, it plays really well into a build-dump-build-dump rotation.

I'm not saying it can't be different, I'm saying that it's difficult to make it different, but maintain a smooth transition that doesn't feel like you need to have a whole new ramp up with every stance change, or end up dancing with stances to maintain DoTs from either rotation. Refreshing Corruption and Shadowflame while in Meta is necessary right now as it's a DPS loss not to do so; we need the damage, Fury and MC procs. Having them refreshed automatically by autoattacks isn't exactly compelling play (and presently keeps us stuck in melee, where they don't want us to be), and the what is left is just spamming those same filler nukes, we just spam the main one harder. Meta right now feels horribly broken, because it is.