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  1. #1
    The Patient OOMM's Avatar
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    [MoP] Demonology

    Working on updates for May 8 patch still.
    Updated for April 25th patch.


    I wanted to put some info out there that I hadn't seen talked about much yet.
    -My notes conclusions are in italics, these are basically just predictions and gut reactions to very limited data about how a max-dps pve rotation/priority might be built. Also please correct or test further any information here and I'll try to update it.

    Proposed rotation/priority My current (this changes everytime I can think of an improvement) one would be to use cooldowns as soon as possible and enter/leave meta based around HoG uptime when up to 500f. I'm not sure that this is the absolute best priority for dps for this patch, but since the spec is broken in some ways I haven't worked on it too hard. Once it seems more finalized I will completely optimize it.

    Use Felguard
    Dark Soul: Knowledge
    Grimoire: Imp, if DS:K is up or if it will take you 1m or more to get into Meta and use other CDs.
    Doomguard, if DS:K is up
    Imp Swarm, if DS:K is up

    Hand of Gul'dan, drop Meta for this. (Don't use Chaos Wave (Meta's version of HoG) unless you need burst.
    Corruption
    Metamorphosis, if over ~500 fury, can stay in Meta down to 0f if you will be ending the fight by that point.
    Doom, if the fight will last long enough for two ticks.
    Caster form, if under ~40 fury
    Soul Fire, if Molten Core is up.
    Demonic Slash
    Shadowbolt
    Life Tap, if under 20% mana.

    Glyphs Demonology might use for PVE, bolded green ones give dps increases potentially:
    -Major
    Imp Swarm: Summons 5 Wild Imps and disables Demonic Calling if Imp Swarm is on cd.
    Dark Soul: Gives 3 Mastery when Dark Soul is on cd. Dark Soul will be 27 Mastery instead of 30 though.
    Demon Hunting: Gives Dark Apotheosis "tanking" stance and its abilities.
    Demon Training: Gives each pet a minor upgrade. Voidwalker gets 20% more hp is the best one and it is bugged currently.
    Demonic Circle: Reduce Circle cd by 4s.
    Everlasting Affliction: Refreshing Corruption and Doom extends their duration instead of reseting. I need to test this one still.
    Fear: Feared targets no longer run away. Gives Fear a 5s cd.
    Healthstone: Turns Healthstone into a 10s HoT but heals for double.
    Life Tap: Absorbs 15% hp instead of hurting you for 15% of your hp. It stacks and the absorb lasts 30s.
    Shadowflame: Slows 50% instead of 30% but removes the charges from Hand of Gul'dan. Doesn't work yet.
    Siphon Life: Corruption heals for 4% of its damage.
    -Minor
    Carrion Swarm: No longer has knockback.
    Eye of Kilrogg: Eye can fly and drop Demonic Circle, but the Eye is no longer stealthed. Really useful while leveling in a few situations.
    Hand of Gul'dan: Can be targeted with reticle now.
    Health Funnel: Heals 15% of pet's hp. Gives Health Funnel a 10s cd.
    Ritual of Souls: Reduces mana cost by 70%.
    Shadow Bolt: Splits Shadow Bolt into three. Should be good for proc uptimes.



    Demonic Fury (purple rage-like secondary power) does not decay in Dark Apotheosis while in combat.
    Dropping to 0 fury in DA does not take you out of DA.
    Dropping below 40 fury in Meta will take you out of it.
    Leaving a Meta while In Combat holds your fury.
    Leaving DA will take you down to 200f while in combat.
    Demonic Fury decays by roughly 12/2s while in Metamorphosis.
    Out of combat Demonic Fury will refill to 200/1000. This takes about 15s if you are at 0.
    Demonic Fury decays 30sec after combat.
    -There will be a few types of fury situations when starting a boss fight:
    *you are at 200 fury from just idling for 15s
    *you are at 1000 and pulling a boss within 30s of finishing trash


    Pets have 200 Energy. Seems to regen at 10/s.
    They will auto attack until they have enough energy to cast their main attack in addition to enough to use their special attack.
    Example: Felguard will use only auto attack between 0 and 120 energy since 120 gives him enough to be able to Felstorm on command and enough to cast his Legion Strike main attack.
    -If Felstorm has more than 6s left on CD, manually using Legion Strike won't let him sit on that 60 unused energy.

    Succubus's Whiplash and Shivarra's Fellash do less damage than listed on the tooltip. (Bug)

    Doomguard and Wild Imps require a target to summon. They also don't switch by putting BoD on another target or by using Assist Stance or with Petattack command.

    Wild Imp passive gives a buff called Demonic Calling that summons a Wild Imp on next Shadow Bolt cast. You get this buff again 20s after your Shadow Bolt cast started.
    A glyph (Imp Swarm) for Wild Imp's allows you to summon 5 imps on a 2m cd at the cost of 150f. The above Demonic Calling mechanic, is disabled if Imp Swarm is on CD.
    Wild Imps each shoot 10 Firebolts which gain 5f. The will die after 10 casts or 2m.
    -Using the passive is gain of 100f over 2m, but the ability to stack Imp Swarm with Dark Soul. Combining this with being in Meta and getting Molten Core procs seems like it would be much stronger. You still gain Demonic Calling if Imp Swarm is not on CD, so you will be able to get an extra Imp at the begining of a fight still too.

    Grimoire of Service pets use their special ability when summoned (example Axe Toss and Felstorm.)
    Pets aren't scaling HP correctly.
    Pets' melee attacks are at about 20% of what they should be. (Bug)
    Grimoire of Service pets will generate Demonic Fury for the warlock. (Bug)
    -For the current patch, use an Imp because of the melee damage bug.
    -From my testing it seems that this will be the talent choice for max dps, especially considering you can summon them while procs are active. Having a second on demand second silence/purge etc in addition to burst may make this a choice for PVP too.

    Instant Pet Summoning can be done by having your pet die, possibly by reducing his hp by 50% using Sacrificial Pact, and using Demonic Rebirth (passive, 2m cd) to change pets. Summoning a pet while in a demon form is also instant but costs 250 fury (200 for Imp).
    -Swapping as part of an opener or rotation won't be a dps increase unless you use Grimoire of Sacrifice (this may not be the case even here.)

    Soul Leech is probably a good choice since we will be Life Tapping a bit more than in Cata.

    Grimoire of Sacrifice gives 2%hp/5sec and 30% single target damage dmg for 15min. Both of these effects are doubled for the first 15s after using it.
    This currently not killing pets. (Bug)
    -This temp buff could lead to doing a demon summon and sac every time you enter Meta. Though summoning an Imp (the cheapest pet at 200 fury) will most likely give a dps loss. In a fight like Hagara or Spine, standing still and summoning a pet in preparation for a burn phase could be a good idea. I'll need to investigate the numbers a bit more. In general, if pets are doing more than 15% of your damage this talent won't be used.

    Molten Core procs from the debuff (called Shadowflame) applied by Hand of Gul'dan or by hitting a target below 25% hp. MC reduces the cast time and mana/fury cost of Soul Fire by 50%. MC stacks allowing you to build multiple charges.

    Void Twilight (Fel Flame in Meta) is not a targeted spell, it is similar to Shadowflame and you must face the direction you want to aim it.
    -Since it hits all enemies directly in front of you for 40 yards it could potentially be a decent AoE in specific circumstances.

    Hand of Gul'dan has 2 charges and hits the selected target, can be placed with a targeting circle if glyphed, and use once for each charge after every GCD. When it lands it does AoE damage and applies a movement slowing debuff, Shadowflame dot, that can stack to 30/60% as charges hit the target. The new Shadowflame debuff dot generates 2 fury per tick. It seems to tick 7 times over about 6.5s.Unusable in Metamorphosis now.
    -We will most likely start a fight using 1 charge every 6 sec as the debuff falls off and then use a single charge as the the cooldown generates one, we can actually cast about 1s early since it has a placement and travel time.
    -For AoE we might save all 2 up.
    -Since this generates fury it will be best to spread this out on to as many targets as possible.


    Touch of Chaos is the name of the auto attack spell in Meta and Dark Apotheosis. It refreshes Corruption and hits every 1s.
    Tooltip for the spell used in Meta and DA says it has a 20 yard range but it actually only hits in melee range. (Bug)

    Metamorphosis can reach a deadzone where you have enough fury to stay in it but not enough to cast any spells. Corruption and Wild Imps can out pace the fury decay but you wont be able to cast any spells.
    -This could lead to complexities with the rotation and warlocks will need to be prepared to toggle out of Meta to keep their dps from dropping. Even using a fury generating priority, triggering Meta with only 200 is most likely not going to be be optimal, although shifting in and out of Meta to get high Immolation Aura uptime (with many available targets) or some other single spell before falling out could possibly work if handled correctly.

    Demonic Leap no longer does damage and will also carry you in any direction you are currently moving.
    It will sometimes not activate the cooldown if used while jumping straight up while standing still. (Bug)
    It will sometimes reset the cool down if used while falling from a jump straight up while standing still. (Bug)
    It will sometimes take you backwards if used while running forward and jumping and using while in the air. (Bug)

    Fury Table: Much of the testing below is very limited and not all of the columns have been filled out yet. I wanted to see where fury is coming from and how it could be spent. There is also some pet dps info since that relates to potential energy costs and therefore fury generation. I didn't count crits in the case of the Grimoire pets, they can crit, but I haven't determined their crit rate yet so just stripped crits from their damage totals. I was using the Demon Training glyph for these tests (gives Imp 50% cast time reduction.)
    The [D] indicates a demon form version of an ability.
    -Felguard is most likely the best pet to use for Demonology since it does the most damage single target, has the most attacks, and has AoE potential.

    Source
    Spell
    CD
    Energy
    Fury Gain
    Fury Loss
    Notes
    Out of Combat

    10/s
    Metamorphosis

    12/2s
    Imp/Fel Imp Firebolt 40 8

    VW/Voidlord Torment 50 10

    VW/Voidlord Shadow Shield 10 60 0

    Pet must be hit
    Suc/Shivarra Lash of Pain 60 12

    Suc/Shivarra Whiplash 40 0

    Fh/Observer Shadow Bite 60 12

    Fh/Observer Devour Magic 25 0 0

    If spell is purged, pet gains 60 Energy,
    Clone Magic (Observer) could spell steal a dps increasing buff
    Fg/Wrathguard Legion Strike 60 12

    Fg/Wrathguard Persuit 8 0 0

    Weapon damage if target is >8yd away
    Fg/Wrathguard Felstorm 45 60 0

    Infernal 600 0
    Doomguard 600 0
    Grimoire:Imp 120 72
    118k: 9x Firebolt(13.2k)
    Grimoire:Voidwalker 120 70
    71.1k: 1x Suffering (0), 7x Torments(6.5k), 16x melee(1.6k)
    Grimoire:Succubus 120 60

    112k: 1x Whiplash(7k), 5x Lash of Pain (15.8k), 16x melee(1.6k)
    Grimoire:Felhunter 120 72
    69.2k: 1x Spell Lock (0), 5x Shadow Bite(7.8k), 14x melee(1.6k)
    Grimoire:Felguard 120 72
    46.4k: 6x Legion Strike(1.6k), 7x Felstorm(1.6k), 16x melee(1.6k)


    Summon Pet [D]
    250
    Instant pet summon. (Not Imp)
    Summon Imp [D]
    200
    Instant Imp summon.
    Fury Ward [TP] 50+
    50 fury if 1% hp is absorbed, increases by
    (previous cost)*1.5 for each additional
    1% hp prevented.
    Drain Life 0

    Drain Life [D] 0
    30
    Harvest Life 0

    Gain 10 per tick, multiple targets give more fury.
    Harvest Life [D] 0
    30
    Gain 10 per tick, multiple targets give more fury.
    Fel Flame 15
    Void Ray [D]
    40
    Fel Flame turns into this spell while in a demon form.
    Hand of Gul'dan 0,15 12
    10 per tick, 7 ticks over 6.5s
    Chaos Wave [D] 200 Hand of Gul'dan turns into this spell while in a demon form.
    Soulfire 30
    Only use when Molten Core is up
    Soulfire [D]
    50
    Only use when Molten Core is up, can't
    autoattack/Touch of Chaos while casting,
    so actually an oppurtunity cost of 10f more.
    Doom 60
    Corruption 12
    12 per tick, 7 ticks over 20s
    Imp Swarm 60 250 150 5 Fury per Firebolt, 5x Imps, 10x Bolts per Imp
    Shadow Bolt 25

    Demonic Slash [Meta]
    40
    Rain of Fire 0

    Immolation Aura [D]
    250 Hellfire turns into this spell while in a demon form.
    Touch of Chaos [D] 5
    Auto attack. Both in Threatening Presence and Meta.
    Aura of Enfeeblement [D] 100
    Curse of Weakness turns into this spell while in a demon form.
    Aura of the Elements [D] 200 Curse of the Elements turns into this spell while in a demon form.
    Demonic Leap 100 These few utility spells seem to have too high of a cost.
    Demonic Circle: Summon [D] 100 These few utility spells seem to have too high of a cost.
    Demonic Circle: Teleport [D] 100 These few utility spells seem to have too high of a cost.
    Dark Apotheosis 100 Costs 100 to enter form.
    Sleep [D] 60 Fear turns into this spell while in a demon form.
    Last edited by OOMM; 2012-05-09 at 04:41 PM. Reason: started updating info to newest beta patch
    Using computers to make demons kill dragons. OQMM@kt-us.

  2. #2
    Demon damage is interestnig and should be applicable to other specs as well. Even if with lower damage the basic ranking and the % of difference should be the same. Funny that as how things stand now that would make the Voidwalker actually the best Affliction pet.

    I'd love to have Succy back though. I loved having her around in early Cata. "Am I bugging you? I'm not touching you! Am I bugging you? I'm not touching you! There, now you're hot AND bothered" Such a little troll
    Your Soul Shall Suffer! ||| Forum rules ||| New England Patriots

  3. #3
    thanks for taking the time to do this

  4. #4
    Stood in the Fire Queen Ultima's Avatar
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    Very nice and thorough. That deadzone is pretty scary, especially if Demonic Slash will cost us Fury. I know it can only last 3-4 seconds at most, let's hope the autoattack is good enough to make those seconds count, tbh it sounds like Corr ticks will negate this.

    A few questions if you could possibly be so kind:

    1: Both Meta and Presence have an auto attack, while I get that Presence is melee-ranged, is Meta optimal in melee or ranged?

    2: With Grimoire of Service demons providing us with demonic fury, do you think this would lead to an imbalance over Supremecy/Sacrifice?

    3: You say TP doesn't decay Demonic Fury but does this hold true out of combat (thinking for Roleplay scenarios where everyone will RP a demon for the first few months of Pandaria)?

    Thanks for the information

  5. #5
    The Patient OOMM's Avatar
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    1. Meta's autoattack is melee range limited. Autoattack might be the solution to the fury deadzone, it does about 1.5k dmg every second but doesn't seem to be affected by weapon speed. Shadowflame a little further than melee range and Demonic Slash (Shadow Bolt) for Meta isn't restricted to melee range though and we won't use Immolation Aura for single target any longer.
    2. Yes, There is going to be a clear winner for max pve dps. Some gimmick fights might make use of other pets though. I suspect there will be a place for all three talents in that row.
    3. Yes, you can build fury and enter TP then hang out with capped fury. I mention this above as a way to make sure you start a fight with 1000 fury.
    Last edited by OOMM; 2012-04-01 at 10:21 PM.
    Using computers to make demons kill dragons. OQMM@kt-us.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by OOMM View Post
    3. Yes, you can build fury and enter TP then hang out with capped fury. I mention this above as a way to make sure you start a fight with 1000 fury.
    But what about the shared 10s cooldown between the forms that begins when you leave a form ?

    Build up 1k fury tanking trash, drop form 10s before pull ... ?
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    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
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  7. #7
    The Patient OOMM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Count Zero View Post
    But what about the shared 10s cooldown between the forms that begins when you leave a form ?
    Build up 1k fury tanking trash, drop form 10s before pull ... ?
    You can get 1000 fury from dpsing trash,
    drop combat,
    use TP before being out of combat for 30s,
    then hang out while people buff,
    when you feel like you'll pull in under 30sec you can drop TP,
    as long as you don't pull in under 10s from dropping TP you'll be ready to pull with a Meta opener.
    Using computers to make demons kill dragons. OQMM@kt-us.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by OOMM View Post
    You can get 1000 fury from dpsing trash,
    drop combat,
    use TP before being out of combat for 30s,
    then hang out while people buff,
    when you feel like you'll pull in under 30sec you can drop TP,
    as long as you don't pull in under 10s from dropping TP you'll be ready to pull with a Meta opener.
    Ahhh, gotcha. Will be interesting to see how this works when it's live ... I mean, for max dps this seems like it'd be a requirement, pretty much.
    --
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
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  9. #9
    Being at 1000 fury before a pull is a bug that will be completely shutdown before it goes live.

  10. #10
    Learn the difference between bug and skilled play. Death Knights lose runic power passively too, but there are plenty of ways to maintain runic power levels between fights.

    Thanks so much for taking the time to do this, I had intended to but need beta access for that of course. I didn't see Harvest Life listed, did you not spec into that? Someone in another thread mentioned it had a fury cost now. Also does TP wear off if you hit 0 demonic fury (not that you should, but good to know for sure)

  11. #11
    I knew I wasn't going to like this demonic fury crap, it already sounds like a headache

  12. #12
    Yeah, no. Warlocks will not get to keep 1000 DF before a boss pull, unless you literally pull 30 sec after the trash.

  13. #13
    We'll just need to wait and see how Blizzard wants it to go. I personally see no issue with it, as you'll only get the single pull with the 1000 fury anyway

  14. #14
    I don't want to make my guild wait while I build up DF on a trash pull only to be wasted on an attempt where someone forgot to buff cuz we were in combat. No way it goes live as-is.

  15. #15
    The point is that you're not making them wait on anything, you kill the trash as per normal, you get the Demonic Fury, if you wipe and need to restart from 200 Fury, whoopdie-do. This is just like Shadow Orbs, it's nice to start with more than none, but it's not really that big a deal if you don't. The point is that we have no way of knowing if they'll try to put something in place or leave it as is till they either change it or this goes live.

  16. #16
    I think the new talent, Grimoire of Supremacy, might create some problems. I think a lot of warlocks out there will take the talent just because they want new demons. Check it out:

    [snip]
    Last edited by Penguin FTW; 2012-04-02 at 03:10 AM.

  17. #17
    The Patient OOMM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azithrom View Post
    Learn the difference between bug and skilled play. Death Knights lose runic power passively too, but there are plenty of ways to maintain runic power levels between fights.

    Thanks so much for taking the time to do this, I had intended to but need beta access for that of course. I didn't see Harvest Life listed, did you not spec into that? Someone in another thread mentioned it had a fury cost now. Also does TP wear off if you hit 0 demonic fury (not that you should, but good to know for sure)
    I spec into Harvest Life, seems to be the right choice for any AoE fight. It costs 30 Fury per second (same as Drain Life), but seems to generate 10 per tick too. I didn't notice that earlier, so I'm going to have to edit some of my comments above.
    Dark Regeneration would probably be my choice for any fight with random damage on the raid and Soul Leech for any fight with steady AoE damage to the raid.

    TP does not go away at 0. It's a little difficult to get your fury down to 0, but I was able to and stayed in TP.

    As far as holding 1000 fury goes, it doesn't seem to be a bug. It may very well be something that will be changed, but everything seems to indicate that it is working as intended. TP doesn't have fury decay, Meta does. If they add the Out of Combat decay that happens outside of Meta, that would change things. I wouldn't mind if that happened. I'm the kind of player that does every little thing I can to maximize dps, and it would just annoy me to have that power on a fresh pull but feel gimped after wiping on progression. It's the same problem with Doomguard being on a 10min cd (I've read that DG resets on raid wipe now though), it's not fun to feel like you are at partial power at times just because of the design of your class.
    Using computers to make demons kill dragons. OQMM@kt-us.

  18. #18
    Demonic Fury decays by roughly 12/3s while in Metamorphosis.
    It's 6/s. It even says so in the tooltip. So you need some haste for Corruption to negate this cost, though Touch of Chaos will also generate 5/s in melee at 0 haste.

    Touch of Chaos replaces your normal weapon the same way druid forms do. It has a 1.0 weapon speed.

    Also, it seems that Touch of Chaos is bugged. The tooltip says it has 20y range, but it won't work beyond melee.

  19. #19
    The Patient OOMM's Avatar
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    I don't think 6/s is accurate, at the least it isn't updating every second. I tried timing it and that's result I got as best as I could determine it. I've taken further attempts since to be more precise and I think it's actually 12/2s.
    Using computers to make demons kill dragons. OQMM@kt-us.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by OOMM View Post
    I spec into Harvest Life, seems to be the right choice for any AoE fight. It costs 30 Fury per second (same as Drain Life), but seems to generate 10 per tick too. I didn't notice that earlier, so I'm going to have to edit some of my comments above.
    Dark Regeneration would probably be my choice for any fight with random damage on the raid and Soul Leech for any fight with steady AoE damage to the raid.

    TP does not go away at 0. It's a little difficult to get your fury down to 0, but I was able to and stayed in TP..
    Much appreciated, these things will be great to know for soloing and planning raid backup actions

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